[Niamh.]

Originally Posted by Robodog

Yeah i get that, i don't mean to be personal about yourself being a Helen-hater like that, so i'm sorry if it came across that way. It just feels like a blanket all out dismissal of Helen from lots of people sometimes, so i'm sorry if i put you wrongly in that bracket.

And yeah you are right, she'd probably never have made it to the final were it not for the pass. But still she pulled off the win, something the real villains - Conor/Perez/Farrah would never have managed.

The only other BB villain who came close to the Helen effect was Speidi, who again mixed their villainy with humanity and humour, hence they came a close 2nd to Rylan (who was destined to win from the start).

For me I see the likes of Perez, Farrah, Speidi almost like cartoon characters, it's all like a show or a performance specifically designed to get themselves airtime, sometimes I like the show they put on (Speidi and perez) and sometimes I don't (farrah) but ultimately I see them all as in a similar category, if you know what I mean?

Conor and Helen I see as similar HMs also, I see them as nasty and bullies but also real so they'll have other sides to their personalities that some people will like enough to over look or make excuses for the not so nice side which I get as well but for me the nasty side of Helen far out weighed the nicer side