[GiRTh]

Originally Posted by wannashag

Is James Bond race neutral?

Because I hear Idris Elba is being considered.

If Idris get the role then he would be one of the best actors to have ever played the part. Should we rule him out just because he doesn't fit into the characters ethnicity even though he's a superior actor?

[Alf]

Originally Posted by GiRTh

If Idris get the role then he would be one of the best actors to have ever played the part. Should we rule him out just because he doesn't fit into the characters ethnicity even though he's a superior actor?

No one will ever top Sir Roger as Bond.

So you believe a White actor should have been considered for the role of Nelson Mandella? That's what the second part of your statement says to me?

[GiRTh]

Originally Posted by wannashag

No one will ever top Sir Roger as Bond.

So you believe a White actor should have been considered for the role of Nelson Mandella? That's what the second part of your statement says to me?

Nelson Mandela is not a fictional character.

[Alf]

Originally Posted by GiRTh

Nelson Mandela is not a fictional character.

You didn't say fictional.

[Niamh.]

Originally Posted by wannashag

No one will ever top Sir Roger as Bond.

So you believe a White actor should have been considered for the role of Nelson Mandella? That's what the second part of your statement says to me?

Don't be silly, Nelson Mandela is a real historic figure, James Bond is not, him being white isn't vital to the story

[Ammi]

Originally Posted by wannashag

No one will ever top Sir Roger as Bond.

So you believe a White actor should have been considered for the role of Nelson Mandella? That's what the second part of your statement says to me?

..there is a huge difference though wanna, with a fictional character and someone in real life...

[Ammi]

..oh, must type quicker...I know it was just a one off character..(unless there are sequels..)...but Denzel recently played the lead in The Equalizer..I hadn't actually realised that it was based on the old series but that character was white in the series and Denzel stepped into the role beautifully, without any thought really other than to his acting...(it was a bit naff and corny I have to say/the movie but you know what I mean..)..

[Livia]

Originally Posted by Niamh.

why would she? sounds to me like she just wasn't bothered whether Hermoine was played by a black or a white actress?

The books have been out for twenty years or so and read by millions and millions of people who've had a picture of Hermione in their heads. The films came out... Hermione was white. Had she been black originally, had Rowling made it clear she was black, no one would have a problem with it. But you can't suddenly change a white character to a black character for no reason at all. And the most annoying thing is, if someone has a problem with a white character being changed to a black character overnight, they're made out of be some kind of racist. (Not by you, Niamh... I'm speaking generally).

Originally Posted by Niamh.

Is he Scottish or Irish or English in the books?

We're talking race here, not nationality.

Originally Posted by GiRTh

If Idris get the role then he would be one of the best actors to have ever played the part. Should we rule him out just because he doesn't fit into the characters ethnicity even though he's a superior actor?

Yes we should.

I love Idris... I met him on Monday, he was charming. But he isn't Bond. How would you feel about a white actor playing Shaft?

[Niamh.]

Originally Posted by Livia

The books have been out for twenty years or so and read by millions and millions of people who've had a picture of Hermione in their heads. The films came out... Hermione was white. Had she been black originally, had Rowling made it clear she was black, no one would have a problem with it. But you can't suddenly change a white character to a black character for no reason at all. And the most annoying thing is, if someone has a problem with a white character being changed to a black character overnight, they're made out of be some kind of racist. (Not by you, Niamh... I'm speaking generally).



We're talking race here, not nationality.




Yes we should.

I love Idris... I met him on Monday, he was charming. But he isn't Bond. How would you feel about a white actor playing Shaft?

Why is race so much more of an issue than nationality is? You're either sticking rigidly to his description or you're not :/


Re Hermoine: again what's the big deal? Characters when transferred to film are often very different from their description in the book, like the Divergent series, one of the characters is described as being 5'8" in the book, the actress who played her was 5'2", why is race a much bigger issue to height or nationality when it's not really important to the story?

[Mokka]

Originally Posted by Livia

The books have been out for twenty years or so and read by millions and millions of people who've had a picture of Hermione in their heads. The films came out... Hermione was white. Had she been black originally, had Rowling made it clear she was black, no one would have a problem with it. But you can't suddenly change a white character to a black character for no reason at all. And the most annoying thing is, if someone has a problem with a white character being changed to a black character overnight, they're made out of be some kind of racist. (Not by you, Niamh... I'm speaking generally).



We're talking race here, not nationality.




Yes we should.

I love Idris... I met him on Monday, he was charming. But he isn't Bond. How would you feel about a white actor playing Shaft?

Outside of the movies... why would you assume that Hermione is white?? Why should a writer have to portray any character with a specific skin colour?? That really reduces the chances of people all over the world finding relating qualities to that character.
And I think the real question here is, why would it be a bad thing to thing of her as having a different race... The colour of a person should not be such a divisive issue... and people who do get upset over it, you have to question why it is that they see skin colour as a negative, or why they see skin colour at all.

And again, why would bond have to be white to be bond?? I really am at a loss to understand your logic here.

[Marsh.]

Originally Posted by Livia

The books have been out for twenty years or so and read by millions and millions of people who've had a picture of Hermione in their heads. The films came out... Hermione was white. Had she been black originally, had Rowling made it clear she was black, no one would have a problem with it. But you can't suddenly change a white character to a black character for no reason at all. And the most annoying thing is, if someone has a problem with a white character being changed to a black character overnight, they're made out of be some kind of racist. (Not by you, Niamh... I'm speaking generally).

The theatre has colour blind casting literally ALL the time.

The same character is often played by both white and black actors sharing the role on a tour etc.

It's a different art form to a movie. Just as the movies for HP were largely different to the books. Different mediums.

I think the point Rowling made was that it didn't need to be made "clear" whether she was black and white anyway because it really doesn't matter.

I don't think the "pictures in their heads" whilst reading the books is at all relevant. 90% of the Harry Potter books I imagined whilst reading them didn't match up to what the film visualised. They're different mediums.

There are hundreds of various book covers that depict Harry Potter as a vastly different looking character, all of which look nothing like Daniel Radcliffe, or the guy about to play him in the theatre show. I don't think skin colour is any different to that to be honest.

[GiRTh]

Originally Posted by Livia

Yes we should.

I love Idris... I met him on Monday, he was charming. But he isn't Bond. How would you feel about a white actor playing Shaft?

If he was a good enough actor and the part was well written I would have no problem with it.

So are you saying Idris isn't Bond simply due to his ethnicity? The quality of his acting doesn't matter, his experience doesn't matter, he's wrong due simply to his ethnicity? Even though all the novels have been adapted and the films being produced are brand new stories, we still cant veer far from the novels description of Bond? I hope the Broccoli family say 'stuff that' and give the job to the best actor available.

[Livia]

Originally Posted by GiRTh

If he was a good enough actor and the part was well written I would have no problem with it.

So are you saying Idris isn't Bond simply due to his ethnicity? The quality of his acting doesn't matter, his experience doesn't matter, he's wrong due simply to his ethnicity? Even though all the novels have been adapted and the films being produced are brand new stories, we still cant veer far from the novels description of Bond? I hope the Broccoli family say 'stuff that' and give the job to the best actor available.

Yes, I am saying Idris would not be a good Bond simply on his ethnicity.

Have you read the books? Have you seen the situations Bond got himself into? No way would a black man be able to melt into the background like a white man could in certain situations. It has to at least be believable.

And as much as I love Idris, and think he's wonderful as Luthur (Who could equally have been played by a black or a white actor) I think he would be an awful Bond. If a black Bond was inevitable I'd rather Colin Salmon who is much more Bond-esque, in my opinion.

[GiRTh]

Originally Posted by Livia

Yes we should.

I love Idris... I met him on Monday, he was charming. But he isn't Bond. How would you feel about a white actor playing Shaft?

Did you tell him he was unsuitable to play Bond I would have loved to hear his response?

[Alf]

Ok do you think a White actor should have been considered for the lead role in Boyz and the Hood?

[GiRTh]

Originally Posted by wannashag

Ok do you think a White actor should have been considered for the lead role in Boyz and the Hood?

If he was good enough and could carry the part then yes. I would have no problem with it.

[Ammi]

Originally Posted by wannashag

Ok do you think a White actor should have been considered for the lead role in Boyz and the Hood?

..not when it's about something with a predominantly black population but that's it though isn't it...black actors seem to mainly get parts which would be specific to that..not so much the 'neutral' parts....

[Niamh.]

Originally Posted by wannashag

Ok do you think a White actor should have been considered for the lead role in Boyz and the Hood?

Been along time since I watched that movie but isn't Boyz n the hood specifically about racial issues? That would be like saying a black guy could play Edward Nortons character in American History X............clearly not. However could a white guy play Will Smiths part in I Am Legend? Absolutely

[Alf]

silly me calling it Boyz And the hood, you know I mean n


I am a first class turd sometimes.

[Ammi]

Originally Posted by wannashag

silly me calling it Boyz And the hood, you know I mean n


I am a first class turd sometimes.

......yeah well we didn't like to say/awkward moment passed...

[Niamh.]

Originally Posted by wannashag

silly me calling it Boyz And the hood, you know I mean n


I am a first class turd sometimes.

Is that a dig at me? :/ I knew what you meant, I never said otherwise

[Alf]

Originally Posted by Niamh.

Is that a dig at me? :/ I knew what you meant, I never said otherwise

Would I ever have a dig at fine classy lady as yourself?

I'm a gentlemen.

[Niamh.]

Originally Posted by wannashag

Would I ever have a dig at fine classy lady as yourself?

I'm a gentlemen.

I hope not I wasn't correcting you, I didn't even notice you'd typed "and" instead of "n" until after you pointed it out

[Ammi]

..it's the 'neutral'/makes no difference roles really, because it's always been said by actors/actresses that just being nominated for an Oscar leads to more offers of roles etc and much better ones, even if they didn't win..I guess that an example could be Eddie Redmayne..(I just thought of him because I was having a conversation with Liv about The Danish Girl just now..)...anyway his character, Stephen Hawking couldn't be more different to his character in The Danish Girl, that happens with white actors doesn't it...the diversity of their roles..?...and being nominated for Oscars obviously help a lot for them individually ...but with black actors..?...do they get the same diversity of 'neutral roles...or so they have to wait for something that only a black actor/actress could do because of the character/like Nelson Mandela which was mentioned...?...someone who has to be black/no question....

[Northern Monkey]

Originally Posted by Ammi

..it's the 'neutral'/makes no difference roles really, because it's always been said by actors/actresses that just being nominated for an Oscar leads to more offers of roles etc and much better ones, even if they didn't win..I guess that an example could be Eddie Redmayne..(I just thought of him because I was having a conversation with Liv about The Danish Girl just now..)...anyway his character, Stephen Hawking couldn't be more different to his character in The Danish Girl, that happens with white actors doesn't it...the diversity of their roles..?...and being nominated for Oscars obviously help a lot for them individually ...but with black actors..?...do they get the same diversity of 'neutral roles...or so they have to wait for something that only a black actor/actress could do because of the character/like Nelson Mandela which was mentioned...?...someone who has to be black/no question....

Maybe they should have had a black Stephen Hawking?