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Livia · 13-12-2012, 02:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Irene Pearson

From that you assume I am agnostic etc. etc.? So you believe that everyone but the church should be heartily "discouraged" from discriminatory actions?

No, I think you should know a little more about what it is you're discussing before you engage in a debate. It's you yourself who are championing discrimination against Christians.

13-12-2012, 03:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Livia

You've got to pick your battles Irene and stop getting outraged on other people's behalf. It's a massive waste of energy.

I notice with some amusement that it is always the atheists, agnostics and other assorted "non-believers" who seem to be the ones with all the ideas about changing religions.

InOne · 13-12-2012, 03:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Livia

You've got to pick your battles Irene and stop getting outraged on other people's behalf. It's a massive waste of energy.

I notice with some amusement that it is always the atheists, agnostics and other assorted "non-believers" who seem to be the ones with all the ideas about changing religions.

The funny thing is though. It's often Atheists that have more knowledge on Religion than the so called Religious people (Not on about you). I don't like to engage in Religious debates anymore but often in ends up in Theists deflecting, that's why I don't bother.

Kizzy · 13-12-2012, 02:34 PM

You are entitled to have an opinion and express yourself however you wish irene, I thought it was the LGBT christians that wanted the changes made, so they could marry in church?
Why that suggests atheists and agnostics are exempt from comment I don't know...

Irene Pearson · 13-12-2012, 02:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Merry Kizzmas

You are entitled to have an opinion and express yourself however you wish irene, I thought it was the LGBT christians that wanted the changes made, so they could marry in church?
Why that suggests atheists and agnostics are exempt from comment I don't know...

Sorry Kizzmas you have lost me. I seem to being accused of some weird stuff here.

Kizzy · 13-12-2012, 02:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Irene Pearson

Sorry Kizzmas you have lost me. I seem to being accused of some weird stuff here.

I said the same last night on this issue, nobody can or should change an existing religion.
Politics has no place meddling, however everyone is entitled to an opinion, I am not a christian but that should not mean that my view on this means any less.
As a democracy everyone is equal regardless of what their beliefs are.

Irene Pearson · 13-12-2012, 03:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Merry Kizzmas

I said the same last night on this issue, nobody can or should change an existing religion.
Politics has no place meddling, however everyone is entitled to an opinion, I am not a christian but that should not mean that my view on this means any less.
As a democracy everyone is equal regardless of what their beliefs are.

The many offshoots of Christianity can and have changed down the centuries.

Kizzy · 13-12-2012, 03:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Irene Pearson

The many offshoots of Christianity can and have changed down the centuries.

Yes they have, and some are more tolerant than others, fair play to them.
However, why should westminster stamp on those who are not, it's not a faith then is it?
it becomes an enforced regime.

Irene Pearson · 13-12-2012, 03:05 PM

Will you tell me why my last post to Livia has been deleted?

In the Drunk Tank · 13-12-2012, 03:17 PM

Well I suppose the problem is that the CofE are still technically the official Church in this country and we don't have complete separation of church and state, that makes the gay marriage question even more difficult because they are seen as conducting marriages on behalf of the state, and if they're against marrying same sex couples than it's problematic to legalise it

ChristmasNeeve · 13-12-2012, 03:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by King Moonracer

Well I suppose the problem is that the CofE are still technically the official Church in this country and we don't have complete separation of church and state, that makes the gay marriage question even more difficult because they are seen as conducting marriages on behalf of the state, and if they're against marrying same sex couples than it's problematic to legalise it

That's a good point too Matt

Irene Pearson · 13-12-2012, 03:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Christmas Neeve

That's a good point too Matt

. Civil partnership is allowed by the state is this not the next logical progression.Christian churches were behind children being demonised as bastards when born out of wedlock. Why are gay couples children being discriminated against when the church still maintain that it is a sin to be illegitimate. The world evolves peoples conscious awareness expands . There are a lot of gays to whom religion is important , who contribute to their local communities through the church. This all so medieval.

ChristmasNeeve · 13-12-2012, 03:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Irene Pearson

. Civil partnership is allowed by the state is this not the next logical progression.Christian churches were behind children being demonised as bastards when born out of wedlock. Why are gay couples children being discriminated against when the church still maintain that it is a sin to be illegitimate. The world evolves peoples conscious awareness expands . There are a lot of gays to whom religion is important , who contribute to their local communities through the church. This all so medieval.

I do agree with you but thankfully today, what the church thinks about those kind of things doesn't equal what all of society thinks anymore

Irene Pearson · 13-12-2012, 03:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Christmas Neeve

I do agree with you but thankfully today, what the church thinks about those kind of things doesn't equal what all of society thinks anymore

It's hard cheese to the church members who are discriminated against though.

Kizzy · 13-12-2012, 03:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by King Moonracer

Well I suppose the problem is that the CofE are still technically the official Church in this country and we don't have complete separation of church and state, that makes the gay marriage question even more difficult because they are seen as conducting marriages on behalf of the state, and if they're against marrying same sex couples than it's problematic to legalise it

Don't start quoting sections of the Act of Settlement will you?

Marsh. · 13-12-2012, 03:21 PM

That's the nail on the head Irene, Christianity THEMSELVES have changed down the centuries. They haven't been forced to change.

If they are forced to include something from an outside party against their will then it ceases being a religion and set of beliefs that they choose to be a part of/believe in.

Effectively, non-Christians forcing Christians to accept and believe something they don't. Not really a religion then.

Irene Pearson · 13-12-2012, 03:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marshmallow

That's the nail on the head Irene, Christianity THEMSELVES have changed down the centuries. They haven't been forced to change.

If they are forced to include something from an outside party against their will then it ceases being a religion and set of beliefs that they choose to be a part of/believe in.

Effectively, non-Christians forcing Christians to accept and believe something they don't. Not really a religion then.

This came from within the church also Just as the inclusion of women in the priesthood. Wonder what the Pankhursts would make of that. These decisions have been made by males.

Marsh. · 13-12-2012, 03:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Irene Pearson

This came from within the church also Just as the inclusion of women in the priesthood. Wonder what the Pankhursts would make of that. These decisions have been made by males.

But you were talking about Christianity as a whole. That includes more than the CofE.