[Livia]

Originally Posted by Vicky.

The problem I see with a referendum (besides not knowing how I would even vote ) is that I think people who think 'grrr immigrants taking our jobs' and such would be much more likely to go and vote than people who don't really care much either way, or even those who would rather stay. The rags have done a fantastic job of whipping people into a frenzy about immigration...

Immigration and how much it costs us to stay in the EU seem to be all anyone talks about. They don't talk about the perks, such as loads more rights for workers and stuff.

I think it's the job of the pro-Europe lobby to get the facts out about the question of open borders. It's the job of both lobbies to give people the information they need, and I really do believe it's something that people will think seriously about because it's such an important question. But I do think people have a right to choose. People haven't been asked about this since we joined Europe, and it's a very different animal now to what it was then.

[Vicky.]

Originally Posted by Livia

I think it's the job of the pro-Europe lobby to get the facts out about the question of open borders. It's the job of both lobbies to give people the information they need, and I really do believe it's something that people will think seriously about because it's such an important question. But I do think people have a right to choose. People haven't been asked about this since we joined Europe, and it's a very different animal now to what it was then.

I definitely agree with that.

Its harder to get a positive message out there though, because unfortunately stories about how the EU actually helps us are unlikely to sell as many papers or raise as much interest as a headline about Ajan Aboogala who arrived here a month ago, was given a 20 bed mansion on arrival and now claims £1267 per week in benefits for himself and his 62 children who live back in Slovakia or something

[MTVN]

I think that if there had been a referendum pre-2007 you'd have a strong majority wanting to stay in and most the media supporting staying in as well, if the majority of the press is now anti-EU it's with pretty good reason considering how much their credibility has been destroyed in the Eurozone crisis. In the same way there used to be reasonably strong support for the UK to adopt the euro but even the biggest Europhile would be reluctant to express that view now because it's generally accepted the last few years have proven them wrong and they've lost the argument

I still think a majority would vote to remain in the EU because you'd have all three main parties campaigning for it and ultimately people would consider it safer to remain involved and able to exert our influence in how it's run. But there are perfectly valid arguments for leaving that too often get presented as right wing propaganda and scaremongering

[Livia]

Great post MTVN, agree with all of that.