[Vicky.]

Originally Posted by Tom.

Of course its the home owners responsibility to make sure your house has good security and to update it where necessary. Ideally you should be able to leave your front and back doors open without anyone coming in but thats never going to happen. Its your responsibility to make sure your house is secure.

So basically, unless we all have super security systems and bars on our windows, we deserve for some lowlife to break in and steal our stuff. Nice.

[Tom.]

Originally Posted by Vicky.

So basically, unless we all have super security systems and bars on our windows, we deserve for some lowlife to break in and steal our stuff. Nice.

I'm not saying that at all, noone deserves to be broken into but if you don't maintain or improve your security then its going to happen sooner or later. You'll always maintain or improve fire alarms etc so its just the same kind of thing. If you repeatedly get broken into and haven't done anything about it then maybe its time to do something. Its like fat people wondering why they aren't losing weight whilst eating KFC

[Vicky.]

Originally Posted by Tom.

I'm not saying that at all, noone deserves to be broken into but if you don't maintain or improve your security then its going to happen sooner or later. You'll always maintain or improve fire alarms etc so its just the same kind of thing. If you repeatedly get broken into and haven't done anything about it then maybe its time to do something. Its like fat people wondering why they aren't losing weight whilst eating KFC

And what if you cant afford to 'do something about it'? Not everyone can afford to go out and upgrade their whole house, especially after a burglary.

Surely locking your windows and doors should be enough security. And if it happens again and again, the police should have done something. As it happens, he got no help, so took his own security measures.

And I bet hes had no breakins since then. And other people were saved from having breakins because one of the hardcore burglars died. So it clearly worked.

[Tom.]

Originally Posted by MTVN

You can leave your doors unlocked and your windows wide open, it's still a crime to trespass on someone else's property, and not having expensive security system doesnt mitigate that. Either you have the right to defend your property or you dont, you dont have less of a right to do so because you cant afford to make your house as secure as you might like

Its also illegal to shoot and kill someone. But that aside, defending your home doesn't have to be standing there with a shot gun, it can be as simple as locking your door. Having poor security is going to lead to burglaries, like it or not.

Originally Posted by Vicky.

And what if you cant afford to 'do something about it'? Not everyone can afford to go out and upgrade their whole house, especially after a burglary.

Surely locking your windows and doors should be enough security. And if it happens again and again, the police should have done something. As it happens, he got no help, so took his own security measures.

And I bet hes had no breakins since then. And other people were saved from having breakins because one of the hardcore burglars died. So it clearly worked.

Some house insurers help you with security measures after break ins, and obviously there are other means and ways of affording it. If you can't raise the funds in any way at all then you shouldn't be a home owner really.

What would you suggest the police do? There isn't much they can do.

[Vicky.]

Originally Posted by Tom.

Some house insurers help you with security measures after break ins, and obviously there are other means and ways of affording it. If you can't raise the funds in any way at all then you shouldn't be a home owner really.

What would you suggest the police do? There isn't much they can do.

Umm yeah, I'm really just going to have to agree to disagree on this one.

I dont think its right in any way to blame the victim for the crime

A different example of how your views have come across(to me) in this thread...a pretty woman is raped a few times by different people. She should just stop wearing makeup and cover herself up constantly etc....otherwise its her own fault for not changing the things that are making people commit the crime. See how absurd that sounds? A different crime, but the same logic.

I do not blame him for taking the law into his own hands. As clearly nothing was going to stop.

And I also feel this is going in circles

[Tom.]

Originally Posted by Vicky.

Umm yeah, I'm really just going to have to agree to disagree on this one.

I dont think its right in any way to blame the victim for the crime. And do not blame him for taking the law into his own hands.

And I also feel this is going in circles

Is that just your way of admitting you don't know what the police could do?

In general I wouldn't blame the victim for the crime, everyone deserves to be safe in their own home and shouldn't be burgled. But he definitely wasn't helping himself. Also he was given a 5 year prison sentence and served three- exactly the minimum sentence given for illegal posession of firearms. Coincidence?

Any other normal person would've just moved house after the third or fourth time.

[Vicky.]

Originally Posted by Tom.

Is that just your way of admitting you don't know what the police could do?

In general I wouldn't blame the victim for the crime, everyone deserves to be safe in their own home and shouldn't be burgled. But he definitely wasn't helping himself. Also he was given a 5 year prison sentence and served three- exactly the minimum sentence given for illegal posession of firearms. Coincidence?

Any other normal person would've just moved house after the third or fourth time.

And they should have to do that why?

And the police could have maybe...took fingerprints, maybe made night patrols near his house to try and catch them out, helped him upgrade his security....a few things to help

It was not me admitting I didnt know what they could do, it was me giving up in frustration because I really cant understand your logic....hence my slightly offtopic attempt at a comparison above.

[Zippy]

Originally Posted by Tom.

Is that just your way of admitting you don't know what the police could do?

Do you seriously think the police didnt know who was committing these burglaries? That community wasn't huge and those involved had massive criminal records(the kid who was killed had 29 arrests!). yet you dont think the police had them down as suspects for all these burglaries?

All burglars leave their trademark evidence behind. truth is, the police and judicial system were doing ****** ALL to protect him from these known scumbags. Thats the real issue here. he wasnt getting any back up or help. After that many burglaries the police should be mounting cameras and doing covert missions to capture the crims menacing him and his home. These were hardcore crims who needed to be locked up not just to protect Tony Martin but tons of other taxpaying victims.

get this, thats what the police are paid to do!

[Kerry]

Wether you have a shotgun or a remote control in your hand to lamp someone with, the truth is, they shouldn't be on your property and you have every right to defend it. If they die ... well they shouldn't have been there

Another thing that makes me laugh (I say laugh in the loosest term.....) is when kids, for example, break into a school or garage or whatever. Basically tresspassing. Then if they fall through the roof they expect compensation if they break a limb. What?!?!?!

[Zippy]

Originally Posted by Vicky.

And other people were saved from having breakins because one of the hardcore burglars died. So it clearly worked.

Thats actually a real truth. Although its sad that a 16 yr old died. But his death has spared dozens if not hundreds of potential victims. Peoples life can be devastated when they get invaded. they cant sleep in their own homes and dont feel safe anymore. many even have to move home to find peace.

he'd have done his community a huge favour by killing all 3 of the thieving scumbags. Truth is, theyre worthless trash who will always be a menace to society. Just look at their criminal records!

*feels right wing*