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Originally Posted by patsylimerick

The latest figures I can dig out at a quick glance show rescidivism at 40% in the UK. Four out of every ten prisoners take what the State will give them while they're inside and come out and offend again. Until there is proof that rehabilitation is working FAR more comprehensively than this, no, this child should not be released to potentially kill again. (I know he's in the US but I think the UK rescidivism stats are more relevant for this discussion.) I'm just wondering if those who are on the liberal side of the argument believe that any individual is ever inherently bad, wired wrong and incurable? I do. Firmly. And I think that they should never, ever be left loose on the public again. I'm not in favour of the death penalty but I think that life should mean life and, in the case of adults, murder - intentional, pre-meditated killing - should ALWAYS result in life without parole. The problem is identifying those who are just wrong 'uns. Someone said ^^^^ that no-one's born evil. I don't agree. I wouldn't necessarily call it evil, but I certainly believe that there are aberrations completely devoid of empathy and desensitised. And I think that, while this is often the result of circumstance or trauma, sometimes its innate. So we have to be cold and removed when we look at this and we HAVE to decide that these people should be kept away from the rest of us - permanently. I think that case where the 17 year old girl stamped on a guys head and neck while he lay unconscious and bleeding to death is another example of someone who should never see the light of day again. She was 'ha ha'ing about it on Facebook. Throw away the key; bury it. I do think that, often, becoming a parent is the deciding factor in how you see this kind of thing. I'm a parent and I guarantee you that if anyone harmed one of my children the ONLY thing that would stop me from killing them would be the fact that I would sacrifice my liberty and be unable to look after the rest. And I used to be quite liberal when I was younger.

Personally I dont think people are born good or bad no. I tend to believe that nurture is stronger than nature and it is peoples experiences which shape their lives and the way they act. Take the case you mentioned of the girl just been found guilty of the homophobic killing; she had had a series of traumas in her life with her father being abusive and him being sentenced for manslaughter for stabbing a man when she was younger. Does it justify it? Of course not, and obviously she isnt the only one who has had a hard life but people cope in different ways and some are better at it than others and she resorted to alcohol.

I'd also say that noone is completely "good" or completely "bad". They're just words really, and peoples perception of what is wrong and what is right, what is moral and immoral, is all relative and subjective.