[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

I'm not an expert at all, it just doesn't take much reading to find out that the VAST majority of actual experts would never recommend extreme dieting unless absolutely medically necessary, under the care and direction of a physician.

But of course, the UK is sick of experts, and I guess that extends to the ones who are saying such dumb things as "eating normally and healthily is better than purging your system of essential nutrients with juice fasting".

Which is what we should be calling it by the way; juice fasting. It is a form of fasting. It doesn't "cleanse" anything.

Have you any idea how ignorant this sounds? I have explained I was deficient nutritionally, full of inflammation and pre diabetic. I decided to flood my system with nutrient dense juice and your response is I'm 'purging' my system of 'essential' nutrients... which are those then?

As your research is so much more superior to mine and aligned with every expert in the world then well done you

[user104658]

Originally Posted by Kizzy

Have you any idea how ignorant this sounds? I have explained I was deficient nutritionally, full of inflammation and pre diabetic. I decided to flood my system with nutrient dense juice and your response is I'm 'purging' my system of 'essential' nutrients... which are those then?

As your research is so much more superior to mine and aligned with every expert in the world then well done you

All-liquid diets have a much faster digestive transit which means your body literally doesn't have time to process the nutrients that are there. I'm not even saying that the juice is bad or not rich in nutrients - I love a nice green juice - but it would be much more sensible to be having at least one small solid meal with wholegrains (unless gluten intolerant), fruit and veg and lean proteins.

Nutrient wise, unless your juicing contains more than fruit & veg I can basically guarantee that it's deficient in amino acids and proteins, and no matter what you argue, solid fibre is essential to gut health and digestive transit.

If the juice diet was nutritionally complete, you would be able to do it indefinitely. If you tried to do it for 3+ months you'd end up very ill and to be blunt, if you tried to do it for 6+ months you would die.

Any diet that you can't carry on indefinitely is a crash diet and there's very little real evidence that any form of crash diet is a net benefit for the human body... and spades of evidence that it can be damaging.

What reason can you really give for juice cleansing for a month before re-introducing solids after a month (because if you didn't you'd die) over and above simply overhauling your diet with clean whole food? The idea seems to be that it "gets rid of cravings" for high energy foods like sugars and fats, and thus makes it easier to stick to a better diet afterwards? So purely a willpower issue?

Do you know WHY it eliminates cravings for high energy foods? Because cravings work on a hierarchy of what your body needs urgently. Once the essentials are covered int he diet, it switches into "energy store" mode, craving fats and sugars to build a fat reserve because we're still primates instinctually expecting "a hard winter" where we'll need the fat stores.

But those energy store cravings come secondary to the essentials. You come out of a "cleanse" craving good, clean foods over sugars and fats because your body is craving basic life-sustaining nutrients and proteins due to being deprived of them for weeks. You should be somewhat worried that cravings for junk (energy dense food) have been miraculously replaced with cravings for basic nutrition.

And like I said, if it was nutritionally complete you'd be able to do it for 3 months, a year, 10 years. You will die if you try to. You will 100%, definitely, go into multi-organ failure due to protein deficiency.

Not safe. People shouldn't do it. By all means strip back your diet like I said, juice for breakfast, juice for dinner even, but please follow prof. TS's advice and have a healthy whole food lunch.

If being literally unable to do that through willpower is the issue then that's a completely separate problem that needs a completely different sort of work.

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

All-liquid diets have a much faster digestive transit which means your body literally doesn't have time to process the nutrients that are there. I'm not even saying that the juice is bad or not rich in nutrients - I love a nice green juice - but it would be much more sensible to be having at least one small solid meal with wholegrains (unless gluten intolerant), fruit and veg and lean proteins.

Nutrient wise, unless your juicing contains more than fruit & veg I can basically guarantee that it's deficient in amino acids and proteins, and no matter what you argue, solid fibre is essential to gut health and digestive transit.

If the juice diet was nutritionally complete, you would be able to do it indefinitely. If you tried to do it for 3+ months you'd end up very ill and to be blunt, if you tried to do it for 6+ months you would die.

Any diet that you can't carry on indefinitely is a crash diet and there's very little real evidence that any form of crash diet is a net benefit for the human body... and spades of evidence that it can be damaging.

What reason can you really give for juice cleansing for a month before re-introducing solids after a month (because if you didn't you'd die) over and above simply overhauling your diet with clean whole food? The idea seems to be that it "gets rid of cravings" for high energy foods like sugars and fats, and thus makes it easier to stick to a better diet afterwards? So purely a willpower issue?

Do you know WHY it eliminates cravings for high energy foods? Because cravings work on a hierarchy of what your body needs urgently. Once the essentials are covered int he diet, it switches into "energy store" mode, craving fats and sugars to build a fat reserve because we're still primates instinctually expecting "a hard winter" where we'll need the fat stores.

But those energy store cravings come secondary to the essentials. You come out of a "cleanse" craving good, clean foods over sugars and fats because your body is craving basic life-sustaining nutrients and proteins due to being deprived of them for weeks. You should be somewhat worried that cravings for junk (energy dense food) have been miraculously replaced with cravings for basic nutrition.

And like I said, if it was nutritionally complete you'd be able to do it for 3 months, a year, 10 years. You will die if you try to. You will 100%, definitely, go into multi-organ failure due to protein deficiency.

Not safe. People shouldn't do it. By all means strip back your diet like I said, juice for breakfast, juice for dinner even, but please follow prof. TS's advice and have a healthy whole food lunch.

If being literally unable to do that through willpower is the issue then that's a completely separate problem that needs a completely different sort of work.

None of this is backed up with anything it's just your usual stream of consciousness style advice.

Why do I need insoluble fibre if there is nothing to transit?

Where is the evidence that sufficient nutrients are not absorbed in transit?

Where is the evidence that 6 months would kill you?

If you had any real interest in my motives you would have read and understood the reasoning and logic but you obviously havent and don't.