[hot2go]

Originally Posted by jet

If you know so much about this, give the details of how Gemma instigated each and every attack. Just saying it without the evidence doesn't mean its true.
You could start with last night and work your way back...

Really I am not trying to be unfriendly but I am really not gonna justify my views on that old cows bad behaviour again....if you want to know the tsunami of proof that's flooded this forum about Gemma Collins appalling personality them I'm afraid you're gonna have to trawl through all the old posts.....it's all there....it's all true....and it's shocking

[Beso]

Originally Posted by hot2go

Really I am not trying to be unfriendly but I am really not gonna justify my views on that old cows bad behaviour again....if you want to know the tsunami of proof that's flooded this forum about Gemma Collins appalling personality them I'm afraid you're gonna have to trawl through all the old posts.....it's all there....it's all true....and it's shocking

Gemma's done nothing but show class.

The one with the horrid personality is steph, such a lowlife scrubber compared to gemma's mild mannered and polite ways.

[jet]

Originally Posted by hot2go

Really I am not trying to be unfriendly but I am really not gonna justify my views on that old cows bad behaviour again....if you want to know the tsunami of proof that's flooded this forum about Gemma Collins appalling personality them I'm afraid you're gonna have to trawl through all the old posts.....it's all there....it's all true....and it's shocking

I was asking you specifically how Gemma instigated each and every attack on Stephanie - which is what you accused her of. You can't expect to make a sweeping statement like that without any facts to back it up and not expect to be challenged on it.
So from your answer it seems you have no evidence at all or you would at least have answered this question - how did she instigate the attack on her last night? That can't be too hard.

[hot2go]

Originally Posted by jet

I was asking you specifically how Gemma instigated each and every attack on Stephanie - which is what you accused her of. You can't expect to make a sweeping statement like that without any facts to back it up and not expect to be challenged on it.
So from your answer it seems you have no evidence at all or you would at least have answered this question - how did she instigate the attack on her last night? That can't be too hard.

You must understand, that every time I explain my views on that old bag I am constantly told I have an obsession with her.....last night Gemma said she didn't want to go to bed because of the bad energy being created by the others...Steph wasn't creating a bad energy, she was having fun with it and making jokes about it and laughing about it....Gemma implied that she was scared to be around Steph.....since when ?!! Since when has she been scared of any of em ? And why should she be scared of Steph ? That's just planting seeds AGAIN in other people's minds to paint Steph in a bad way and diminish her personality....those are facts....what is not a provable fact and one we for sure won't agree on is, I believe without doubt, that when Gemma said to Dani " Dont speak to Steph when she comes in because she will kick off ".... What Gemma was really doing was putting that image out ther for people to imagine and act on...I believe, Gemma is the ring master of manipulation and manages to embroil everyone except Steph into her twisted games.....she's playing Dani like a fool...
So there is my reply you asked for....I know it's not any use to you and I know and respect your loyalty to Gemma....I like loyalty when it comes from rational and friendly people like yourself and I know you don't take my views personally...if Gemma wins next week I will actually be happy for you ...

[chuff me dizzy]

Originally Posted by hot2go

You must understand, that every time I explain my views on that old bag I am constantly told I have an obsession with her.....last night Gemma said she didn't want to go to bed because of the bad energy being created by the others...Steph wasn't creating a bad energy, she was having fun with it and making jokes about it and laughing about it....Gemma implied that she was scared to be around Steph.....since when ?!! Since when has she been scared of any of em ? And why should she be scared of Steph ? That's just planting seeds AGAIN in other people's minds to paint Steph in a bad way and diminish her personality....those are facts....what is not a provable fact and one we for sure won't agree on is, I believe without doubt, that when Gemma said to Dani " Dont speak to Steph when she comes in because she will kick off ".... What Gemma was really doing was putting that image out ther for people to imagine and act on...I believe, Gemma is the ring master of manipulation and manages to embroil everyone except Steph into her twisted games.....she's playing Dani like a fool...
So there is my reply you asked for....I know it's not any use to you and I know and respect your loyalty to Gemma....I like loyalty when it comes from rational and friendly people like yourself and I know you don't take my views personally...if Gemma wins next week I will actually be happy for you ...

[jet]

Originally Posted by hot2go

You must understand, that every time I explain my views on that old bag I am constantly told I have an obsession with her.....last night Gemma said she didn't want to go to bed because of the bad energy being created by the others...Steph wasn't creating a bad energy, she was having fun with it and making jokes about it and laughing about it....Gemma implied that she was scared to be around Steph.....since when ?!! Since when has she been scared of any of em ? And why should she be scared of Steph ? That's just planting seeds AGAIN in other people's minds to paint Steph in a bad way and diminish her personality....those are facts....what is not a provable fact and one we for sure won't agree on is, I believe without doubt, that when Gemma said to Dani " Dont speak to Steph when she comes in because she will kick off ".... What Gemma was really doing was putting that image out ther for people to imagine and act on...I believe, Gemma is the ring master of manipulation and manages to embroil everyone except Steph into her twisted games.....she's playing Dani like a fool...
So there is my reply you asked for....I know it's not any use to you and I know and respect your loyalty to Gemma....I like loyalty when it comes from rational and friendly people like yourself and I know you don't take my views personally...if Gemma wins next week I will actually be happy for you ...

But those are not the FACTS. Steph instigated it when Dani was called to the diary room to nom by saying "It will probably be me and Jez even though we're the best crack". When Steph and Tiff were in the bedroom carrying on John walks into the kitchen shaking his head and goes up to Gemma and Dani.....

JOHN: "It's just horrendous in there right now"
JOHN: "It's ridiculous saying they're the most entertaining"
JOHN:"Why am I up for nomination".
GEMMA: "I'm stressed right now".
DANI: Is this Tiff?
JOHN: No, Stephanie.

Sounds of Tiff shouting in the bedroom.
Gemma: I don't want to walk into that bedroom, and that's not me.

Later Tiff is yelling loudly in the garden:
Gemma: Please if she walks in here don't say anything. (She was referring to Tiff, Steph was already entering the room when Gemma says this.)

Then Steph says something and that is when Dani said about her not working again. Gemma hasn't said a word and didn't say a word during the argument.

When Steph is going mental trying to get out:
Gemma: Who's that smashing up....(Inaudible) (She wouldn't have known if it was Tiff or Steph')
Dani: It's her.
John: This is upsetting!

Later: The camera shows Tiff grumbling and striding about the garden and the camera cuts to -
Gemma: I'm not going to speak to her tomorrow....I don't want to sleep in there.

Those are the FACTS of the scenes Gemma was involved in. Anyone can watch them as evidence. Gemma never said don't speak to Steph because 'it will kick off'. You put those words into her mouth. Gemma didn't say or imply she was scared of Steph - she was talking about Tiff - and much as I love Tiff, she WAS yelling and screeching. Gemma did NOTHING wrong to Steph.
Dani said plenty, and John said stuff, Gemma did not.
So it's unfair and wrong to surmise anything. Those are the FACTS.

I don't like posting anything unless I have the facts straight, so it bothers me when things are misinterpreted to fit in with what people want to believe.
So watch out for big bad Jet the fact checker.

[hot2go]

Originally Posted by jet

But those are not the FACTS. Steph instigated it when Dani was called to the diary room to nom by saying "It will probably be me and Jez even though we're the best crack". When Steph and Tiff were in the bedroom carrying on John walks into the kitchen shaking his head and goes up to Gemma and Dani.....

JOHN: "It's just horrendous in there right now"
JOHN: "It's ridiculous saying they're the most entertaining"
JOHN:"Why am I up for nomination".
GEMMA: "I'm stressed right now".
DANI: Is this Tiff?
JOHN: No, Stephanie.

Sounds of Tiff shouting in the bedroom.
Gemma: I don't want to walk into that bedroom, and that's not me.

Later Tiff is yelling loudly in the garden:
Gemma: Please if she walks in here don't say anything. (She was referring to Tiff, Steph was already entering the room when Gemma says this.)

Then Steph says something and that is when Dani said about her not working again. Gemma hasn't said a word and didn't say a word during the argument.

When Steph is going mental trying to get out:
Gemma: Who's that smashing up....(Inaudible) (She wouldn't have known if it was Tiff or Steph')
Dani: It's her.
John: This is upsetting!

Later: The camera shows Tiff grumbling and striding about the garden and the camera cuts to -
Gemma: I'm not going to speak to her tomorrow....I don't want to sleep in there.

Those are the FACTS of the scenes Gemma was involved in. Anyone can watch them as evidence. Gemma never said don't speak to Steph because 'it will kick off'. You put those words into her mouth. Gemma didn't say or imply she was scared of Steph - she was talking about Tiff - and much as I love Tiff, she WAS yelling and screeching. Gemma did NOTHING wrong to Steph.
Dani said plenty, and John said stuff, Gemma did not.
So it's unfair and wrong to surmise anything. Those are the FACTS.

I don't like posting anything unless I have the facts straight, so it bothers me when things are misinterpreted to fit in with what they want to believe.
So watch out for big bad Jet the fact checker.

That's very impressive and an accurate narration of what was said....thanks for taking the time to do that....I understand exactly how the dialogue in print looks like Gemma is innocent and you have every reasonable right to accept it on face value, especially as a fan....but myself I think it's very much open to interpretation and I think what Gemma says, or appears to say, and what Gemma actually means are two very different things....I don't agree that just because the edit shows Tiffany shouting then cuts to Gemma saying negative things about someone, that that someone was def Tiffany ...not at all....and I don't think for one minute that Gemma only had a problem with Tiffany and didn't relish the drama that was being directed at Steph by Dani.....I think we will get a clearer picture tonight when we see them reflect on it all....maybe Gemma will confirm the way it looks to you and say she only felt threatened by Tiffany.....or maybe she will confirm the way it looks to me and tell everyone that Steph was scary and that she was responsible for the bad energy in the house last night.....be kinda fun to see tonight's episode....you and me going head to head in a clean but friendly fight

[jet]

Originally Posted by hot2go

That's very impressive and an accurate narration of what was said....thanks for taking the time to do that....I understand exactly how the dialogue in print looks like Gemma is innocent and you have every reasonable right to accept it on face value, especially as a fan....but myself I think it's very much open to interpretation and I think what Gemma says, or appears to say, and what Gemma actually means are two very different things....I don't agree that just because the edit shows Tiffany shouting then cuts to Gemma saying negative things about someone, that that someone was def Tiffany ...not at all....and I don't think for one minute that Gemma only had a problem with Tiffany and didn't relish the drama that was being directed at Steph by Dani.....I think we will get a clearer picture tonight when we see them reflect on it all....maybe Gemma will confirm the way it looks to you and say she only felt threatened by Tiffany.....or maybe she will confirm the way it looks to me and tell everyone that Steph was scary and that she was responsible for the bad energy in the house last night.....be kinda fun to see tonight's episode....you and me going head to head in a clean but friendly fight

Sorry, you've lost me. I can't have any further discussion with you if you insist on disregarding actual proof and persist in attributing sinister meanings and motives to anything Gemma does or says without any words or footage to prove it.
Reverse things here. How would you like it if I was doing the same with Steph? Attributing words and actions to her that she didn't say or do? Then you take the time to give me evidence of her innocence and I persist that what she says and means are two different things and she only looks innocent etc? Wouldn't that annoy the hell out of you?

I know Gemma isn't perfect by any means, but she is not the conniving, two faced monster she is being made out to be. When she confronted Steph about having a boyfriend to her face, she was blasted. She can't win, cos then she is accused of saying things behind her back, but I rarely see that. Dani and John do that far more. John is sneakier and more two faced than Gemma by far, yet you don't blast him. You see what you want to see, imo.
When we can only go by what we see on the screen, that is what we have to take as FACTS. Anything beyond that is only an opinion, but you persist in stating your opinions as FACTS, with no EVIDENCE, and that is what bothers me and why I can't discuss Gemma with you any more. It's too frustrating.

I'm sure I'll debate other stuff with you though. Peace and out.