[bots]

Originally Posted by Livia

Women all over the world are suffering, but while people are saying that we're nearly there in this country, we're about to take a HUGE step backwards by opening up women only safe spaces to anyone with a penis who gets up that morning and identifies as a women. It's being sneaked through as law while we're arguing about whether the word feminism is acceptable. If you don't know about this issue, male or female, I suggest you go and look at it. And thank you Vicky, without you I would never have known about it.

This is both unbelievably serious and beyond any sane persons comprehension at the same time. How we have come to the point where this is being considered is beyond me.

[Niamh.]

Originally Posted by bitontheslide

This is both unbelievably serious and beyond any sane persons comprehension at the same time. How we have come to the point where this is being considered is beyond me.

The thing is no one seems to know about it like Livia pointed out, it's all very sneaky. Only for Vicky I wouldn't be aware of half of this stuff

[Vicky.]

Originally Posted by Niamh.

The thing is no one seems to know about it like Livia pointed out, it's all very sneaky. Only for Vicky I wouldn't be aware of half of this stuff

The womens aid thing was talked about on good morning britain this morning. With Piers Morgan on womens side. Bit oif an alternate universe

Apparently on Nick Ferraris show too..though I don;t know who he is. People are amazed he was on womens side too though, so I assume he is quite sexist generally

It is coming into mainstream, slowly, but its happening now. It has to, given how many people it will actually affect. And how many people are now standing up to say no. Geneally once someone becomes fully aware of quite whats happening, they will say no. Tories have realised this, so have backed off a bit. Labour have realised it, and do not care. They are actually going to be taken to court soon for this

[Vicky.]

Originally Posted by bitontheslide

This is both unbelievably serious and beyond any sane persons comprehension at the same time. How we have come to the point where this is being considered is beyond me.

Yes, many people when told about this nonense assume it is a joke as surely...noone is that stupid. But they are. It seems utterly unbelievable, but its really happening. Businesses are already acting as though self identification is law, allowing people to 'self declare' their sex..which means you can go from male to female day to day (or hour to hour) as you please. Fully intact men with penises are fighting for the right to use womens changing rooms (and winning too...as, its only women who will be disadvantaged). It does not really happen the other way around, but I am sure men do not want women in their changing rooms either!


I know it sounds ****ing mental.

[Vicky.]

Originally Posted by Livia

Women all over the world are suffering, but while people are saying that we're nearly there in this country, we're about to take a HUGE step backwards by opening up women only safe spaces to anyone with a penis who gets up that morning and identifies as a women. It's being sneaked through as law while we're arguing about whether the word feminism is acceptable. If you don't know about this issue, male or female, I suggest you go and look at it. And thank you Vicky, without you I would never have known about it.

Indeed. Feminism is needed now more than ever. Everything feminists have fought for for women for the past hundred years or so is under threat right now. Its not scaremongering, its true. Even the word woman is under attack ffs. The Tories appear to be backtracking on this absolutely ridiculous 'self identification' law that they were going to push through by stealth, but Labour are still planning on it, and have said so. Its absolutely mental. Its scary. And its stupid. But its true.

[Livia]

I would like to say something off-topic, bear with me mods.

I've so enjoyed taking part in this thread. I've not seen anyone melt down... it's been quite like old times.

[Niamh.]

Originally Posted by Livia

I would like to say something off-topic, bear with me mods.

I've so enjoyed taking part in this thread. I've not seen anyone melt down... it's been quite like old times.

Yes it's been a very dignified discussion tbf

[Vicky.]

I could rant all day about this, but will leave the thread for a bit else I will fill it up But yeah, sex is meaningless and not actually a real thing and places segregated by sex should not be segregated by sex. And males are actually female (and vice versa) simply on their say so.

[Livia]

Originally Posted by Vicky.

I could rant all day about this, but will leave the thread for a bit else I will fill it up But yeah, sex is meaningless and not actually a real thing and places segregated by sex should not be segregated by sex.

I think you should maybe consider starting a thread, Vicky. You know so much about it and it's so important that people know about it.

[Vicky.]

Originally Posted by Livia

I think you should maybe consider starting a thread, Vicky. You know so much about it and it's so important that people know about it.

I did start one about Labour electing a 19 year old male as their womans officer where I went into a lot of this. Have started a few on this issue actually. I started a thread about the serious threats I had recieved for donating to a fundraiser that was against self ID...my issue at the moment with this stuff (and why I tend to keep talk to PM now..though do sometimes have outbursts on the main board) is that they are already combing the net for social media accounts to link. I have had to delete a bunch of older posts incase they managed to link my account here to the other ones they have a spreadsheet on..there are entire groups of people trying to dox women who speak out about this, and unfortunately I am one of the ones on 'the list'. As I said I made a thread about that, but thought against it and deleted it as it may help them link this account to the others they have on their spreadsheet. So I need to try and control myself a bit when ranting about this, just incase. I THINK I have deleted all posts that mention where I actually live or anything that would make me identifiable...but I am not totally sure (as I cannot realistically go back over 55k posts) so I am a bit worried that I haven't. I have no issue talking about it. I do have an issue when they may take it a little further than the rape/death threats I have already recieved and actually turn up at my house or something :S If I didn't have the kids, this would not bother me, but I have to think about their safety too and these nutter are..well..extremist nutters.

I will think about it. Issue is, most papers and such are not reporting on it, the times does regular coverage but its paywalled. Daily mail does coverage sometimes but its..the daily mail and is often from an actual transphobic angle rather than pro-womens rights angle. Share tokens on the times only last for so long, and I don't think I am allowed to paste the entire article. And with no sources, I will be accused of making it up Hell even with sources sometimes I am accused of making it up

[Livia]

Originally Posted by Vicky.

I did start one about Labour electing a 19 year old male as their womans officer where I went into a lot of this. Have started a few on this issue actually. I started a thread about the serious threats I had recieved for donating to a fundraiser that was against self ID...my issue at the moment with this stuff (and why I tend to keep talk to PM now..though do sometimes have outbursts on the main board) is that they are already combing the net for social media accounts to link. I have had to delete a bunch of older posts incase they managed to link my account here to the other ones they have a spreadsheet on..there are entire groups of people trying to dox women who speak out about this, and unfortunately I am one of the ones on 'the list'. As I said I made a thread about that, but thought against it and deleted it as it may help them link this account to the others they have on their spreadsheet. So I need to try and control myself a bit when ranting about this, just incase. I THINK I have deleted all posts that mention where I actually live or anything that would make me identifiable...but I am not totally sure (as I cannot realistically go back over 55k posts) so I am a bit worried that I haven't. I have no issue talking about it. I do have an issue when they may take it a little further than the rape/death threats I have already recieved and actually turn up at my house or something :S If I didn't have the kids, this would not bother me, but I have to think about their safety too and these nutter are..well..extremist nutters.

I will think about it. Issue is, most papers and such are not reporting on it, the times does regular coverage but its paywalled. Daily mail does coverage sometimes but its..the daily mail and is often from an actual transphobic angle rather than pro-womens rights angle. Share tokens on the times only last for so long, and I don't think I am allowed to paste the entire article. And with no sources, I will be accused of making it up Hell even with sources sometimes I am accused of making it up

I hope people who are claiming, yeah, women in the West are doing okay and I don't like the word Feminist... read your post. How awful that a woman standing up for women is threatened with rape and murder.

I'd be happy to start a thread.... I'd need to discuss it with you first though.

[Vicky.]

In which rights do women have the upper hand?

[Vicky.]

And yes, people are treat poorly for a variety of reasons. But there is systematic sexism against women, like there is systematic racism against POC, and there is systematic homophobia against gay people. Single people are single people and are not responsible for the overwhelming sexism, racism and homophobia thats rampant in society, unless they themselves are sexist, racist, homophobic (and a lot of people are without realising it too..unconcious bias). But denying that disadvantaged groups are disadvantaged really does noone any favours.

[Marches]

Originally Posted by Vicky.

And yes, people are treat poorly for a variety of reasons. But there is systematic sexism against women, like there is systematic racism against POC, and there is systematic homophobia against gay people. Single people are single people and are not responsible for the overwhelming sexism, racism and homophobia thats rampant in society, unless they themselves are sexist, racist, homophobic (and a lot of people are without realising it too..unconcious bias). But denying that disadvantaged groups are disadvantaged really does noone any favours.

Everyone experiences systematic sexism to an extent. I could outline both sides but I think they should be pretty obvious

Also in response to ur post above, divorse settlements child custody battles access to domestic abuse shelters favoured in sexual abuse cases (in a lot men are often guilty until proven innocent)

[Vicky.]

Originally Posted by Marches

Everyone experiences systematic sexism to an extent. I could outline both sides but I think they should be pretty obvious

Also in response to ur post above, divorse settlements child custody battles access to domestic abuse shelters favoured in sexual abuse cases (in a lot men are often guilty until proven innocent)

Divorce settlements are usually because of child custody issues (ie whichever parent has custody of children will get the house, speaking broadly) which I will move onto in a sec

Child custody, again is not because of sex, its down to who, before the split, did the majority of childcare. Its to make sure the childrens lives are disrupted as little as possible. If more men did the lionshare of child related things, then they would win more custody battles. Luckily, with paternity leave and such being increased and more and more families being 'less traditional' (ie woman works, father is in the house) this will even out. But again, not disadvantaged due to sex. If me and my husband split tomorrow, he would 100% 'get the kids' if we ended up going through the courts.

Domestic abuse shelters yes. But this is because the majority of people needing shelters are women. There should be more for men of course but its a supply and demand thing tbh. I don't want to be hoping for more male victims of serious DV so that refuges are 50/50 tbh

Sexual abuse cases, wow. Near all sexual abuse is committed by men. And most get off with it. So not sure that proves your point at all. I completely disagree with guilty until proven innocent. But this very very rarely happens.

[Livia]

Originally Posted by Vicky.

Divorce settlements are usually because of child custody issues (ie whichever parent has custody of children will get the house, speaking broadly) which I will move onto in a sec

Child custody, again is not because of sex, its down to who, before the split, did the majority of childcare. Its to make sure the childrens lives are disrupted as little as possible. If more men did the lionshare of child related things, then they would win more custody battles. Luckily, with paternity leave and such being increased and more and more families being 'less traditional' (ie woman works, father is in the house) this will even out. But again, not disadvantaged due to sex. If me and my husband split tomorrow, he would 100% 'get the kids' if we ended up going through the courts.

Domestic abuse shelters yes. But this is because the majority of people needing shelters are women. There should be more for men of course but its a supply and demand thing tbh. I don't want to be hoping for more male victims of serious DV so that refuges are 50/50 tbh

Sexual abuse cases, wow. Near all sexual abuse is committed by men. And most get off with it. So not sure that proves your point at all. I completely disagree with guilty until proven innocent. But this very very rarely happens.

Shelters for battered women is always brought into the discussion, as is the fact that more is spent on breast cancer than on prostate cancer. The simple fact is that women fundraise for these causes. Yes a certain amount of funding is available... but I've been to countless dinners, bought loads of draw tickets etc., raising money for victims of domestic abuse, Breast Cancer Care... I drove a bloody tractor covered in pink bows a couple of years ago to raise money for breast cancer. I've never once been approached to contribute to any kind of fundraising that's been organised by men, for men.

[bots]

Originally Posted by Livia

Shelters for battered women is always brought into the discussion, as is the fact that more is spent on breast cancer than on prostate cancer. The simple fact is that women fundraise for these causes. Yes a certain amount of funding is available... but I've been to countless dinners, bought loads of draw tickets etc., raising money for victims of domestic abuse, Breast Cancer Care... I drove a bloody tractor covered in pink bows a couple of years ago to raise money for breast cancer. I've never once been approached to contribute to any kind of fundraising that's been organised by men, for men.

Happy to pass the tin round to collect for my visit to Hooters

[Vicky.]

Some members I get so wrong, I read them as very male and they turn out to be women. Others I read as female, and it turns out they are male. And some, I read as male, they claim they are female for ages and ages, and then it turns out they were male all along

I think avatars with newer members does this too. Once you get to know someone a bit more it seems more obvious...obviously. But I do tend to assume that those with male avatars are male and such, even when the avatars are of BB contestants.

[GoldHeart]

Originally Posted by Vicky.

Some members I get so wrong, I read them as very male and they turn out to be women. Others I read as female, and it turns out they are male. And some, I read as male, they claim they are female for ages and ages, and then it turns out they were male all along

I think avatars with newer members does this too. Once you get to know someone a bit more it seems more obvious...obviously. But I do tend to assume that those with male avatars are male and such, even when the avatars are of BB contestants.

My avatar is of Shane Lynch .

[Ashley.]

Originally Posted by Vicky.

Some members I get so wrong, I read them as very male and they turn out to be women. Others I read as female, and it turns out they are male. And some, I read as male, they claim they are female for ages and ages, and then it turns out they were male all along

I think avatars with newer members does this too. Once you get to know someone a bit more it seems more obvious...obviously. But I do tend to assume that those with male avatars are male and such, even when the avatars are of BB contestants.

I do this, too... Niamh will always be Conor McGregor, in my eyes.

[Niamh.]

Originally Posted by Ashley.

I do this, too... Niamh will always be Conor McGregor, in my eyes.

I'm Eddie Vedder these days Ashley

[Maru]

Feminism is still relevant. There are diseases that effect females predominantly for example, that are not well-understood and in many cases, not taken seriously... the movement in the foreground may not directly petition for these causes, but it does effect these things because seeing other women step forward to talk about specific wrongs in their world near them, it is empowering other women (in the background) to step forward and to fight for their own specific causes... interstitial cystitis for example, 9 of 10 patients are women. It used to be a 7 year average rate of diagnosis and it wasn't widely understood. Now even your average PCP knows what it is, takes it very seriously and there are more medications & treatments for it when there used to be very few (and expensive) options. A simple pill solves my problems... a vast majority of this is due to the fact there is such a supportive and active female community that has been pushing for treatment, who helped with FMLA, who put together organizations to help pay for the expensive treatments. I participated in a study for it and I honestly couldn't have gotten through without the incredible support system that came from the hospital and also online as there are many supportive communities as well.

Women's communities are the bomb, you know. I've always made sure to have a female-only board on any of the communities I ran. Usually the topics are boring enough to keep the men away even if they were to "sneak" in. On one forum I participated in several years ago, the women were a minority and so vulgar everytime a female topic came up... I discovered a hack that allowed anyone to create topics on unused forum ids (it was a custom CMS that someone did a sh*te job on), so I started a hidden women's section underneath their noses.

[Vicky.]

Well I learnt something from this thread. I thought cystitis was a female only illness for some reason. ****ing horrible condition. have not had it as an adult much but my god I suffered as a teen and I still remember the pain clearly.

[Vicky.]

Ew ew ew

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-42912529

I didn't want to make a new thread as what on earth would I put in the OP, but this is gross and it kind of fits in a thread thats moved onto if feminism is needed today in this country.

[Maru]

Originally Posted by Vicky.

Ew ew ew

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-42912529

I didn't want to make a new thread as what on earth would I put in the OP, but this is gross and it kind of fits in a thread thats moved onto if feminism is needed today in this country.

I shared this in a group chat a week or so ago and thought there was a silver-lining to this. I was worried about computers becoming too smart, i.e. they could identify us by our faces which means people can pull up all our pictures with our faces in it... Kinda glad they can make good fakes too now which means in a way is an unintended privacy mask since computer/camera footage won't be 100% trustworthy, especially if AI image/video reproduction becomes a common thing.

On the other hand, people can maybe now take our faces and create on the fly personal porn if they want and create "remakes" etc. Those NFL graphics were a bit uncanny for me during the Superbowl yesterday in terms of what they are able to generate overlays/reproductions of simple camera footage now. It's awe-inspiring, but it's obviously a double-edged sword.