[Niamh.]

Originally Posted by Zizu

The parents of missing Madeleine McCann left their three children alone in their apartment every night of their holiday because they did not want a stranger to babysit, it has emerged.
But, tragically, the routine may have allowed whoever abducted their daughter the chance to build up a picture of their movements while he planned his crime.


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That makes no sense what so ever considering they left their kids with "strangers" everyday in the kids club, I believe the complex had a child minding service using the same staff so.........

[AnnieK]

Originally Posted by Glenn.

There would have been next to no risk at all if her neglectful parents hadn’t left them. I’d ask the parents of TiBB to confirm whether they would leave their young children in a hotel room anywhere in the world to go out for drinks. Let’s see who will die on this hill.

I would have never left my child alone - ever. Here or in another country. I have never used a kids club on holiday. He has always been with me - it is after all a FAMILY holiday.

[Niamh.]

Originally Posted by Zizu

It’s still neglect


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Of course it is but nothing to do with the point I was making about people on holiday with children

[Niamh.]

Originally Posted by AnnieK

I would have never left my child alone - ever. Here or in another country. I have never used a kids club on holiday. He has always been with me - it is after all a FAMILY holiday.

Me neither

[Zizu]

Originally Posted by Niamh.

Of course it is but nothing to do with the point I was making about people on holiday with children

It shows that this type of neglect is perhaps more common than we think … you cast some doubt on the idea ..


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[Livia]

It feels like everyone wants to focus on how neglectful the family was - and they were definitely neglectful, there's no doubt. But I also don't doubt they've lived to regret that every single day since their daughter was taken, unless people are suggesting they're completely devoid of emotion. The person responsible ultimately is the person who took the child. It feels like that is often overlooked.

[Zizu]

Originally Posted by Niamh.

That makes no sense what so ever considering they left their kids with "strangers" everyday in the kids club, I believe the complex had a child minding service using the same staff so.........

Mmmmm

I’d suggest that their kids would be ‘safer’ in broad daylight with other adults and children around compared to leaving a stranger in the chalet with their kids


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[Niamh.]

Originally Posted by Zizu

It shows that this type of neglect is perhaps more common than we think … you cast some doubt on the idea ..


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I was talking specifically about peoples habits I've noticed while on holiday with children which is what the conversation is about. We all know that there are plenty of neglectful parents around, that not a secret

[Zizu]

Originally Posted by Niamh.

I was talking specifically about peoples habits I've noticed while on holiday with children which is what the conversation is about. We all know that there are plenty of neglectful parents around, that not a secret

So why are you accepting of neglect in the home but not on holidays ( when there’s nobody around to judge or report you ??

Surely these same parents are even more likely to leave their kids if they feel the resort is safe enough ?


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[Niamh.]

Originally Posted by Zizu

Mmmmm

The kids would be ‘safer’ in broad daylight with other adults and children around compared to leaving a stranger in your chalet with your kids


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Not safer than leaving them completely alone though, eh?

I think it was Ammi pointed out earlier, it's not even that you'd immediately jump to "what if some paedo is hanging around, waiting to take one of our children" there's loads of other scenarios that could happen from one of them waking up and falling to what if a fire breaks out all the way down to (the most likely to happen) one of them wakes up looking for me and I'm not there and is really upset with no adult there to comfort them?

[Niamh.]

Originally Posted by Zizu

So why are you accepting of neglect in the home but not on holidays ( when there’s nobody around to judge or report you ??

Surely these same parents are even more likely to leave their kids if they feel the resort is safe enough ?


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I was talking from my experiences of being on holiday as I said in every post I made about this. Also, I accept there's neglect on Holiday, aren't we just talking about such a case here? I was simply saying that most parents I've seen on holiday (myself included when my kids were young) would take their kids with them for dinner

[Zizu]

Originally Posted by Niamh.

Not safer than leaving them completely alone though, eh?

I think it was Ammi pointed out earlier, it's not even that you'd immediately jump to "what if some paedo is hanging around, waiting to take one of our children" there's loads of other scenarios that could happen from one of them waking up and falling to what if a fire breaks out all the way down to (the most likely to happen) one of them wakes up looking for me and I'm not there and is really upset with no adult there to comfort them?

They made a call and sadly it ended in tragedy ..

I recall the dilemmas of choosing child minders - we only went with extremely highly recommended babysitters

Sadly the McCanns didn’t have that luxury ..


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[AnnieK]

Originally Posted by Zizu

They made a call and sadly it ended in tragedy ..

I recall the dilemmas of choosing child minders - we only went with extremely highly recommended babysitters

Sadly the McCanns didn’t have that luxury ..


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If they didn't have that luxury - they shouldn't have left them. Period...

[Niamh.]

Originally Posted by Zizu

They made a call and sadly it ended in tragedy ..

I recall the dilemmas of choosing child minders - we only went with extremely highly recommended babysitters

Sadly the McCanns didn’t have that luxury ..


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What does that even mean though? they didn't have access to highly recommended baby sitters that they knew personally so the only other option was to leave them alone? Come off it now. They had options, they could use the hotels baby sitting service(which had child minders they probably already knew from the kids club) or they could eat out earlier with their children or they could eat in the apartment after they'd gone to bed

[Zizu]

Originally Posted by Niamh.

I was talking from my experiences of being on holiday as I said in every post I made about this. Also, I accept there's neglect on Holiday, aren't we just talking about such a case here? I was simply saying that most parents I've seen on holiday (myself included when my kids were young) would take their kids with them for dinner

I agree !!
We were the same as you BUT more couples than you think simply decide to take that risk whilst on holidays .. it’s almost certainly down to them wanting to relax and drink with friends at a bar .. then maybe the drink takes over and further impairs their decision making


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[Beso]

Originally Posted by Zizu

But, tragically, the routine may have allowed whoever abducted their daughter the chance to build up a picture of their movements while he planned his crime.

So it was defiantly a man then?

[Zizu]

Originally Posted by Niamh.

What does that even mean though? they didn't have access to highly recommended baby sitters that they knew personally so the only other option was to leave them alone? Come off it now. They had options, they could use the hotels baby sitting service(which had child minders they probably already knew from the kids club) or they could eat out earlier with their children or they could eat in the apartment after they'd gone to bed

Like I said during the day at a kid’s club there are more adults around ( and children)

That is entirely different to leaving a complete stranger alone in your chalet with your kids and any valuables IMHO


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[Zizu]

Originally Posted by Beso

So it was defiantly a man then?

The odds suggest so , yes

Spoiler:

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[Niamh.]

Originally Posted by Zizu

The odds suggest so , yes


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The odds would suggest it was a parent/family friend/relative actually

[Ammi]

Originally Posted by Zizu

They made a call and sadly it ended in tragedy ..

I recall the dilemmas of choosing child minders - we only went with extremely highly recommended babysitters

Sadly the McCanns didn’t have that luxury ..


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…and surely that’s the crux of it and of what’s being said in the thread…the decision was made and all events that evening in regards to Madeleine, stemmed from that decision…I believe that also has been the same thoughts that were expressed by Kate’s mother, the children’s grandmother of how they should never have been left alone…Kate and Gerry I’m sure have suffered dreadfully for the last 18 years for their decision on that evening and their actions that evening …and Madeleine can’t be left out of that, sadly…but for many parents, that would not have ever been ok is what’s being said because that’s the truth of it…

[Niamh.]

Originally Posted by Zizu

Like I said during the day at a kid’s club there are more adults around ( and children)

That is entirely different to leaving a complete stranger alone in your chalet with your kids and any valuables IMHO


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These child minders would have to be vetted by the Hotel I would imagine. So safer than leaving 2 two year olds and a 3 year old (who according to Kate had told her she had woken up the previous night and was crying because she couldn't find her) alone .......

[Zizu]

Spoiler:

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[Zizu]

Originally Posted by Niamh.

These child minders would have to be vetted by the Hotel I would imagine. So safer than leaving 2 two year olds and a 3 year old (who according to Kate had told her she had woken up the previous night and was crying because she couldn't find her) alone .......

Would you really trust the judgement of a hotel who will be paying the bare minimum to all employees ??


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[Niamh.]

Originally Posted by Zizu

The odds suggest so , yes

Spoiler:

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If it was a paedo but there is Zero evidence to say she was taken by a paedo is there?

[Niamh.]

Originally Posted by Zizu

Would you really trust the judgement of a hotel who will be paying the bare minimum to all employees ??


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I wouldn't leave my children in the first place however if my only two options (for some bizarre reason) was to leave 3 children under 4 alone in the apartment or hire a babysitter through the Hotel I'd be taking the latter option