[JerseyWins]

Originally Posted by Marsh.

First of all, I'M not looking for anything. You are the one making the claims and it's down to you to back them up.

Yes, people react differently to anything in life. Just as ANYTHING can be a trigger to someone suffering with anxiety or any other mental illness.

That doesn't support your stance that is against uniforms as they "could form part of a trigger for an already ill person" as ANYTHING can form a trigger for them, and not all of them will be at all bothered by a uniform. There is no DIRECT correlation for it to be used as a reason to not have school uniforms.

Is it that complex? Well actually yes, which is why your argument doesn't work.

But, again, uniforms are the norm over here. You're from America aren't you? I imagine the norm is the opposite.

So you agree that uniforms can have a psychological effect that triggers a person’s anxiety/depression but not how it could do the same for someone in a normal psychological state as well? Everyone is not exactly the same psychologically sound. In your mind if someone finds any of the psychological problems with uniforms, it only means they have some kind of anxiety or condition that it’s triggering? Even so if it’s only a potential issue for someone with anxiety why have we implemented something that still CAN effect these kids negatively, for something that is not an actual benefit for the education of a child. Which I will argue why it’s not a benefit if given reasons, which there now actually are some presented

And yes I believe freedom principles, for kids or otherwise, are a lot more common, widespread & adamant about around here in the US so it could just be differing mindsets within different countries. (Not everyone is against uniforms here though but it’s a lot more common than I see in this thread and typically the uniforms are a private school thing, not public schools)

Originally Posted by AnnieK

I can't believe this has got so deep.

Uniforms do as the name suggests, provide uniformity to kids at school. It also provides them with a "school identity". Jersey - I'm not sure what its like where you are in the States but where I am right now within a 3 mile radius we have 3 high schools, the uniform also helps to distinguish which school they are from for a variety of reasons including identifying truancy (although they are more likely not to be in uniform), being able to identify any safeguarding issues (if they are out of school when they should be in etc), any kids causing trouble can be reported to schools etc etc.

Kids here are used to wearing uniforms - until I read this thread, I didn't think anyone thought it was a big issue. Kids in the UK, when they get to High School pretty much accept there is a uniform, I can't see it changing and the nightmare that "non-uniform" days used to cause when I was at school made me dread them

Most of these potential benefits come after school, where they would be able to dress freely, adjust their uniforms (where it could not be recognizable), put a coat over, etc.
There are also security measures to prevent kids from leaving schools, including usually at least one cop by one of the exits (not every school but more & more safety measures are taken here especially with shootings), cameras, and traffic workers/flaggers which would raise a red flag if any kid is away during school hours

As for identity, it gives identity for the school but not individual students, they all start to blend in more and laziness in identifying which students actually belong to the school may develop because you’re just looking for the uniforms. An intruder can easily blend in with the group just by knowing the uniform policy for the school and teachers & supervisors are always keyed in on the uniforms, not the faces and identities that belong to the school.

Re: Cherie’s post (I assume Kaz quoted it from pages back as I can’t find the post to quote it )

- Easier/quicker in the morning... what happens when part of the uniform is misplaced in the morning? Uniform(s) being prepared for the wash accidentally forgotten about? Hell, these uniforms in plenty cases require more articles of clothing than the typical wardrobe. Is it really saving much difference-making time overall and is there not also a downside that loses time?
- Students learn about what formal dressing is in school and when it should be used. They don’t need to be forced into what to wear as kids in school in order to learn that. There is no directly positive form of disciplining with full wardrobe guidelines as there would be for punishment for misbehaving, etc. I believe in disciplining in ways that improve a person. I learned about correct formal dressing quite easily while having total freedom as a kid in school (of course with dress code boundaries, which is normal and more along the lines of conduct that is actually used in businesses for adults)
- It does seem to save money for parents in most cases, a bit of a benefit for them which I just about fully agree there (not all cases but it’s a fair point) and said myself as well

Again, being from America it may be a difference of opinion here but to me and many Americans’ beliefs, there should be some kind of very quality, progressive benefit to limit one’s freedom in ANY way, as major or minor as it is. Does it actually improve a student’s learning, atmosphere, etc.? When you look more carefully at uniforms’ supposed “benefits” I don’t believe it does.