[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by Z

I'm getting increasingly pissed off reading government babble like "we need to come up with a strategy to counter radicalisation and understand how people come to be radicalised" (paraphrasing) - 1) idiots are as old as time itself 2) the internet is still in the Wild West stage 3) no army can stop an idea 4) the Middle East is going through what Catholics and Protestants went through several centuries ago in Western Europe 5) there's no such thing as a 'strategy' against people going somewhere of their own accord.

These women chose to go there. Perhaps they don't quite understand what they're getting themselves into, or perhaps they completely understand. It doesn't really matter why they went - they took their children with them and it's unlikely all (or any) of them will be found alive. Sons will become soldiers and daughters will become wives/slaves. The ISIS movement is a bright light in a dark room and the people fluttering towards it are moths who don't understand why they're being fried when they land.

The only thing that the government can do is to close our borders to anyone who makes the decision to go there and make it clear that if you go, you're not coming back at all. Scare tactics are the only thing that will stop people from going. It's hard to know whether these women are victims or criminals, it's a very morally grey area. We don't know their motivations. Perhaps they were lied to or perhaps they fervently agree with the message being spread.

I'm not sure anyone knows what's going on anymore, a few years ago it was said it was foreign policy and the war which everyone in the west was 100% for (:/) but those radicalised here know we didn't want it.
They're desecrating their own history as we did, that's an idea that still rumbles on today.
It could be the romanticised image of a motherland', a desire to help relatives, misinformation and lies, social and or religious manipulation.
The same tactics are used to get kids to join our army so it figures it will work to employ the same tactics.

[arista]

Originally Posted by Z

I'm getting increasingly pissed off reading government babble like "we need to come up with a strategy to counter radicalisation and understand how people come to be radicalised" (paraphrasing) - 1) idiots are as old as time itself 2) the internet is still in the Wild West stage 3) no army can stop an idea 4) the Middle East is going through what Catholics and Protestants went through several centuries ago in Western Europe 5) there's no such thing as a 'strategy' against people going somewhere of their own accord.

These women chose to go there. Perhaps they don't quite understand what they're getting themselves into, or perhaps they completely understand. It doesn't really matter why they went - they took their children with them and it's unlikely all (or any) of them will be found alive. Sons will become soldiers and daughters will become wives/slaves. The ISIS movement is a bright light in a dark room and the people fluttering towards it are moths who don't understand why they're being fried when they land.

The only thing that the government can do is to close our borders to anyone who makes the decision to go there and make it clear that if you go, you're not coming back at all. Scare tactics are the only thing that will stop people from going. It's hard to know whether these women are victims or criminals, it's a very morally grey area. We don't know their motivations. Perhaps they were lied to or perhaps they fervently agree with the message being spread.

Yes but thats normal
the problem with the amount of Muslims
on this trip to hell
is the underage kids

[Livia]

The same tactics that ISIS use are used to get people to join the BRITISH Army?

That's the most ridiculous thing I've read on here for ages.

[user104658]

Originally Posted by Livia

The same tactics that ISIS use are used to get people to join the BRITISH Army?

That's the most ridiculous thing I've read on here for ages.

"The same" as in identical tactics aren't used, but it would be incorrect to say that there are no similarities. Even moreso in the US. Patriotism, ideology, "protecting our way of life", and of course the Big Guy in the Sky are utilized pretty heavily in military recruitment. Is it all that different? Pointing out that the recruitment tactics are similar isn't the same as saying that the "end game" is the same.

Then again, in recent years in the UK the main tactic has been to promote it as an opportunity for self-development (you will learn X,Y,Z, you will travel the world, you will experience blah you will become blah blah blah), which I suppose pretty accurately reflects our culture.

[Livia]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

"The same" as in identical tactics aren't used, but it would be incorrect to say that there are no similarities. Even moreso in the US. Patriotism, ideology, "protecting our way of life", and of course the Big Guy in the Sky are utilized pretty heavily in military recruitment. Is it all that different? Pointing out that the recruitment tactics are similar isn't the same as saying that the "end game" is the same.

Then again, in recent years in the UK the main tactic has been to promote it as an opportunity for self-development (you will learn X,Y,Z, you will travel the world, you will experience blah you will become blah blah blah), which I suppose pretty accurately reflects our culture.

Please... You insult our armed forces by comparing them to ISIS. And really, it's evident that you know nothing about the British Army. The most recent adverts for the services have been lighting their humanitarian and peacekeeping work, and yes, you can learn a bloody useful trade while you're serving. I don't ever remember God being used in army recruiting.

My grandfather, my father and my husband served and to liken their recruitment to being recruited to ISIS is baiting, as far as I'm concerned. More than that, it's laughable.

[user104658]

Originally Posted by Livia

Please... You insult our armed forces by comparing them to ISIS. And really, it's evident that you know nothing about the British Army. The most recent adverts for the services have been lighting their humanitarian and peacekeeping work, and yes, you can learn a bloody useful trade while you're serving. I don't ever remember God being used in army recruiting.

My grandfather, my father and my husband served and to liken their recruitment to being recruited to ISIS is baiting, as far as I'm concerned. More than that, it's laughable.

You can compare and contrast anything to anything, surely? I did also point out that the patriotism / Jebus aspects are utilized more in US recruitment than UK. Might not be the official line but they are definitely there and frankly it's laughable to insist that there are NO similarities. People who join any armed force (be that a terrorist organisation or a Western army) for ideological reasons do so because there is an ideology to be upheld that they believe in and want to protect and / or further. That is a similarity? Pointing that out is completely neutral to whether the ideology being furthered / protected is good or toxic. Also, the fact that the topic happens to be a very personal one for you does not automatically make a contrary opinion on that topic "baiting".

It's a divisive topic... and, whilst I appreciate that the reasons for joining up are many and varied, I happen to think that many young people (teenagers, practically children) ARE tempted into the Army with ideologies that many of them are not old enough nor wise enough to fully understand or to have forged their own opinions on yet. It would also be 100% false to say that no one joins the army and then later regrets their decision for ideological reasons.

[Livia]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

You can compare and contrast anything to anything, surely? I did also point out that the patriotism / Jebus aspects are utilized more in US recruitment than UK. Might not be the official line but they are definitely there and frankly it's laughable to insist that there are NO similarities. People who join any armed force (be that a terrorist organisation or a Western army) for ideological reasons do so because there is an ideology to be upheld that they believe in and want to protect and / or further. That is a similarity? Pointing that out is completely neutral to whether the ideology being furthered / protected is good or toxic. Also, the fact that the topic happens to be a very personal one for you does not automatically make a contrary opinion on that topic "baiting".

It's a divisive topic... and, whilst I appreciate that the reasons for joining up are many and varied, I happen to think that many young people (teenagers, practically children) ARE tempted into the Army with ideologies that many of them are not old enough nor wise enough to fully understand or to have forged their own opinions on yet. It would also be 100% false to say that no one joins the army and then later regrets their decision for ideological reasons.

The fact is that they don't have to tempt too hard TS. They don't take just anyone. You have to have good grades and you have to be hard working and law abiding. And no one is forced to stay in the army.

I don't want to talk about this. It's far too emotional and emotive to discuss the conjecture that the British Army shares anything with terrorists.

[Vicky.]

Poor kids. Dont give a crap about the mothers, their choice to go and be murdered or mistreated. Don't force **** like that on your children you evil bastards.

[arista]

Originally Posted by Vicky.

Poor kids. Dont give a crap about the mothers, their choice to go and be murdered or mistreated. Don't force **** like that on your children you evil bastards.

Yes a 3 year old girl with them



Evil