[Withano]

Originally Posted by Vicky.

There are differences in average female and male brains. There is no such thing as a male or female brain though, and most people cross over. Hell, black cab drivers have 'different' brains to the rest of the population simply because of their jobs. Brains are plastic, and there have never beern any studies to prove this 'female brain in a male body' or anything. Ever. And I am fairly sure with the amount of cash thrown at this, if there was any proof, it would be shouted from the rooftops.

Transabled people have Body integrity identity disorder...which does show on brain scans. As...brains are plastic. So lived experiences will often show up. If a person convinces themselves a limb does not belong to them, the brain will adapt.

https://www.newscientist.com/article...n-brain-scans/

Trans is IMO, an extension of BIID. And similar to anorexia too (which also shows up in brain scans)

I agree with no 'entirely male brain' but when a boy has a typical female brain, and when that can be seen on scanners, and when a parent would deny the child a drug that would stop that female turning into an adult male, its a bit.... wrong? Cruel? Dumb? Outdated? Especially if the child, or teen can verbally express that they know their gender, and this can be backed up.

I'll give your transabled link a read a little later on.. the main theory about that transracial woman is her link to her traumatic childhood.. details are hazy.. but I think her Uncle or father used to make her eat her own vomit, and researchers concluded that she may have wanted to identify as a race that were also poorly treated for that reason. I suppose it could be similar for transabled people? I dont think theres enough history on either topic for anyone to make conclusions.. unlike transgender, thats getting pretty solid now..

[Vicky.]

Originally Posted by Withano

I agree with no 'entirely male brain' but when a boy has a typical female brain, and when that can be seen on scanners, and when a parent would deny the child a drug that would stop that female turning into an adult male, its a bit.... wrong? Cruel? Dumb? Outdated? Especially if the child, or teen can verbally express that they know their gender, and this can be backed up.

I'll give your transabled link a read a little later on.. the main theory about that transracial woman is her link to her traumatic childhood.. details are hazy.. but I think her Uncle or father used to make her eat her own vomit, and researchers concluded that she may have wanted to identify as a race that were also poorly treated for that reason. I suppose it could be similar for transabled people? I dont think theres enough history on either topic for anyone to make conclusions.. unlike transgender, thats getting pretty solid now..

Well interestingly enough, there are strong links between transsexual people and autism too. And a LOT of trans people (especially FtM) have been sexually assaulted or raped aswell.

Its all quite fascinating, and I didn't really know anything about any of it until a year or so ago. I just think sticking kids on puberty blockers is really wrong, especially when most kids will grow out of it. When if they are put on blockers, they do NOT grow out of it. And that most who DO grow out of it are just gay as adults. So I do see it as modern day euginics and am quite puzzled how there seems to be such widespread support for it :S Yes it will be stressful for a kids to go through 'the wrong' puberty if it does turn out they were trans all along. It is equally stressful for a kid to reach adulthood and realise that they were just gay all along and now be stuck with a body that mimics the opposite sex and lifelong medical issues

There was a doctor done not long ago for prescribing hormones and such over the internet ffs. There is also an organisation called mermaids, who the NHS send parents of gender questioning kids to. This organisation pressures parents into transitioning their kids by telling them that nearly all trans kids try to kill themselves and so on, and encourage parents to buy offlabel drugs for when the Tavistock is 'taking too long' to treat. Its all a huge ****storm that will come to a head soon.

[Withano]

Originally Posted by Vicky.

equally stressful for a kid to reach adulthood and realise that they were just gay all along and now be stuck with a body that mimics the opposite sex and lifelong medical issues

I think this is the reason for our difference in opinion maybe?
I presume a blocker would stop puberty from going either way, and puberty would commence once more when the blocker isn't being taken. A gay man who took the pill for a day, a week, or a year would can stop taking the pill and resume his male puberty cycle, whereas a female in a mans body who is confident after the 5(?) years they have to be sure of their gender * can start the mtf process without an adams apple or a deep voice.

* I think thats the rule, your, I, or any teen who has an epiphany today can't change our sex any time soon, theres a lengthy procedure.. 5 years sounds familiar.

I would also be against a drug that starts the transistion period from an early age.. i dont think that is what this is.

[Vicky.]

Originally Posted by Withano

I think this is the reason for our difference in opinion maybe?
I presume a blocker would stop puberty from going either way, and puberty would commence once more when the blocker isn't being taken. A gay man who took the pill for a day, a week, or a year would can stop taking the pill and resume his male puberty cycle, whereas a female in a mans body who is confident after the 5(?) years they have to be sure of their gender * can start the mtf process without an adams apple or a deep voice.

* I think thats the rule, your, I, or any teen who has an epiphany today can't change our sex any time soon, theres a lengthy procedure.. 5 years sounds familiar.

Yes, in theory. However all (or nearly all) children who are on blockers go onto cross sex hormones. Now, I don't know why this is but can take a guess, huge brain changes occur in puberty. Blocking these changes will effectively keep you in the mindset that you were when puberty was supposed to occur. So you are not going to have a 'change of heart' as your brain will not have the maturity that it needs to make such a decision.

Where when just left alone to develop at their own rate, 80% (or more, depending on the study) of these children who were 'gender questioning' just grow out of it during/after puberty.

So yeah, in theory it sounds a decent idea, in practice most certainly not.

The only study done into this proves that blockers whilst technically reversible, are not in practice. Any further thought of studies have been shouted down by transactivists. As has research into 'detransitioners'. You have to wonder why this is...surely more understanding is best for everyone, right?

[Withano]

Originally Posted by Vicky.

Yes, in theory. However all (or nearly all) children who are on blockers go onto cross sex hormones. Now, I don't know why this is but can take a guess, huge brain changes occur in puberty. Blocking these changes will effectively keep you in the mindset that you were when puberty was supposed to occur. So you are not going to have a 'change of heart' as your brain will not have the maturity that it needs to make such a decision.

Where when just left alone to develop at their own rate, 80% (or more, depending on the study) of these children who were 'gender questioning' just grow out of it during/after puberty.

So yeah, in theory it sounds a decent idea, in practice most certainly not.

I suppose that could begin to explain why some researchers believe there are like 70+ genders. I guess gender-questioning could mean knowing that you're not male, assuming you must be female, but then realising you're one of the other 70 odd genders that I don't fully understand. Like bi-gender or agender etc.
But I think we're on the right track with this drug. The cross hormones might not be causal, they could have easily already been there. The drug could also be perfected in the future.. The more cases will just expand our knowledge on the area, and perhaps in 50 years times this sorta thing could be evaluated in a more effective way.
Terminating the use of a drug that can clearly be incredible useful isn't the answer.

[Vicky.]

Originally Posted by Withano

I suppose that could begin to explain why some researchers believe there are like 70+ genders. I guess gender-questioning could mean knowing that you're not male, assuming you must be female, but then realising you're one of the other 70 odd genders that I don't fully understand. Like bi-gender or agender etc.
But I think we're on the right track with this drug. The cross hormones might not be causal, they could have easily already been there. The drug could also be perfected in the future.. The more cases will just expand our knowledge on the area, and perhaps in 50 years times this sorta thing could be evaluated in a more effective way.
Terminating the use of a drug that can clearly be incredible useful isn't the answer.

But in the meantime, 80% of children put onto the drug, don't need to be on it? So effectively we are treating (and medicalising for life) 4 out of every 5 people put on it, when they don't need to be treat that way! Thats mental, surely...
https://www.nwhn.org/lupron-what-doe...womens-health/

Lupron causes significant safety concerns aswell...if it really worth it, so that 1/5 of the people who take it can look a little more feminine/masculine as an adult?!

https://www.statnews.com/2017/02/02/...alth-problems/

[Withano]

Originally Posted by Vicky.

But in the meantime, 80% of children put onto the drug, don't need to be on it? So effectively we are treating (and medicalising for life) 4 out of every 5 people put on it, when they don't need to be treat that way! Thats mental, surely...
https://www.nwhn.org/lupron-what-doe...womens-health/

Lupron causes significant safety concerns aswell...if it really worth it, so that 1/5 of the people who take it can look a little more feminine/masculine as an adult?!

https://www.statnews.com/2017/02/02/...alth-problems/

I guess at this point it would just be a game of swap the link..for every article there is on the dangers of the drug, there's an article that claims that all effects are completely reversible.