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View Poll Results: .
Yes, he has served his time & should be allowed to return to society as normal 24 47.06%
Yes, he has served his time & should be allowed to return to society as normal
24 47.06%
Can't decide 1 1.96%
Can't decide
1 1.96%
No, it would be a bad example & he should not be allowed to play football professionally again 26 50.98%
No, it would be a bad example & he should not be allowed to play football professionally again
26 50.98%
Voters: 51. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 16-10-2014, 10:14 AM #1
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Default Should Ched Evans be allowed to sign for a Football Club again?

He was convicted on a 5 year sentence in April 2012 and will be released this week.

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Evans and another footballer, Clayton McDonald, were tried at the Crown Court at Caernarfon after being indicted of the rape of a 19-year-old woman, who was deemed too drunk to consent,[38] at a hotel near Rhyl in May 2011. Evans was convicted on 20 April 2012 and was sentenced to five years imprisonment. He will be eligible for release after serving half of that sentence.[36][39][40] In August 2012, Evans was refused leave to appeal against the conviction, and he appealed to the Court of Appeal of England and Wales,[41] this decision was upheld by the Court of Appeal in London in November.[42] Evans continues to maintain his innocence,[43] and in November 2013 recruited a new legal team to attempt to clear his name.[44] He is currently serving his sentence at HM Prison Wymott.
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Footballer Ched Evans will leave prison this week, keen to get back to work after serving half of a five-year sentence for raping a 19-year-old woman in a hotel room. As I write, more than 140,000 people have signed a petition stating that Evans should not be allowed to return to professional football. But his former club Sheffield United are reportedly interested in re-signing the striker.

Moral arguments have been presented on both sides. Gordon Taylor, chief executive of the Professional Footballers’ Association, has pointed out that the law does not prevent ex-prisoners from working or resuming their old lives after release: “As a trade union we believe in the rule of law … besides that, [Evans] still wants to contribute to society. If he earns money he’ll pay taxes, those taxes will go to help people who maybe can’t get a job.”

There’s a certain consistency to Taylor’s first line of argument. If we respect the law that has found Evans guilty of rape, then shouldn’t we also respect the legal process that imposes a prison sentence, after which the convicted person is free to return to society?

Taylor’s claim about the social benefits of Evans’ return to work, meanwhile, appeals to two quite different kinds of moral argument: one based on motivation and the other based on consequences. The suggestion that “Evans wants to contribute to society” encourages us to regard him as a person of good will – and philosopher Immanuel Kant makes this concept of a good will or pure moral intention the sole criterion of morality. So Kant would deny that the tax revenue from Evans’ wages has any moral relevance, since only motivations, and not consequences, have moral worth. A strict utilitarian, in contrast, would take into account all social benefits arising from his potential return to Sheffield United.

Those campaigning against Evans emphasise a different set of issues. Katie Russell of Rape Crisis England has stated that her organisation “recognises the right of any convicted criminal to return to work after they’ve completed their sentence”. But for her, the cultural context gives this case a distinctive moral significance. Football is a high-profile, prestigious industry: players are celebrated and revered, not least by boys and young men. And with this public influence comes social responsibility.

If it were to bring Evans back into the team, Russell argues, Sheffield United would be failing “to send a very strong message that rape and sexual violence – and violence against women and girls more broadly – will not be tolerated within football”. According to this logic, the right to return to work can be sacrificed for the sake of a strong statement about cultural values. In other words, in this instance the ends justify the means.

Interest in this case, as with many morally ambiguous situations, arises from a deeper concern about what kind of people we should be, and what kind of society we want to live in. For Plato, this was the substance of all moral questions. One of the important messages in his Republic is the unbreakable connection between the personal and the social, the private and the public, the soul and the state. Cases like that of Evans, then, go to the heart of whether we want to be a society that promotes forgiveness – that allows people to make mistakes and move on – or one that chooses role models who embody gentleness and respect for others.

If it is hard to give a clear answer to this question, that is precisely because both sides are so compelling. Surely we should not give up on either forgiveness or providing positive role models. But the sting in the tail is that, however deep the moral dilemma, a practical decision needs to be made.

I do not know enough about what happened in that hotel room, nor about Evans’ attitude now, to say what should be done. But putting myself in the position of those who have to decide about his career, I see that the way through this problem involves posing the moral questions to Evans himself.

I would ask him if he felt able to exemplify values of dignity and kindness. His commitment to this would make it easier for me to take the stand for forgiveness. After all, we should not have to choose between these two ideals. Both can be realised in this case, but only if those involved take on the responsibility of living up to them.
http://www.theguardian.com/commentis...-sentence-rape
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Old 16-10-2014, 10:27 AM #2
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I can see it from both sides of the argument. It sends a bad message to re-sign him but what is the point in the prison system if it prevents someone who has successfully completed a prison term from contributing to society? It's certainly a deterrent to reformation if ex-cons aren't given the chance to prove themselves.

It's a difficult one.
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Old 16-10-2014, 10:34 AM #3
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Originally Posted by Dezzy View Post
I can see it from both sides of the argument. It sends a bad message to re-sign him but what is the point in the prison system if it prevents someone who has successfully completed a prison term from contributing to society? It's certainly a deterrent to reformation if ex-cons aren't given the chance to prove themselves.

It's a difficult one.
I think the nature of his job probably has a lot to do with it. Because he'd be in the limelight and a celebrity of sorts
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Old 16-10-2014, 10:33 AM #4
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If he's served his time that's that i suppose. Should he be allowed to have any job anywhere eve again? being a football player is no different to any other job. should he be allowed to work at Tesco?
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Old 16-10-2014, 10:53 AM #5
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I think he should be allowed back, he's served his time, no need to punish the man for the rest of his life. His crime had nothing to do with his ability to play football. The thing he was convicted for is such a grey area anyway; it's as easy to imagine he took advantage of a drunk girl as it is to imagine they were both drunk, had sex and then she later claimed rape.
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Old 16-10-2014, 11:01 AM #6
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Originally Posted by Z View Post
I think he should be allowed back, he's served his time, no need to punish the man for the rest of his life. His crime had nothing to do with his ability to play football. The thing he was convicted for is such a grey area anyway; it's as easy to imagine he took advantage of a drunk girl as it is to imagine they were both drunk, had sex and then she later claimed rape.
no, he is definitely a rapist, pure and simple. considering how difficult it is to convict a man of rape there is no doubt he is guilty,. most rapists get off(no pun intended) so for him to be convicted means there was PLENTY of evidence and he most certainly is a rapist. there is no grey area in this case.
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Old 16-10-2014, 10:54 AM #7
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What's the point of making someone serve a sentence as punishment if the punishment is actually going to go on forever. If he is not allowed to return to his job, whatever that job may be, that will surely affect others who have served jail time, paid for their crime and then continued to be punished after they're released.

The exception would obviously be for people who have been convicted of crimes against children, they should obviously not be allowed to work with children ever again.
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Old 16-10-2014, 10:59 AM #8
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Originally Posted by Livia View Post
What's the point of making someone serve a sentence as punishment if the punishment is actually going to go on forever. If he is not allowed to return to his job, whatever that job may be, that will surely affect others who have served jail time, paid for their crime and then continued to be punished after they're released.

The exception would obviously be for people who have been convicted of crimes against children, they should obviously not be allowed to work with children ever again.
yes i agree. or if a doctor is convicted of malpractice they should not be allowed to practice medicine, etc... or if he had committed a crime on the football pitch while playing football (like mike tyson biting evander hollyfield) then he should be banned from football. but considering his crime had nothing to do with playing football, i don't see the problem.
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Old 16-10-2014, 06:39 PM #9
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Originally Posted by Livia View Post
What's the point of making someone serve a sentence as punishment if the punishment is actually going to go on forever. If he is not allowed to return to his job, whatever that job may be, that will surely affect others who have served jail time, paid for their crime and then continued to be punished after they're released.

The exception would obviously be for people who have been convicted of crimes against children, they should obviously not be allowed to work with children ever again.
Absolutely this,I agree with every word of this post.
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Old 16-10-2014, 11:11 AM #10
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Totally, he's served his time.

Plus what message are we sending out saying that people that have served their time shouldn't return to their full time job and bring in taxes?

Rather a rapist earn his own money (and add thousands to the tax system) than claim benefits for the rest of his life.
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Old 16-10-2014, 01:20 PM #11
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Nope. His job elevates him to a celebrity of sorts, his face could be in a paper somewhere and his victim sees it by accident. He should be allowed a job back in conjunction with football but not the one he had, keep him in the background.
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Old 16-10-2014, 01:24 PM #12
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Nope. His job elevates him to a celebrity of sorts, his face could be in a paper somewhere and his victim sees it by accident. He should be allowed a job back in conjunction with football but not the one he had, keep him in the background.
Considering what we now know about the celebrities of the 80's and 90's on british TV, if you tried to keep all the sex offenders off you might as well just make TV illegal. Hell maybe we should just throw acid in everyone's eyes, blind the public just to make sure they don't see anything offensive.
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Old 16-10-2014, 02:50 PM #13
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Considering what we now know about the celebrities of the 80's and 90's on british TV, if you tried to keep all the sex offenders off you might as well just make TV illegal. Hell maybe we should just throw acid in everyone's eyes, blind the public just to make sure they don't see anything offensive.
It flies the face of that whole situation and the outrage if a footballer (who gets paid very well) who is a convicted rapist is allowed back to that job and lifestyle.
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Old 16-10-2014, 06:28 PM #14
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Nope. His job elevates him to a celebrity of sorts, his face could be in a paper somewhere and his victim sees it by accident. He should be allowed a job back in conjunction with football but not the one he had, keep him in the background.
But isn't he front page of the paper now with all this stuff going on? I sort of feel that saying he should work in the background is like saying that someone can return to work at the local sweet shop, but they have to be behind at all times.

Although we have to protect her as much as him, so I see where you're coming from
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Old 16-10-2014, 06:57 PM #15
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But isn't he front page of the paper now with all this stuff going on? I sort of feel that saying he should work in the background is like saying that someone can return to work at the local sweet shop, but they have to be behind at all times.

Although we have to protect her as much as him, so I see where you're coming from
I understand the argument that he should not be punished forever and if he was a shop assistant and he could return to a job and the victim was not around him then that's fine but he was a job which means he could be in the papers day in day out and his victim have to suffer seeing him again and again just by simply getting on a train and seeing a newspaper on a seat with his face on it.

I'm not against him earning a living but such a high profile one...I don't personally feel he should be allowed to return to it.
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Nope. His job elevates him to a celebrity of sorts, his face could be in a paper somewhere and his victim sees it by accident. He should be allowed a job back in conjunction with football but not the one he had, keep him in the background.
I agree, Sorry but glorifying a rapist back into celebrity status is just as bad as carrying on a punishment. The message that sends out is that it doesn't matter if you rape somebody you can still go back to being a celebrity.
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I agree, Sorry but glorifying a rapist back into celebrity status is just as bad as carrying on a punishment. The message that sends out is that it doesn't matter if you rape somebody you can still go back to being a celebrity.
Not meaning to play devil's advocate here but... is it really his fault that his chosen career (professional football) carries celebrity status? It's not like, say, Big Brother celebs who are seeking fame for the sake of fame... it just so happens that football has a lot of interest and so footballers are recognisable public figures. I'd say that most pro sportspeople set out to make a living from engaging in sport, rather than seeking fame / celebrity...

Also, celebrity isn't exactly something you choose. He isn't "going back to" being a celebrity. He is still a celebrity. Just (allegedly) a celebrity who raped someone. Rolf Harris is still a celebrity. Gary Glitter is still a celebrity. ... Jack the Ripper is a celebrity, of sorts.
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Old 24-10-2014, 08:11 PM #18
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Not meaning to play devil's advocate here but... is it really his fault that his chosen career (professional football) carries celebrity status? It's not like, say, Big Brother celebs who are seeking fame for the sake of fame... it just so happens that football has a lot of interest and so footballers are recognisable public figures. I'd say that most pro sportspeople set out to make a living from engaging in sport, rather than seeking fame / celebrity...

Also, celebrity isn't exactly something you choose. He isn't "going back to" being a celebrity. He is still a celebrity. Just (allegedly) a celebrity who raped someone. Rolf Harris is still a celebrity. Gary Glitter is still a celebrity. ... Jack the Ripper is a celebrity, of sorts.
Agree. People have said he shouldn't play again because he doesn't deserve to be watched by thousands of people every week, be featured on MOTD (not that he would as a L1 player at best but anyway) or have his face in the papers yet all those things are only really indirect consequences of being good at his job, its not being a celebrity for the sake of being a celebrity. Those arguments also sort of imply that it wouldn't matter so much if he wasn't in the papers, if he wasn't on TV, which is effectively saying it'd be ok for him to return to football if he was bad at it - and thus not in the public eye so much - but not if he's good at it.

Also agree with the second point. It's still unclear whether Evans will play again but he has still been plastered across the papers every day and stories are constantly being run on what he's been up to since his release and the various reactions to his story. True he might fade into obscurity gradually if he was never to play but celebrity status isn't something that can immediately be flicked off like a switch.
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Old 24-10-2014, 11:13 PM #19
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Not meaning to play devil's advocate here but... is it really his fault that his chosen career (professional football) carries celebrity status? It's not like, say, Big Brother celebs who are seeking fame for the sake of fame... it just so happens that football has a lot of interest and so footballers are recognisable public figures. I'd say that most pro sportspeople set out to make a living from engaging in sport, rather than seeking fame / celebrity...

Also, celebrity isn't exactly something you choose. He isn't "going back to" being a celebrity. He is still a celebrity. Just (allegedly) a celebrity who raped someone. Rolf Harris is still a celebrity. Gary Glitter is still a celebrity. ... Jack the Ripper is a celebrity, of sorts.
Yes but you don't see any of them still working in the main profession do you? I.e. As a TV presenter/musician etc
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Old 24-10-2014, 11:34 PM #20
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A lot of people seem to have missed the point, by a long margin.

Firstly, it is not the guilty person that makes himself a celebrity, this is not under his personal control.

Secondly, someone who has served a prison sentence has done their time, and not acknowledging remorse is their human right of defense in not admitting to the crime in the first place. Perfectly acceptable human right.

Thirdly, the employer has the right to refuse employment on the grounds of the prospective employee having committed a criminal offense. The choice is theirs. If they choose to employ, then they accept the potential consequences.

Very simple really.
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Old 24-10-2014, 11:38 PM #21
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Not meaning to play devil's advocate here but... is it really his fault that his chosen career (professional football) carries celebrity status? It's not like, say, Big Brother celebs who are seeking fame for the sake of fame... it just so happens that football has a lot of interest and so footballers are recognisable public figures. I'd say that most pro sportspeople set out to make a living from engaging in sport, rather than seeking fame / celebrity...

Also, celebrity isn't exactly something you choose. He isn't "going back to" being a celebrity. He is still a celebrity. Just (allegedly) a celebrity who raped someone. Rolf Harris is still a celebrity. Gary Glitter is still a celebrity. ... Jack the Ripper is a celebrity, of sorts.
Jack the ripper is infamous rather than famous and that's specifically for being a criminal.
You only hold celebrity status whilst you are celebrated, once you are defamed as glitter/harris I don't feel they are a 'celebrity' in the real sense of the word merely an ex singer and presenter imo.
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Old 16-10-2014, 01:29 PM #22
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The argument against seems to be about him being a role model for kids. Surely kids take no interest in the players criminal past even if they were made aware and could actually comprehend what he did?
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The argument against seems to be about him being a role model for kids. Surely kids take no interest in the players criminal past even if they were made aware and could actually comprehend what he did?
Because generally, footballers are suitable role models?
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Old 16-10-2014, 01:57 PM #24
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Sportsmen and women are ambassadors of sorts and they are looked up to, they always have been seen as positive role models. This would send out a very odd message imo.
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Old 16-10-2014, 02:18 PM #25
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Sportsmen and women are ambassadors of sorts and they are looked up to, they always have been seen as positive role models. This would send out a very odd message imo.
so maybe we should stop the media from propping up sports stars as heroes, ever consider that? maybe we should prop up scientists as heroes, is that crazy?
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