Jeremy Corbyn the Labour Leader: Some Still Against him : a 2nd Jeremy Win 24/9/16

[bots]

Excellent points,well said.Wish I had said all that.

However it seems I should maybe just shut up as I seem to be getting told lately by several on here,I seem to know little and lack experience.
I live and breathe politics and have been out there listening to people moaning at what Labour isn't and what it should be, and that they will not vote Labour while Corbyn is leader too.

I am then pleased you sort of see my point that any split would see the Labour movement more likely out of govt for some considerable time at the very least.

I think what is behind things for some, the idea of a split being good for Labour,is only because it would in effect remove major opposition to the Conservatives.

The other disturbing thing in this is Corbyn's tie in with the momentum group. They are most certainly a nasty bunch and are completely in disregard of the law or democracy. They are busy signing people up, and using every underhand method available to fix the vote.

[kirklancaster]

I meant or let the Party Die


Put a Blair Labour MP up
to Corbyn

Sorry Arista - When I said that I agreed with BOTS, I meant the part of his comment about 'Threats' and certainly not about his coment that your 'gaffa tape' comment was "in bad taste", because I don't think it was.

I should have emboldened the part of his post which I agreed with - I usually do, but did not do so this time - my mistake.

Keep posting Arista - I for one, love your views and actually agree with most of them.

[kirklancaster]

The other disturbing thing in this is Corbyn's tie in with the momentum group. They are most certainly a nasty bunch and are completely in disregard of the law or democracy. They are busy signing people up, and using every underhand method available to fix the vote.

I have noted this too BOTS. This whole business of 'politics' - on both sides - becomes more sinister by the week.

[joeysteele]

The other disturbing thing in this is Corbyn's tie in with the momentum group. They are most certainly a nasty bunch and are completely in disregard of the law or democracy. They are busy signing people up, and using every underhand method available to fix the vote.

I am livid with them bots, they just ignore all they are told as to what others in the party are being told in the street stalls and at the doors that though many people like Corbyn he doesn't inspire and they won't think of voting Labour while he is leader..

They see Corbyn as great and that he has to stay.
There are signs of members moving away from Corbyn now but this public row on the scale it has been, has caused massive disillusionment.

For too many still at present it is a 'head in the sands' scenario sadly.
While the rest of us have our heads in our hands on this mess.

[Johnnyuk123]

I agree, arista is most wise. If arista was an mp the people of the uk would be heard and their decision respected 100% unlike like these gravy train mp's who are only interested in their own career prospects whilst ignoring the public's will.

[kirklancaster]

I agree, arista is most wise. If arista was an mp the people of the uk would be heard and their decision respected 100% unlike like these gravy train mp's who are only interested in their own career prospects whilst ignoring the public's will.

:laugh: Too TRUE Johnny. Perhaps Arista should stand for parliament - how about forming the REAL GREEN PARTY? :hee:

[DemolitionRed]

Every single Labour MP who has resigned this week ABSTAINED ON THE 2015 WELFARE BILL which made poor and disabled people pay for £12 billion more in cuts.

[joeysteele]

Every single Labour MP who has resigned this week ABSTAINED ON THE 2015 WELFARE BILL which made poor and disabled people pay for £12 billion more in cuts.

MPs have to appear responsible though DemRed.
Labour gets into bother for just voting against all legislation.

No all that is in a bill is necessarily bad, when it is a wide ranging bill as this was,to have voted against it totally would have opened up far more justifiable criticism of Labour.

I am not against welfare reform as long as it is fair and the sick, disabled and most vulnerable do not lose out and preferably gain.

I don't think the govt is going to be able to make all the cuts it desired to anyway and some of the welfare cuts were suspended after Ian Duncan Smiths departure and the new Works and Pensions secretary Stephen Crabb took over.

I do believe this govt is now seeing how hard it is to govern on such a controversial programme with only a 12 overall majority.

However, the bulk of these MPs have a right in my view to be furious at present.
I am as a party member.

True, with the Labour machine behind them admittedly but none-the-less a fact, those MPs won seats in a general election too, often holding on against the odds too.
They have a duty to do the very best for their constituents, not just party members.
A good leader of a party like the Labour party that has a MPs,from mild Conservative though to Liberal and then over the the far left in its ranks, has to be able to command respect from and unite across the board of them all and at least the majority.

Simply, this is something Jeremy cannot do,that has to be obvious to all now.
For any good leader and I do like Corbyn myself, one major quality needed is to know when it is the right time to hand over.
That time,sadly in my view,is now otherwise he does risk splitting the party and while it is also true, the party could lose members and supporters of Jeremy as to votes.

The need to gather votes from the wider electorate has to override that.
I have said endlessly, so many people say to us on the streets and at their doors when campaigning,they would consider voting for Labour but not while Corbyn is leader.

We heard that a lot in May last year as to Ed Miliband to and in fact voters didn't vote for him that we needed to.
I am only annoyed that these MPs just don't make the challenge and get on with it.
Rather than drawing this sorry state of affairs out even more and in the public domain too.

With this referendum, the Conservative party spit down the middle as to it,the govt struggling with a small overall majority too, it should be Labour that has the vision of being out of the EU and a plan for same, Labour should be setting the agenda and should also be a good margin ahead in polling.

It is doing none of those things, none, and that should be worrying for all Labour voters and is very much so for voters we have already lost.
Threatening also to deselect these MPs, who are the ones who actually won votes in a general election, will only add to the crazy messed up problems too.

[DemolitionRed]

the whole concept of the labour party to me is that it is inclusive of people from all walks of life. When it veers off in one direction or another, it alienates a significant proportion of its membership. Splitting the party by political view would be catastrophic to any future ambitions of forming a government. Equally, a leader too biased in one direction, who doesn't acknowledge or listen to the people he works with is a non starter. If you look at Tony Blair, he was able to be successful because he included and listened to people from the left of the party. Corbyn says he is inclusive but his actions say something very different

Tony Blair Appealed to to center right conservatives during a time when John Majors indecisive wishy washy leadership had everyone abandoning ship. This is exactly what’s happening now. The conservative party is in disarray and so the time is ripe to grab center ground with a fresh faced Labour Right leader.

Tony Blair didn't just want Labour lights, he wanted to grab the disillusioned conservatives and he wanted to grab the support of the right wing tabloids. Tony Blair became a super-star who put Labour on a new course of success and popularity and he did that because he was attractive to to main stream political thinkers. This is what our present Labour party believe they can do all over again.

The problem is, back in the 80's we had never seen a transformation of the Labour party. We are now in that great position of recognizing that New Labour utterly destroyed what the Labour party stood for. We are living in very different times.

Many voters have never seen a time when the leader of a party can connect with the working British people. Millions are sick of having to constantly put aside their own opinions and beliefs of what a Labour party should look like and this is why Corbyn has been such a rising star amongst working class Brits. He's a new voice for the people.

[arista]

I agree, arista is most wise. If arista was an mp the people of the uk would be heard and their decision respected 100% unlike like these gravy train mp's who are only interested in their own career prospects whilst ignoring the public's will.


Thank You Johnny

[DemolitionRed]

MPs have to appear responsible though DemRed.
Labour gets into bother for just voting against all legislation.

No all that is in a bill is necessarily bad, when it is a wide ranging bill as this was,to have voted against it totally would have opened up far more justifiable criticism of Labour.

I am not against welfare reform as long as it is fair and the sick, disabled and most vulnerable do not lose out and preferably gain.

I don't think the govt is going to be able to make all the cuts it desired to anyway and some of the welfare cuts were suspended after Ian Duncan Smiths departure and the new Works and Pensions secretary Stephen Crabb took over.

I do believe this govt is now seeing how hard it is to govern on such a controversial programme with only a 12 overall majority.

However, the bulk of these MPs have a right in my view to be furious at present.
I am as a party member.

True, with the Labour machine behind them admittedly but none-the-less a fact, those MPs won seats in a general election too, often holding on against the odds too.
They have a duty to do the very best for their constituents, not just party members.
A good leader of a party like the Labour party that has a MPs,from mild Conservative though to Liberal and then over the the far left in its ranks, has to be able to command respect from and unite across the board of them all and at least the majority.

Simply, this is something Jeremy cannot do,that has to be obvious to all now.
For any good leader and I do like Corbyn myself, one major quality needed is to know when it is the right time to hand over.
That time,sadly in my view,is now otherwise he does risk splitting the party and while it is also true, the party could lose members and supporters of Jeremy as to votes.

The need to gather votes from the wider electorate has to override that.
I have said endlessly, so many people say to us on the streets and at their doors when campaigning,they would consider voting for Labour but not while Corbyn is leader.

We heard that a lot in May last year as to Ed Miliband to and in fact voters didn't vote for him that we needed to.
I am only annoyed that these MPs just don't make the challenge and get on with it.
Rather than drawing this sorry state of affairs out even more and in the public domain too.

With this referendum, the Conservative party spit down the middle as to it,the govt struggling with a small overall majority too, it should be Labour that has the vision of being out of the EU and a plan for same, Labour should be setting the agenda and should also be a good margin ahead in polling.

It is doing none of those things, none, and that should be worrying for all Labour voters and is very much so for voters we have already lost.
Threatening also to deselect these MPs, who are the ones who actually won votes in a general election, will only add to the crazy messed up problems too.

If appearing responsible compromises the vulnerable then I want no part in that.
Blair would of apposed it because he didn’t want his party to be criticized. Do we want another one like him?

Before Thatcher the "old fashioned, traditional Conservative and Labour Party" were parties that both had a commitment to Keynsian economics. So, despite their differences they both had a commitment to welfare, the NHS, free education and housing.

Thatcher changed the Conservative parties commitment to Keynsian economics when she introduced free market economics/liberalism into the party and that changed the landscape from the early 80s until now. I think it would be much easier to have different parties in power if all had a commitment to housing, education and health, but since Thatcher the only commitment has been to people who make money, because that's what free market economics is about.

The Labour party is no longer in a position to please all of the people all of the time but that's exactly what they want to try and do. Can't you see that?

[DemolitionRed]

Angela Eagle leadership website registered days before she resigned.

https://inews.co.uk/essentials/news/uk/angela-eagle-leadership-website-registered-days-resigned/

[joeysteele]

If appearing responsible compromises the vulnerable then I want no part in that.
Blair would of apposed it because he didn’t want his party to be criticized. Do we want another one like him?

Before Thatcher the "old fashioned, traditional Conservative and Labour Party" were parties that both had a commitment to Keynsian economics. So, despite their differences they both had a commitment to welfare, the NHS, free education and housing.

Thatcher changed the Conservative parties commitment to Keynsian economics when she introduced free market economics/liberalism into the party and that changed the landscape from the early 80s until now. I think it would be much easier to have different parties in power if all had a commitment to housing, education and health, but since Thatcher the only commitment has been to people who make money, because that's what free market economics is about.

The Labour party is no longer in a position to please all of the people all of the time but that's exactly what they want to try and do. Can't you see that?

No one and no party can ever do that, we have not had a govt elected with even 50% of the vote for decades.
However Labour has to start pleasing a lot more than it is at present.

All I am seeing,all potential voters are seeing, and indeed all usual voters are seeing, is the membership of a major party at odds with its MPs over one individual.

Those MPs are getting told by their constituents they are losing votes likely with Corbyn at the head of them.
They have to act on that.

We have a leader who cannot command respect and indeed support from 75% of his MPs.
Contrast how Labour is going on with the Conservatives when they realised Ian Duncan Smith could not likely win an election for them.
He was gone quickly but then in time had a way back.

Jeremy has lost the support of all those MPs,they believe they are acting for their constituents and potential Labour voters.

Labour has to show it is and can be responsible, just blanket voting against all the govt does and brings forward shows at times petty party politics.
People are sick of that.

The membership have a duty to the Country too just as MPs do,in the end it is policies that matter and having the right person to deliver and convince the argument for those policies.
Most at present, although some are now, of the members are seeing that Jeremy cannot fulfil that role at all.
So is the best for Labour now to keep a leader who will certainly fail in my view,or hold onto many of his policies and find someone who can reach out more.

This whole mess is mad but should have been avoidable, the parliamentary MPs have to be led by someone who can lead them, if they cannot see anyway of supporting him now, then he should defuse this himself and accept he had a go but it hasn't worked.
That is the simple fact of the whole chaos and I hope more come to see that and really soon too.

As for Angela Eagle she has infuriated me again this morning, either do what she says she intends to, or shut up until she makes some concrete decision and stop procrastinating.

[DemolitionRed]

No one and no party can ever do that, we have not had a govt elected with even 50% of the vote for decades.
However Labour has to start pleasing a lot more than it is at present.

All I am seeing,all potential voters are seeing, and indeed all usual voters are seeing, is the membership of a major party at odds with its MPs over one individual.

Those MPs are getting told by their constituents they are losing votes likely with Corbyn at the head of them.
They have to act on that.

We have a leader who cannot command respect and indeed support from 75% of his MPs.
Contrast how Labour is going on with the Conservatives when they realised Ian Duncan Smith could not likely win an election for them.
He was gone quickly but then in time had a way back.

Jeremy has lost the support of all those MPs,they believe they are acting for their constituents and potential Labour voters.

Labour has to show it is and can be responsible, just blanket voting against all the govt does and brings forward shows at times petty party politics.
People are sick of that.

The membership have a duty to the Country too just as MPs do,in the end it is policies that matter and having the right person to deliver and convince the argument for those policies.
Most at present, although some are now, of the members are seeing that Jeremy cannot fulfil that role at all.
So is the best for Labour now to keep a leader who will certainly fail in my view,or hold onto many of his policies and find someone who can reach out more.

This whole mess is mad but should have been avoidable, the parliamentary MPs have to be led by someone who can lead them, if they cannot see anyway of supporting him now, then he should defuse this himself and accept he had a go but it hasn't worked.
That is the simple fact of the whole chaos and I hope more come to see that and really soon too.

As for Angela Eagle she has infuriated me again this morning, either do what she says she intends to, or shut up until she makes some concrete decision and stop procrastinating.

The conservatives along with Labour Right and just about every newspaper we could lay our hands on, were not going to give Corbyn a platform. Corbyn came to power through social media alone, so regardless of his antagonists, the energy of those social media campaigns became hugely visible and significant.

According to John McDonnell 60,000 new members joined the Labour Party directly after Brexit but this is how its been going since Corbyn took the Labour lead. Wherever that man touches down Labour membership sours. Labour membership has quadrupled because people who were once wary of the Labour Party because of past bitter experience, felt compelled by this ‘no nonsense straight talking guy.

What’s actually happening is, the traditional Conservative Party are disgruntled and so they are turning to Labour Right. Labour Right want the monopoly and that includes all those Conservatives who want to jump ship. This is exactly what happened with Tony Blair, its like history repeating itself.
It beggars belief that this waffling unconvincing lot are so dethatched from what Corbyn has achieved in a year. :conf:

If you read the papers or watch the news channels you may believe that Corbyn can’t fulfill his role but if you spend any time on social media, his support from Labour supporters is still massive and growing.

The architects of this coup may be more robust intellectually. They may give the impression that they are an efficient well oiled machine but not one of them has the ability to give a straight answer to a simple question. None of them can speak convincingly or persuade me to justify the abandonment of Corbyn. I'm proud of the millions who still stand behind Corbyn and his principles; a man who can bring power to the people.

[joeysteele]

The conservatives along with Labour Right and just about every newspaper we could lay our hands on, were not going to give Corbyn a platform. Corbyn came to power through social media alone, so regardless of his antagonists, the energy of those social media campaigns became hugely visible and significant.

According to John McDonnell 60,000 new members joined the Labour Party directly after Brexit but this is how its been going since Corbyn took the Labour lead. Wherever that man touches down Labour membership sours. Labour membership has quadrupled because people who were once wary of the Labour Party because of past bitter experience, felt compelled by this ‘no nonsense straight talking guy.

What’s actually happening is, the traditional Conservative Party are disgruntled and so they are turning to Labour Right. Labour Right want the monopoly and that includes all those Conservatives who want to jump ship. This is exactly what happened with Tony Blair, its like history repeating itself.
It beggars belief that this waffling unconvincing lot are so dethatched from what Corbyn has achieved in a year. :conf:

If you read the papers or watch the news channels you may believe that Corbyn can’t fulfill his role but if you spend any time on social media, his support from Labour supporters is still massive and growing.

The architects of this coup may be more robust intellectually. They may give the impression that they are an efficient well oiled machine but not one of them has the ability to give a straight answer to a simple question. None of them can speak convincingly or persuade me to justify the abandonment of Corbyn. I'm proud of the millions who still stand behind Corbyn and his principles; a man who can bring power to the people.

What honestly has he achieved.

What can labour workers and MPs really offer those who haven't voted Labour since 2001,remember Labour only got around 35% of votes cast in 2005.

We are actually worse now, in the local elections which weren't as bad for Labour as they could have been admittedly but the average voting figure across the UK was 31%,we are doing worse.

There have been 4 by elections, all with exceptional candidates and good results but 3 in usually safe labour seats.
In Tooting however the Conservative vote only fell 4% from may last year.
That will not help Labour win an election.

The London Mayor election saw Sadiq Khan distance himself from Corbyn and then Khan began presenting his vision of what Labour should be and standing for, different to Corbyns.

Although Labour only lost one seat in Wales,the vote was down and we lost votes to UKIP.

So please, what has he achieved, at best we are standing still and at worst moving further away from badly needed potential voters.

He is a decent and good man, sometimes though, that is not enough,he is sadly now, as someone said,like a football manager whose players won't play for him,that manager would be gone sharpish and sadly,I feel Corbyn has to dwell seriously on going too.
For the good of not only the party but the Country too who need a strong united Labour party, not one in this chaos.

[kirklancaster]

Every single Labour MP who has resigned this week ABSTAINED ON THE 2015 WELFARE BILL which made poor and disabled people pay for £12 billion more in cuts.

I did not know this Red. It kind of 'paints its own picture' - still, it will be consigned to the overflowing TIBB dustbin as yet another FACT not recognised by some.

[kirklancaster]

Tony Blair Appealed to to center right conservatives during a time when John Majors indecisive wishy washy leadership had everyone abandoning ship. This is exactly what’s happening now. The conservative party is in disarray and so the time is ripe to grab center ground with a fresh faced Labour Right leader.

Tony Blair didn't just want Labour lights, he wanted to grab the disillusioned conservatives and he wanted to grab the support of the right wing tabloids. Tony Blair became a super-star who put Labour on a new course of success and popularity and he did that because he was attractive to to main stream political thinkers. This is what our present Labour party believe they can do all over again.

The problem is, back in the 80's we had never seen a transformation of the Labour party. We are now in that great position of recognizing that New Labour utterly destroyed what the Labour party stood for. We are living in very different times.

Many voters have never seen a time when the leader of a party can connect with the working British people. Millions are sick of having to constantly put aside their own opinions and beliefs of what a Labour party should look like and this is why Corbyn has been such a rising star amongst working class Brits. He's a new voice for the people.

:clap1::clap1::clap1:Brilliant post.

[kirklancaster]

What honestly has he achieved.

What can labour workers and MPs really offer those who haven't voted Labour since 2001,remember Labour only got around 35% of votes cast in 2005.

We are actually worse now, in the local elections which weren't as bad for Labour as they could have been admittedly but the average voting figure across the UK was 31%,we are doing worse.

There have been 4 by elections, all with exceptional candidates and good results but 3 in usually safe labour seats.
In Tooting however the Conservative vote only fell 4% from may last year.
That will not help Labour win an election.

The London Mayor election saw Sadiq Khan distance himself from Corbyn and then Khan began presenting his vision of what Labour should be and standing for, different to Corbyns.

Although Labour only lost one seat in Wales,the vote was down and we lost votes to UKIP.

So please, what has he achieved, at best we are standing still and at worst moving further away from badly needed potential voters.

He is a decent and good man, sometimes tough, that is not enough,he is sadly now, as someone said,like a football manager whose players won't play for him,that manager would be gone sharpish and sadly,I feel Corbyn has to dwell seriously on going too.
For the good of not only the party but the Country too who need a strong united Labour party, not one in this chaos.

If Corbyn represents TRUE socialism - which he does - but Labour MP's do NOT embrace him -- which they won't - then WHO are the fakes here?

The 'Labour Party' cannot be THE 'Labour Party' but must instead be something else MASQUERADING as Labour.

WTF good is an opposition party which adopts pale imitations of Tory policies, and cultivates an image which is but a pale imitation of the tories, in order to court popularity?

At least Corbyn IS honest.

[joeysteele]

If Corbyn represents TRUE socialism - which he does - but Labour MP's do NOT embrace him -- which they won't - then WHO are the fakes here?

The 'Labour Party' cannot be THE 'Labour Party' but must instead be something else MASQUERADING as Labour.

WTF good is an opposition party which adopts pale imitations of Tory policies, and cultivates an image which is but a pale imitation of the tories, in order to court popularity?

At least Corbyn IS honest.

Does honesty get you anywhere in politics, really.

Are you actually going to say that Labour has any hope at all under Corbyn's leadership, I now feel sure it hasn't.

A party has to move to the voters or it gets nowhere, that does not mean giving up on the ideals of the party but to adjust to peoples needs within the framework of those ideals.

Even in govt parties have to address the changing concerns of voters too,otherwise they risk losing the next election.

Out of power all a party can do is protest,if it cannot win power then it cannot do anything.

This Conservative govt had to adapt to the change of the voters as to this referendum,thanks to Farage's determination on same.
It never really wanted to have one but by it doing so it does not make it UKIP.

Ideals, visions they are what a party needs,then the policies to go with both, more importantly it needs someone to be able to reach out and communicate those ideals, vision and policies.
Sorry but for me now, Corbyn is not the one who can effectively deliver that message.

[bots]

At least Corbyn IS honest.

I don't see any honesty from Corbyn at all ... very dishonest if you ask me. He pretends to be something he is not, over and over again. He preaches inclusiveness yet wants to expel mp's from the party that don't agree with him. The guy is a snake.

[DemolitionRed]

What has Corbyn achieved (and btw I can’t believe you are asking me this)

He won the Labour leadership and sorted out the huge upheaval within his own party, who were dust btw.

He has made the Labour party grow from some floundering lame duck into something that feels like a real threat to the main apposing party.

He stopped Government proposed police cuts after the Paris attack

He argued passionately against this new welfare bill on family tax credit and ralled MP’s to oppose and defeat the Government.

He had an equally significant victory on disability benefits.

He altered public opinion on welfare spending and launched a new economics alternative that has received massive praise from political economists.

He has woken a nation up to the horrors of the Saudi justice system and how Cameron wanted the UK to fund and operate prisons that facilitate execution and torture.

He has brought about a massive boost in party membership. The Tory conference in Manchester had 2,000 people; the Labour conference in Manchester had over 8,000 people. The Labour conference in Manchester before Corbyn had less than 1,000 members.

He defeated criticism and bullying by campaigning with the people of Britain.

The Fire Brigades Union, which had previously abandoned Labour had 38,000 members who supported Corbyn’s successful bid for the top job and made the vote at a special conference in Blackpool.

He changed the use of PM question time to include the common man in the street.

He has set out a policy to re-nationalize railways and has gained support from the Tory government.

He had the first shadow cabinet where women outnumbered men.

[DemolitionRed]

Lets see how much this next mutley crew do in the same space of time.

[joeysteele]

What has Corbyn achieved (and btw I can’t believe you are asking me this)

He won the Labour leadership and sorted out the huge upheaval within his own party, who were dust btw.

He has made the Labour party grow from some floundering lame duck into something that feels like a real threat to the main apposing party.

He stopped Government proposed police cuts after the Paris attack

He argued passionately against this new welfare bill on family tax credit and ralled MP’s to oppose and defeat the Government.

He had an equally significant victory on disability benefits.

He altered public opinion on welfare spending and launched a new economics alternative that has received massive praise from political economists.

He has woken a nation up to the horrors of the Saudi justice system and how Cameron wanted the UK to fund and operate prisons that facilitate execution and torture.

He has brought about a massive boost in party membership. The Tory conference in Manchester had 2,000 people; the Labour conference in Manchester had over 8,000 people. The Labour conference in Manchester before Corbyn had less than 1,000 members.

He defeated criticism and bullying by campaigning with the people of Britain.

The Fire Brigades Union, which had previously abandoned Labour had 38,000 members who supported Corbyn’s successful bid for the top job and made the vote at a special conference in Blackpool.

He changed the use of PM question time to include the common man in the street.

He has set out a policy to re-nationalize railways and has gained support from the Tory government.

He had the first shadow cabinet where women outnumbered men.

I do not deny in part he has contributed to all that but so equally have the rest of the Labour party's MPs and also public opinion too.
All that cannot just be credited to him.

What does not change however is that he now has the party at a point where it could split apart, and that is at any time the worst scenario for any party to be in and for its leader to let it happen too.

He should never have had the party at this point at all if he was capable of the hard and strong leadership needed.

It has never been the easiest of jobs to lead the Labour party but nowhere in its history since Ramsey McDonald has a leader so lost his parliamentary party's support.
172 of 231 MPs, with only 40 backing him, said they had 'no confidence' in his leadership.

No one can or should, in my view, carry on in the face of that dissent, no one.
I cannot think of any other party where a leader would either.

[arista]

Corbyn Stages Fightback With Facebook Video

http://news.sky.com/story/1721509/corbyn-stages-fightback-with-facebook-video

[Crimson Dynamo]

Wednesday will be fun

[arista]

Wednesday will be fun




Yes So nice of Unions to come in
and sort out the Right Wingers


Put a Fecker Up - New Stinking Labour

[DemolitionRed]

The Labour party was looking incredibly healthy until shortly after Brexit. I really hope the party devides and those of us who support Corbyn can carry on as usual. If that doesn’t happen then I, along with all the others will be withdrawing my labour membership.

[DemolitionRed]

If anyone doesn't think Corbyn's a tough cookie, I'll only say, most of us couldn't cope with this level of bullying and still walk with our head held high.

[kirklancaster]

Wednesday will be fun

:laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh:: laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh: NO - I'm not pissing myself at your post, just your new avatar which I have ONLY just twigged. :joker: You are mental. :laugh:

[Livia]

I see Corbyn has finally apologised in front of the Home Affairs Committee for referring to Hezbollah and Hamas as "friends". This after seven years of trying to justify the comments.

[arista]

I see Corbyn has finally apologised in front of the Home Affairs Committee for referring to Hezbollah and Hamas as "friends". This after seven years of trying to justify the comments.


Yes he said he was Very Sorry

[Northern Monkey]

Does'nt look like Corbyn will even get enough nominations to even get on the ballot paper for a leadership battle.All depends on the small print of the Labour constitution.

[arista]

Does'nt look like Corbyn will even get enough nominations to even get on the ballot paper for a leadership battle.All depends on the small print of the Labour constitution.

No he is Auto on it
No Remix permitted.


But New Blair Labour is scared
of putting someone up against Corbyn
They are Chicken.
Cowards

[Northern Monkey]

No he is Auto on it
No Remix permitted.


But New Blair Labour is scared
of putting someone up against Corbyn
They are Chicken.
Cowards

Oh really?I'm one day behind on Daily Politics.BBC1HD

[arista]

Oh really?I'm one day behind on Daily Politics.BBC1HD


Its BBC2HD
infact
I watched it.


They talk of options


NOT FACT

[Vicky.]

If anyone doesn't think Corbyn's a tough cookie, I'll only say, most of us couldn't cope with this level of bullying and still walk with our head held high.

Indeed. The MPs behind this are a ****ing disgrace. Even moreso when you find out its been planned for ****ing ages too...yet they are trying to make out it was his 'weak' performance in the whole Brexit thing. Brexit was **** all to do with which party you supported anyway, he could have kissed the feet of every labour voter and it would have made not a jot of difference

[Northern Monkey]

Its BBC2HD
infact
I watched it.


They talk of options


NOT FACT

Yes you are most wise it is BBC2HD.My bad.

[Vicky.]

Don't think I have ever watched BBC2 in my whole life...

[arista]

Indeed. The MPs behind this are a ****ing disgrace. Even moreso when you find out its been planned for ****ing ages too...yet they are trying to make out it was his 'weak' performance in the whole Brexit thing. Brexit was **** all to do with which party you supported anyway, he could have kissed the feet of every labour voter and it would have made not a jot of difference


You Are Most Wise Vicky

Fecking Corrurpt New Blair Labour

[kirklancaster]

Don't think I have ever watched BBC2 in my whole life...

Some of the best BBC programmes are on BBC 2, 3, & 4 Vicky.

[arista]

Don't think I have ever watched BBC2 in my whole life...


You would have
but times moves on

[DemolitionRed]

A tough going but interesting read about the connection between the Chilcot report and the attempted defenestration of Corbyn. http://www.commondreams.org/views/2016/07/06/most-labour-mps-opposing-corbyn-are-stained-blood-iraq

[arista]

A tough going but interesting read about the connection between the Chilcot report and the attempted defenestration of Corbyn. http://www.commondreams.org/views/2016/07/06/most-labour-mps-opposing-corbyn-are-stained-blood-iraq



Yes New Blair Labour Pro Invasion and Bombers
except on Syria when Dave wanted to take out
the Leader there
Before Isis grew , etc.

[the truth]

corbyn is here to stay, his speech yesterday was munificent

[joeysteele]

corbyn is here to stay, his speech yesterday was munificent

I think it was superb, this is when he really is at his best.

[arista]

JC live now bbcnewshd


In Durnam

[arista]

Angela Eagle Will now Stand against Corbyn
on MONDAY

LBC LIVE

[joeysteele]

Angela Eagle Will now Stand against Corbyn
on MONDAY

LBC LIVE

Is this another false dawn from her, what too is the point,since who in the party 'really' wants her as leader anyway.

[the truth]

Angela Eagle Will now Stand against Corbyn
on MONDAY

LBC LIVE

she voted for every war, shes a vile corporate loving, warmongering neo liberal blairite

[joeysteele]

she voted for every war, shes a vile corporate loving, warmongering neo liberal blairite

She will lose if Jeremy Corbyn is on the ballot paper and he is standing firm it seems as to that.

If he does resign and I doubt that really, then she will be beaten by others who stand anyway.

I see no point in her doing it and if she cries wolf again this time and doesn't force a leadership contest, she will be an even bigger laughing stock than she has made herself to be already over the last week or so.

[arista]

she voted for every war, shes a vile corporate loving, warmongering neo liberal blairite


Yes no one Likes that Woman
Eagle

[DemolitionRed]

Angela Eagle Will now Stand against Corbyn
on MONDAY

LBC LIVE

I work with a guy who’s daughter works for Angela Eagle. I asked him what she thought of her. He answered “she thinks she’s a effing nutter but then my daughter is a left wing thinker and Eagle most certainly isn't.”

[arista]

http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2016/07/09/12/2CF01C8C00000578-3682047-image-a-26_1468064870763.jpg
Tom Watson has stopped the union

[Jack_]

It is just absurd that this stupid woman thinks she's anymore electable than Jeremy Corbyn is.

I'm appalled by what the PLP have done to this party over the last couple of weeks. At a time when the Tories should be being lambasted for the mess they have led us into and what they're about to inflict on the poorest and most vulnerable, these people launch an attack that's been planned for several months on a leader who was democratically elected overwhelmingly by the party's membership. They deliberately leak resignations out one by one over several hours so the news cycle is diluted by this mess and make the party look like a laughing stock, it is disgraceful. They then spend well over a week making several claims about how they're going to challenge Corbyn for the leadership only to then backtrack, and in the meantime seek legal advice on how to keep a sitting leader off of the ballot - all while rallies are being organised in his name and multiple CLP's (including Angela Eagle's) declare their support for him.

Here's where I stand. If he isn't on the ballot, I, and I expect several thousand others will be revoking our membership - it really won't go down well at all. If he is challenged and loses, then I'll accept the democratic result and move on. But quite frankly I'm struggling to see how Eagle and the PLP thinks she can win. She voted in favour of the Iraq war and air strikes in Syria and and just days after Chilcot they really think that's going to go down well with Labour Party members? There are over 130 MPs who didn't vote for Iraq, they could've at least fielded a better candidate.

Is Jeremy in any position to win an election right now? No. But nor would Angela Eagle be. Five years is a long time in politics and this is a movement. A movement that is taking Labour back to its rightful roots and addressing the concerns of many that have been ignored for years with actual real answers, as opposed to xenophobic nonsense populism that's been allowed to fester of late. There's a reason why Labour are losing support to UKIP and it's because the same problems aren't being addressed with the correct answers.

I know there's talk of an early general election and either way it isn't in Labour's interest right now. If one is called, neither Corbyn nor Eagle is going to win so all of this will have been absolutely pointless and sought only to drag the party's name through the mud at a time when they should've been attacking the government.

This country has been crying out for two distinct opposing parties for over two decades. The Tories and Labour being a cigarette paper in difference helps nobody and just encourages 'all politicians and parties are the same' sentiments from those who are already apathetic. There needs to be a stark difference. If you want austerity, if you want inequality, if you want the decimation of public services, then vote for the god damn Tories. Having an opposition who offers a 'lite' manifesto of all of this is terrible for British politics. I would much rather lose another election than for a Labour government to be elected to enact a watered down version of the same policies. It is power for powers sake and it is pointlessly appalling.

This inevitable leadership election needs to hurry the hell up and finish already.

[DemolitionRed]

Have you ever considered ‘Speakers Corner’ Jack? If not, you should. For me at least, your post touched all the right buttons.

[joeysteele]

It is just absurd that this stupid woman thinks she's anymore electable than Jeremy Corbyn is.

I'm appalled by what the PLP have done to this party over the last couple of weeks. At a time when the Tories should be being lambasted for the mess they have led us into and what they're about to inflict on the poorest and most vulnerable, these people launch an attack that's been planned for several months on a leader who was democratically elected overwhelmingly by the party's membership. They deliberately leak resignations out one by one over several hours so the news cycle is diluted by this mess and make the party look like a laughing stock, it is disgraceful. They then spend well over a week making several claims about how they're going to challenge Corbyn for the leadership only to then backtrack, and in the meantime seek legal advice on how to keep a sitting leader off of the ballot - all while rallies are being organised in his name and multiple CLP's (including Angela Eagle's) declare their support for him.

Here's where I stand. If he isn't on the ballot, I, and I expect several thousand others will be revoking our membership - it really won't go down well at all. If he is challenged and loses, then I'll accept the democratic result and move on. But quite frankly I'm struggling to see how Eagle and the PLP thinks she can win. She voted in favour of the Iraq war and air strikes in Syria and and just days after Chilcot they really think that's going to go down well with Labour Party members? There are over 130 MPs who didn't vote for Iraq, they could've at least fielded a better candidate.

Is Jeremy in any position to win an election right now? No. But nor would Angela Eagle be. Five years is a long time in politics and this is a movement. A movement that is taking Labour back to its rightful roots and addressing the concerns of many that have been ignored for years with actual real answers, as opposed to xenophobic nonsense populism that's been allowed to fester of late. There's a reason why Labour are losing support to UKIP and it's because the same problems aren't being addressed with the correct answers.

I know there's talk of an early general election and either way it isn't in Labour's interest right now. If one is called, neither Corbyn nor Eagle is going to win so all of this will have been absolutely pointless and sought only to drag the party's name through the mud at a time when they should've been attacking the government.

This country has been crying out for two distinct opposing parties for over two decades. The Tories and Labour being a cigarette paper in difference helps nobody and just encourages 'all politicians and parties are the same' sentiments from those who are already apathetic. There needs to be a stark difference. If you want austerity, if you want inequality, if you want the decimation of public services, then vote for the god damn Tories. Having an opposition who offers a 'life' manifesto of all of this is terrible for British politics. I would much rather lose another election than for a Labour government to be elected to enact a watered down version of the same policies. It is power for powers sake and it is pointlessly appalling.

This inevitable leadership election needs to hurry the hell up and finish already.

Brilliant post, really.

Sums up so much and the points are all totally valid ones.

[Northern Monkey]

It is just absurd that this stupid woman thinks she's anymore electable than Jeremy Corbyn is.

I'm appalled by what the PLP have done to this party over the last couple of weeks. At a time when the Tories should be being lambasted for the mess they have led us into and what they're about to inflict on the poorest and most vulnerable, these people launch an attack that's been planned for several months on a leader who was democratically elected overwhelmingly by the party's membership. They deliberately leak resignations out one by one over several hours so the news cycle is diluted by this mess and make the party look like a laughing stock, it is disgraceful. They then spend well over a week making several claims about how they're going to challenge Corbyn for the leadership only to then backtrack, and in the meantime seek legal advice on how to keep a sitting leader off of the ballot - all while rallies are being organised in his name and multiple CLP's (including Angela Eagle's) declare their support for him.

Here's where I stand. If he isn't on the ballot, I, and I expect several thousand others will be revoking our membership - it really won't go down well at all. If he is challenged and loses, then I'll accept the democratic result and move on. But quite frankly I'm struggling to see how Eagle and the PLP thinks she can win. She voted in favour of the Iraq war and air strikes in Syria and and just days after Chilcot they really think that's going to go down well with Labour Party members? There are over 130 MPs who didn't vote for Iraq, they could've at least fielded a better candidate.

Is Jeremy in any position to win an election right now? No. But nor would Angela Eagle be. Five years is a long time in politics and this is a movement. A movement that is taking Labour back to its rightful roots and addressing the concerns of many that have been ignored for years with actual real answers, as opposed to xenophobic nonsense populism that's been allowed to fester of late. There's a reason why Labour are losing support to UKIP and it's because the same problems aren't being addressed with the correct answers.

I know there's talk of an early general election and either way it isn't in Labour's interest right now. If one is called, neither Corbyn nor Eagle is going to win so all of this will have been absolutely pointless and sought only to drag the party's name through the mud at a time when they should've been attacking the government.

This country has been crying out for two distinct opposing parties for over two decades. The Tories and Labour being a cigarette paper in difference helps nobody and just encourages 'all politicians and parties are the same' sentiments from those who are already apathetic. There needs to be a stark difference. If you want austerity, if you want inequality, if you want the decimation of public services, then vote for the god damn Tories. Having an opposition who offers a 'lite' manifesto of all of this is terrible for British politics. I would much rather lose another election than for a Labour government to be elected to enact a watered down version of the same policies. It is power for powers sake and it is pointlessly appalling.

This inevitable leadership election needs to hurry the hell up and finish already.Now i am no fan of Corbyn at all but this is a cracking post.

[arista]

Now i am no fan of Corbyn at all but this is a cracking post.


Corbyn is Labour


http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2016/07/09/13/35F6F94200000578-3682047-image-m-42_1468066197189.jpg
This is Angela "WarMonger " Eagle
NewBlairLabour

On Monday she claims she is Standing
for the Internal NEW BLAIR Election



Bring In On
Bitch

[arista]

[It is just absurd that this stupid woman thinks she's anymore electable than Jeremy Corbyn is.]

But Jack
she is NewBlairLabour

They get like that

Feel The Force

[arista]

"I would much rather lose another election than for a Labour government to be elected to enact a watered down version of the same policies."

But Jack they did that Twice
whith Blair

Why do they not Learn?

[arista]

http://e3.365dm.com/16/07/536x302/ce00d3d7365188798aab20a7c2e9e5dcaa8679268c8c888aef 494a9c95e798af_3741044.jpg?20160709222547
2 shaggs/ 2 jags Prescott - its a bit LATE

[arista]

Tomorrow is D Day

Will the Stinking Corrupt Lawyers
Spit it Out

Can JC stand against War Monger Eagle??????

[joeysteele]

I am fed up at the slow movement of the NEC to rule on this, for goodness sake, surely they can make a decision quickly on their own rules.
Pathetic.

[kirklancaster]

It is just absurd that this stupid woman thinks she's anymore electable than Jeremy Corbyn is.

I'm appalled by what the PLP have done to this party over the last couple of weeks. At a time when the Tories should be being lambasted for the mess they have led us into and what they're about to inflict on the poorest and most vulnerable, these people launch an attack that's been planned for several months on a leader who was democratically elected overwhelmingly by the party's membership. They deliberately leak resignations out one by one over several hours so the news cycle is diluted by this mess and make the party look like a laughing stock, it is disgraceful. They then spend well over a week making several claims about how they're going to challenge Corbyn for the leadership only to then backtrack, and in the meantime seek legal advice on how to keep a sitting leader off of the ballot - all while rallies are being organised in his name and multiple CLP's (including Angela Eagle's) declare their support for him.

Here's where I stand. If he isn't on the ballot, I, and I expect several thousand others will be revoking our membership - it really won't go down well at all. If he is challenged and loses, then I'll accept the democratic result and move on. But quite frankly I'm struggling to see how Eagle and the PLP thinks she can win. She voted in favour of the Iraq war and air strikes in Syria and and just days after Chilcot they really think that's going to go down well with Labour Party members? There are over 130 MPs who didn't vote for Iraq, they could've at least fielded a better candidate.

Is Jeremy in any position to win an election right now? No. But nor would Angela Eagle be. Five years is a long time in politics and this is a movement. A movement that is taking Labour back to its rightful roots and addressing the concerns of many that have been ignored for years with actual real answers, as opposed to xenophobic nonsense populism that's been allowed to fester of late. There's a reason why Labour are losing support to UKIP and it's because the same problems aren't being addressed with the correct answers.

I know there's talk of an early general election and either way it isn't in Labour's interest right now. If one is called, neither Corbyn nor Eagle is going to win so all of this will have been absolutely pointless and sought only to drag the party's name through the mud at a time when they should've been attacking the government.

This country has been crying out for two distinct opposing parties for over two decades. The Tories and Labour being a cigarette paper in difference helps nobody and just encourages 'all politicians and parties are the same' sentiments from those who are already apathetic. There needs to be a stark difference. If you want austerity, if you want inequality, if you want the decimation of public services, then vote for the god damn Tories. Having an opposition who offers a 'lite' manifesto of all of this is terrible for British politics. I would much rather lose another election than for a Labour government to be elected to enact a watered down version of the same policies. It is power for powers sake and it is pointlessly appalling.

This inevitable leadership election needs to hurry the hell up and finish already.

:clap1::clap1::clap1: Brilliantly written.

[arista]

I am fed up at the slow movement of the NEC to rule on this, for goodness sake, surely they can make a decision quickly on their own rules.
Pathetic.



Yes its like they are Still Corrupting it

We never had this Run around
with T. May

In Power Tomorrow
Next Election 2020 (she has stuck with that from day one)

Bliss

[arista]

:clap1::clap1::clap1: Brilliantly written.



He is the ORIGINAL Jack
don't you know Kirk

[Cherie]

It is just absurd that this stupid woman thinks she's anymore electable than Jeremy Corbyn is.

I'm appalled by what the PLP have done to this party over the last couple of weeks. At a time when the Tories should be being lambasted for the mess they have led us into and what they're about to inflict on the poorest and most vulnerable, these people launch an attack that's been planned for several months on a leader who was democratically elected overwhelmingly by the party's membership. They deliberately leak resignations out one by one over several hours so the news cycle is diluted by this mess and make the party look like a laughing stock, it is disgraceful. They then spend well over a week making several claims about how they're going to challenge Corbyn for the leadership only to then backtrack, and in the meantime seek legal advice on how to keep a sitting leader off of the ballot - all while rallies are being organised in his name and multiple CLP's (including Angela Eagle's) declare their support for him.

Here's where I stand. If he isn't on the ballot, I, and I expect several thousand others will be revoking our membership - it really won't go down well at all. If he is challenged and loses, then I'll accept the democratic result and move on. But quite frankly I'm struggling to see how Eagle and the PLP thinks she can win. She voted in favour of the Iraq war and air strikes in Syria and and just days after Chilcot they really think that's going to go down well with Labour Party members? There are over 130 MPs who didn't vote for Iraq, they could've at least fielded a better candidate.

Is Jeremy in any position to win an election right now? No. But nor would Angela Eagle be. Five years is a long time in politics and this is a movement. A movement that is taking Labour back to its rightful roots and addressing the concerns of many that have been ignored for years with actual real answers, as opposed to xenophobic nonsense populism that's been allowed to fester of late. There's a reason why Labour are losing support to UKIP and it's because the same problems aren't being addressed with the correct answers.

I know there's talk of an early general election and either way it isn't in Labour's interest right now. If one is called, neither Corbyn nor Eagle is going to win so all of this will have been absolutely pointless and sought only to drag the party's name through the mud at a time when they should've been attacking the government.

This country has been crying out for two distinct opposing parties for over two decades. The Tories and Labour being a cigarette paper in difference helps nobody and just encourages 'all politicians and parties are the same' sentiments from those who are already apathetic. There needs to be a stark difference. If you want austerity, if you want inequality, if you want the decimation of public services, then vote for the god damn Tories. Having an opposition who offers a 'lite' manifesto of all of this is terrible for British politics. I would much rather lose another election than for a Labour government to be elected to enact a watered down version of the same policies. It is power for powers sake and it is pointlessly appalling.

This inevitable leadership election needs to hurry the hell up and finish already.


Credit where credit is due, post sums up the mess Labour have brought about by themselves

[Kizzy]

OR, just don't bother with a challenge? Eagle et al have no chance anyway!

[joeysteele]

Yes its like they are Still Corrupting it

We never had this Run around
with T. May

In Power Tomorrow
Next Election 2020 (she has stuck with that from day one)

Bliss

Oh well in the end we didn't even get a contest with Theresa May, all we got there was 199 Conservative MPs deciding the next PM,no one else from theri own party members or to the Nation at large.

At least whatever else happens in Labour hundreds of thousands of individuals will decide that outcome not just a few MPs.

Theresa May is an unelected Prime Minister and will be until she has an election just as Gordon Brown was,unelected completely too.

Most other leaders changing hands have had elections within around 2 years of the change.
Churchill to Eden,Eden to Macmillan and Macmillan to Douglas-Home.
Only 2 did not, James Callaghan and Gordon Brown, who both paid a very heavy price at the elections when they did eventually crawl to the people then.
Theresa May may be the third but she is breaking the Conservative tradition of not hanging on behind no personal mandate, if she does not hold an election.

[DemolitionRed]

OR, just don't bother with a challenge? Eagle et al have no chance anyway!

Angela Eagle launched her candidacy for the Labour Party leadership yesterday.
http://ht.ly/kfl53027FXj

Can anyone find a single policy commitment in it ? I can't!

[Crimson Dynamo]

One of the main and lone critics of GB being an unelected PM was......

Theresa May

:laugh2:

[arista]

"just as Gordon Brown was,unelected completely too."


Yes Joey
are you a NEW arista dog
with a Bone - you will not let go?


Next Election 2020
Bliss

[Cherie]

One of the main and lone critics of GB being an unelected PM was......

Theresa May

:laugh2:


That's politics for you :joker: but TM can argue the precedent was set by Labour :idc:

[joeysteele]

"just as Gordon Brown was,unelected completely too."


Yes Joey
are you a NEW arista dog
with a Bone - you will not let go?


Next Election 2020
Bliss

Not if I believe I am 100% right will I let something go, just as you did not, rightly too, as to Gordon Brown.

If it wasn't right then, it cannot be now.
That would be hypocrisy.

[joeysteele]

One of the main and lone critics of GB being an unelected PM was......

Theresa May

:laugh2:

Exactly, and she was right.

[arista]

Not if I believe I am 100% right will I let something go, just as you did not, rightly too, as to Gordon Brown.

If it wasn't right then, it cannot be now.
That would be hypocrisy.

No Joey this time its Special
The PUBLIC voted for Brexist
So No Election as that is
what a 2nd Referendum would be like ,
which WE will not allow,
After we are out of the Corrpt EU
by 2020 month May
thats when the next election is
Embrace it.

[joeysteele]

No Joey this time its Special
The PUBLIC voted for Brexist
So No Election as that is
what a 2nd Referendum would be like ,
which WE will not allow,
After we are out of the Corrpt EU
by 2020 month May
thats when the next election is
Embrace it.

It is even more appropriate to have an election now because of the referendum since no one had any idea of any of the parties or the governments plans for leaving the EU.
Not now but by possibly May next year when all parties can present their ideas of what out of the EU like like to them as to concrete negotiations to be done.

I will never embrace or agree only the govt should be doing this without a new mandate approving same as to their plans when known, from the voters.
The referendum only approved the ending of our membership of the EU, not the whole detail of dismantling all and negotiating the new trading deals.
No detail was on that referendum paper.

It is not now democracy to have only the govt, with a change of leader too now, dictate to the Nation and even parliament what the leaving strategy and plans as to any deals will be.
No way.

You would certainly,I am sure of this, be saying there should be an election soon, if it were a Labour govt in power now.
I actually would be too as to that.

[arista]

"It is not now democracy to have only the govt, with a change of leader too now, "

Its Better than the 2 Labour split

Will they dare to tell him
he is not on the ballot?????????

Joey
T. May is Stability
Markets love it

Feel The Force

[joeysteele]

"It is not now democracy to have only the govt, with a change of leader too now, "

Its Better than the 2 Labour split

Will they dare to tell him
he is not on the ballot?????????

Joey
T. May is Stability
Markets love it

Feel The Force

That is a matter of opinion,I cannot see Mrs May being any better to the sick,disabled and most vulnerable actually.

[Jack_]

So the NEC ballot is a secret one :rolleyes:

I don't like the look of where this is going at all

[joeysteele]

So the NEC ballot is a secret one :rolleyes:

I don't like the look of where this is going at all

I think as current leader he should be on the ballot paper,it is extraordinary that any leader is not in a position where he/she could not rely on getting 51 votes however.

The point is Angela Eagle is challenging him,so for me the sensible rule would be that she needs the nominations but he does not, as he already got them in the last leadership election.

Whatever is decided today at the NEC, this farce and this rule needs sorting out and clarifying far better than it is set out at present.

[Kizzy]

There is no question of him not being on the ballot paper as legally they don't have a leg to stand on...

'The party’s national executive committee is holding a special session to determine whether Mr Corbyn will automatically be on the ballot paper of any leadership contest if someone challenges him.

Citing sources inside the meeting, Channel 4 News reports that Mr Corbyn, who sits on the NEC by virtue of his position as leader, was asked to leave the room – but refused.

The request for him to leave came after the NEC voted by 17-15 in favour of asking the question regarding the ballot paper as a secret ballot.

Sky News later reported that Mr Corbyn vacated the room after having first refused to do so.

The decision about whether Mr Corbyn will automatically be on the ballot paper will be revealed later this evening.'

I dare them to try....

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/jeremy-corbyn-refuses-to-leave-nec-meeting-about-his-future-as-leader-ballot-paper-banned-court-a7133121.html

[MTVN]

Well the Labour rules in this are clearly so vague that its not obvious either way whether he should be on the ballot or not so I don't see on what basis Corbyn could dispute the vote if it goes against him. Might not seem very fair but this is the body who decide on Labour party rules so their verdict should apply.

[Northern Monkey]

According to Chukka Umunna on Mondays Daily Politics Corbyn was one of the ones shouting that Neil Kinnock needed the 51 nominations in 1988 when Tony Benn challenged him.Changed his tune abit now.

[Jack_]

Well the Labour rules in this are clearly so vague that its not obvious either way whether he should be on the ballot or not so I don't see on what basis Corbyn could dispute the vote if it goes against him. Might not seem very fair but this is the body who decide on Labour party rules so their verdict should apply.

I don't see how they're vague at all, the rules changed post Miliband and clearly state that all candidates require 15% of MP/MEP nominations if there's a leadership vacancy (which there isn't) and that if there's a challenge (which there is) then only challengers require 20%

752137177644015616

If he's not automatically on the ballot then this is nothing more than backroom dodgy dealings by the orchestrators of this coup

According to Chukka Umunna on Mondays Daily Politics Corbyn was one of the ones shouting that Neil Kinnock needed the 51 nominations in 1988 when Tony Benn challenged him.Changed his tune abit now.

Of course he has, back then Kinnock was required to obtain nominations, the new rule book states only challengers do

[MTVN]

I don't see how they're vague at all, the rules changed post Miliband and clearly state that all candidates require 15% of MP/MEP nominations if there's a leadership vacancy (which there isn't) and that if there's a challenge (which there is) then only challengers require 20%

752137177644015616

If he's not automatically on the ballot then this is nothing more than backroom dodgy dealings by the orchestrators of this coup



Of course he has, back then Kinnock was required to obtain nominations, the new rule book states only challengers do

Well the fact that challengers have to obtain nominations before the party conference doesn't preclude the incumbent from also needing nominations, especially given that the next sentence says 'any nomination must be supported by 20 per cent of the combined Commons members of the PLP and members of the EPLP'

[bots]

If the decision is going to a secret ballot, then it has nothing to do with precedence, legalities or anything else. That is all just noise and completely irrelevant. I would love Corbyn to be allowed to fight the contest. There is nothing I want more than a completely unelectable labour party and it all just gets even better if it fragments. Come on Jez :laugh:

[arista]

JC Vs EAagle is on

Live Ch4HD News

[MTVN]

Well the Labour party has just voted for its own destruction, I honestly can't see the party as it is surviving this leadership struggle

[arista]

According to Chukka Umunna on Mondays Daily Politics Corbyn was one of the ones shouting that Neil Kinnock needed the 51 nominations in 1988 when Tony Benn challenged him.Changed his tune abit now.


Confusion Not


Chukka is a TORY


FACT

[MTVN]

Funny thing is that Corbyn's supporters have been banging on all evening about what a stitch up this vote was going to be and already threatening legal action, now that its gone in his favour it will be all 'we must respect the NEC vote'

[arista]

Crick said possible OWEN SMITH MP
as well.


Come On Jeremy beat that BITCH

[arista]

Poor JP guest in studio
said But......on Ch4HD News ending

But Time Cut You Off , honey

[arista]

Tomorrow 7PM Ch4HD Extended


Thank you ITN Boss
you are a star

[Northern Monkey]

Im not a Corbynite by a long stretch but i think he will destroy Eagle.

[arista]

Im not a Corbynite by a long stretch but i think he will destroy Eagle.

How Nice

[arista]

Funny thing is that Corbyn's supporters have been banging on all evening about what a stitch up this vote was going to be and already threatening legal action, now that its gone in his favour it will be all 'we must respect the NEC vote'


Yes but good job JC left Brighton Union meet up
fast to get back to London

18 For him on the ballot


14 Not for him on the ballot

[Crimson Dynamo]

in all my years watching politics I have never seen a worse labour party

shocking, out of date, duds

they need to split and form a new party or something

Eagle v Corbyn?

:laugh2:

I have never hear anything so daft

[arista]

There is no question of him not being on the ballot paper as legally they don't have a leg to stand on...

'The party’s national executive committee is holding a special session to determine whether Mr Corbyn will automatically be on the ballot paper of any leadership contest if someone challenges him.

Citing sources inside the meeting, Channel 4 News reports that Mr Corbyn, who sits on the NEC by virtue of his position as leader, was asked to leave the room – but refused.

The request for him to leave came after the NEC voted by 17-15 in favour of asking the question regarding the ballot paper as a secret ballot.

Sky News later reported that Mr Corbyn vacated the room after having first refused to do so.

The decision about whether Mr Corbyn will automatically be on the ballot paper will be revealed later this evening.'

I dare them to try....

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/jeremy-corbyn-refuses-to-leave-nec-meeting-about-his-future-as-leader-ballot-paper-banned-court-a7133121.html


Its OK
Kizzy , love

JC is on the Ballot

[smudgie]

Oh well, that's the Tories guaranteed the top jobs for life then.

[arista]

Oh well, that's the Tories guaranteed the top jobs for life then.


No all to play for,



There is Labour JC


or New BLAIR Labour.

That's Common Sense Democracy.



Why did they Let JC win on that first vote a year back or so?????

[MTVN]

Sounds like they have very sensibly raised the cheapest price of membership to £25 and barred those who joined the party after February from voting, should prevent another entryist surge

[DemolitionRed]

minute by minute reporting http://www.theguardian.com/politics/blog/live/2016/…

[arista]

Sounds like they have very sensibly raised the cheapest price of membership to £25 and barred those who joined the party after February from voting, should prevent another entryist surge

That's a big Jump.

But by then
will there be TWO Labour Parties?

[joeysteele]

As I interpreted the rules, he should as the incumbent be on the ballot paper, it only says all have to have the nominations if there is 'no' vacancy, which there wasn't here.

What happens now is anyone's guess but at least the challenge goes ahead unless Angela Eagle pulls out.
She will know now really if she has any real chance of beating Jeremy Corbyn.

To anyone not that interested in politics and the rules of electing leaders, this must seem very odd, that only MPs and MEPs can put forward nominations for who stands as leader.
That here we have about 80%of MPs against the current leader and the fact he would not have got the 51 MPs required if he had to.

In his place, having to lead the Party in parliament,I would not have put myself forward.
However he has done so and it is his right.

Faced with the choice of Jeremy, Angela or Owen,I would vote for Jeremy Corbyn, it would take someone like Dan Jarvis to stand to get me to vote elsewhere.
Who knows, by the time the EU exit is well into operation and the deals being either poor ones or even fair ones.
In 2020, it may be Corbyn's vision of the UK out of the EU that attracts more support.

Interesting times ahead, however I am finding life is never dull in the Labour party.

[arista]

"Faced with the choice of Jeremy, Angela or Owen,I would vote for Jeremy Corbyn"


You Are Most Wise Joey

[smudgie]

None of them are worth paying £25 to vote for.:shrug:

[joeysteele]

"Faced with the choice of Jeremy, Angela or Owen,I would vote for Jeremy Corbyn"


You Are Most Wise Joey

:joker: It is a good while since I got that from you arista so thank you, it is nice to see it again.

[AProducer'sWetDream]

Sounds like they have very sensibly raised the cheapest price of membership to £25 and barred those who joined the party after February from voting, should prevent another entryist surge

I joined the other week to vote against him :fist:

And I'm not paying £25 to vote for Angela Eagle...

[Jack_]

Well the fact that challengers have to obtain nominations before the party conference doesn't preclude the incumbent from also needing nominations, especially given that the next sentence says 'any nomination must be supported by 20 per cent of the combined Commons members of the PLP and members of the EPLP'

But the sentence that precedes that talks about when there's 'no vacancy' (which there isn't) that 'potential challengers' (which Corbyn isn't) need to obtain nominations, so that cancels the word 'any' out

Anyway thankfully they ruled the correct way

Funny thing is that Corbyn's supporters have been banging on all evening about what a stitch up this vote was going to be and already threatening legal action, now that its gone in his favour it will be all 'we must respect the NEC vote'

Not at all :conf: if they want to mount a legal challenge I say bring it on, they've sought to destroy the party's image enough over the last two weeks and undermine democracy so why not? I could just as easily flip that around and say if it had been ruled he needed 20% of the PLP's support those who are against him would've laughed at a legal challenge and said 'we must respect the NEC vote'. It works both ways

[Jack_]

As for the new eligibility rulings, Christ they really are going to any lengths to undermine him aren't they. This from Robert Peston sums it up:

Even by Labour's recent history of giving shambles a good name, today's meeting of the ruling NEC takes the biscuit.

Because at the end of the meeting, after a couple of pro-Corbyn members had left, and Corbyn himself had gone, a vote was taken on a motion not on the agenda, to exclude from the leadership vote anyone who joined the party in the past six months. So the 130,000 who signed up since Brexit, most of whom are thought to be Corbyn supporters, will be unable to vote.

Now whatever you think of Corbyn, this looks and smells like gerrymandering by his opponents.

Corbyn will definitely attempt to get the vote over-turned. And he may resort to the law, since Labour's website made clear that membership bought a vote.

As for those who joined since January, they will be revolting.

That said, if anyone wants to take part in the election, they now have two days to pay £25 and become a registered supporter.

Which is the first example of the much feared post-Brexit inflation, since till today it cost just £3 to be such a voting supporter.

https://www.facebook.com/pestonitv/posts/1655015298156542

I agree the fee to become a supporter needed increasing to stop entryists, but the six month threshold when 100,000 people have become members since the referendum is just bogus, especially when under the FAQ's on the Labour website it says that one of the reasons why you should become a member is so that you get to vote in party elections.

I expect this is far from over. What a ****ing mess

[arista]

I say its Evil
Jack

[Kizzy]

I joined the other week to vote against him :fist:

And I'm not paying £25 to vote for Angela Eagle...

Well there you have it, nobody is willing to pay for a silly anti Corbyn protest vote as Eagle suggested yesterday, so only those with a genuine love for the NHS and the country as a whole can vote.
That said wiping 6 months off is ridiculous and deserves challenging.

[the truth]

this situation is bigger than the referendum this is the battle for the very survival of socialism and labour forever

[kirklancaster]

If the decision is going to a secret ballot, then it has nothing to do with precedence, legalities or anything else. That is all just noise and completely irrelevant. I would love Corbyn to be allowed to fight the contest. There is nothing I want more than a completely unelectable labour party and it all just gets even better if it fragments. Come on Jez :laugh:

:laugh::laugh::laugh:

[DemolitionRed]

I joined the other week to vote against him :fist:

And I'm not paying £25 to vote for Angela Eagle...

You will be disappointed then because nobody who has joined since the end of February is eligible to vote.

[DemolitionRed]

Act 2 Scene II . Owen Smith enters from stage Left.

The Pontypridd MP, who resigned as shadow work and pensions secretary last month, will join Angela Eagle in challenging Jeremy Corbyn.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-36780715

[kirklancaster]

Act 2 Scene II . Owen Smith enters from stage Left.

The Pontypridd MP, who resigned as shadow work and pensions secretary last month, will join Angela Eagle in challenging Jeremy Corbyn.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-36780715

:joker: Is this a pun DR?

[joeysteele]

Act 2 Scene II . Owen Smith enters from stage Left.

The Pontypridd MP, who resigned as shadow work and pensions secretary last month, will join Angela Eagle in challenging Jeremy Corbyn.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-36780715

Sky news mistakenly said Owen Jones rather than Smith this morning,now had Owen Jones been a contender as an MP I would have voted for him no problem as leader.

This is really farcical now,even some Labour voters are asking who is Owen Smith.

This leadership challenge is not going to resolve anything other than a new mandate for Jeremy and rightly so, despite my own reservations.

[kirklancaster]

Sky news mistakenly said Owen Jones rather than Smith this morning,now had Owen Jones been a contender as an MP I would have voted for him no problem as leader.

This is really farcical now,even some Labour voters are asking who is Owen Smith.

This leadership challenge is not going to resolve anything other than a new mandate for Jeremy and rightly so, despite my own reservations.

:laugh: Well, at least all the ballyhoo of the past few weeks has seen me being rather kind to, and supportive of Corbyn - something which Paddy Power would have given you odds of 1000/1 on not so long ago Joey. Wonders Never Cease. :hee:

[bots]

I do find it all very amusing. If the labour party rank and file are championing Jeremy, it means that the party has been overrun by a political philosophy that is just not electable. Its fine to have principles, but unless those principles match the mainstream of peoples aspirations it is destined for a dark corner, never to see the light of day again. They will never get elected. So, they need to decide if they want to challenge for government or be a protest party. It can't be both

[joeysteele]

:laugh: Well, at least all the ballyhoo of the past few weeks has seen me being rather kind to, and supportive of Corbyn - something which Paddy Power would have given you odds of 1000/1 on not so long ago Joey. Wonders Never Cease. :hee:

I think politics is all up in the air at present and no one can really know or have any faith as to where the political drift will now end up.

Anything is probably now possible as to politics.

No one has now any real direction and certainly no surety that whatever direction they do have, is going to prove the right one in the end.
No matter what side anyone is on, that makes for a very lively and interesting but also worrying time as to politics.

[Livia]

I do find it all very amusing. If the labour party rank and file are championing Jeremy, it means that the party has been overrun by a political philosophy that is just not electable. Its fine to have principles, but unless those principles match the mainstream of peoples aspirations it is destined for a dark corner, never to see the light of day again. They will never get elected. So, they need to decide if they want to challenge for government or be a protest party. It can't be both

Very well said.

[bots]

Very well said.

The Tory party have a top team of strategists, that have a proven track record. Its a strategic decision they have taken, not to hold a general election now, when labour seem at their lowest. They obviously believe that Labour has further to fall yet, and that's when they will strike. Holding a GE now would galvanise the labour party at a time when they are falling apart happily on their own. Give it 6 months to a year, then hold a GE ... and wipe Labour out. That's my prediction.

[kirklancaster]

The Tory party have a top team of strategists, that have a proven track record. Its a strategic decision they have taken, not to hold a general election now, when labour seem at their lowest. They obviously believe that Labour has further to fall yet, and that's when they will strike. Holding a GE now would galvanise the labour party at a time when they are falling apart happily on their own. Give it 6 months to a year, then hold a GE ... and wipe Labour out. That's my prediction.

Great analysis BOTS.

[Livia]

The Tory party have a top team of strategists, that have a proven track record. Its a strategic decision they have taken, not to hold a general election now, when labour seem at their lowest. They obviously believe that Labour has further to fall yet, and that's when they will strike. Holding a GE now would galvanise the labour party at a time when they are falling apart happily on their own. Give it 6 months to a year, then hold a GE ... and wipe Labour out. That's my prediction.

I want you on Question Time.

[Crimson Dynamo]

The Tory party have a top team of strategists, that have a proven track record. Its a strategic decision they have taken, not to hold a general election now, when labour seem at their lowest. They obviously believe that Labour has further to fall yet, and that's when they will strike. Holding a GE now would galvanise the labour party at a time when they are falling apart happily on their own. Give it 6 months to a year, then hold a GE ... and wipe Labour out. That's my prediction.

Yep, no point showing your hand now when what is "left" of the so called labour party is in meltdown. Just grab the popcorn..

[DemolitionRed]

:laugh: Well, at least all the ballyhoo of the past few weeks has seen me being rather kind to, and supportive of Corbyn - something which Paddy Power would have given you odds of 1000/1 on not so long ago Joey. Wonders Never Cease. :hee:

You’re just thinking independently Kirk. Too many political thinkers get glued to the fly paper. Being open minded regarding all policy from all parties allows you to think outside the box.

I’m presently feeling quite elated at Theresa May’s speech where she commits herself to government backed project bonds which could be used to boost infrastructure. If she’s genuinely going to go ahead with this, then she has to put a stop to austerity. Will she, won’t she?... its certainly a glimmer of hope in all this mess but we will have to wait and see.

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2016/jul/11/the-guardian-view-on-theresa-may-as-pm-triumph-of-a-known-unknown

[Kizzy]

'More than 100,000 new Labour Party members must pay a £25 fee to take part in the upcoming leadership election vote.

The decision by Labour's National Executive Committee (NEC) has caused outrage among Jeremy Corbyn's supporters who have interpreted it to be another attack on his leadership.

There are, however, a number of ways to avoid the fee, which currently is an obstacle to around 20 per cent of the membership who joined the party after 12 January.

Firstly, people can join the Unite union as a community member, paying 50p a week until becoming an affiliate member by 8 August.

This would allow members or anyone interested, including students and the unemployed, to vote in the upcoming election.

Secondly, if you are black, Asian or belong to an ethnic minority, you would be eligible to vote in the election after paying £5 for a two-year membership of BAME Labour.

If you are LGBT, you could gain a say in the leadership election if you join LGBT Labour for £8 a year.

Alternatively, you could join Scientists for Labour for a concession rate of £5 to vote.

Labour membership numbers are thought to have reached around half a million, more than the 405,000 it reached during the high point of Tony Blair's premiership.

Mr Corbyn has been allowed by the NEC to stand in the party's leadership election without needing to secure 51 nominations from Labour MPs or MEPs.'


http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/labour-party-leadership-contest-vote-jeremy-corbyn-new-members-momentum-vote-avoid-paying-25-fee-a7133851.html

[Crimson Dynamo]

'More than 100,000 new Labour Party members must pay a £25 fee to take part in the upcoming leadership election vote.

The decision by Labour's National Executive Committee (NEC) has caused outrage among Jeremy Corbyn's supporters who have interpreted it to be another attack on his leadership.

There are, however, a number of ways to avoid the fee, which currently is an obstacle to around 20 per cent of the membership who joined the party after 12 January.

Firstly, people can join the Unite union as a community member, paying 50p a week until becoming an affiliate member by 8 August.

This would allow members or anyone interested, including students and the unemployed, to vote in the upcoming election.

Secondly, if you are black, Asian or belong to an ethnic minority, you would be eligible to vote in the election after paying £5 for a two-year membership of BAME Labour.

If you are LGBT, you could gain a say in the leadership election if you join LGBT Labour for £8 a year.

Alternatively, you could join Scientists for Labour for a concession rate of £5 to vote.

Labour membership numbers are thought to have reached around half a million, more than the 405,000 it reached during the high point of Tony Blair's premiership.

Mr Corbyn has been allowed by the NEC to stand in the party's leadership election without needing to secure 51 nominations from Labour MPs or MEPs.'


http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/labour-party-leadership-contest-vote-jeremy-corbyn-new-members-momentum-vote-avoid-paying-25-fee-a7133851.html

:joker: mess

[Kizzy]

Seems quite straightforward to me.

[arista]

Yes Start D -selecting
the BlairLabour
One By One

[joeysteele]

Yes Start D -selecting
the BlairLabour
One By One

No one who hasn't done anything wrong is going to be de-selected.
That would be an unforgivable outrage.

However,masses more people will be actually choosing this leader than have chosen the current PM.
So the result has to be respected even moreso this time.

Now should anyone then want to go off in a huff to other parties, or in a fit of madness try to create another party, so be it, goodbye to them and good riddance too.

[arista]

"No one who hasn't done anything wrong is going to be de-selected."

They do not Support the Leader

Kick Them Out

[joeysteele]

"No one who hasn't done anything wrong is going to be de-selected."

They do not Support the Leader

Kick Them Out

That is not really doing anything wrong.
Not the best way to behave,especially publicly but time to come on board after this leadership election, 'if' they are true democrats.

[DemolitionRed]

'More than 100,000 new Labour Party members must pay a £25 fee to take part in the upcoming leadership election vote.

The decision by Labour's National Executive Committee (NEC) has caused outrage among Jeremy Corbyn's supporters who have interpreted it to be another attack on his leadership.

There are, however, a number of ways to avoid the fee, which currently is an obstacle to around 20 per cent of the membership who joined the party after 12 January.

Firstly, people can join the Unite union as a community member, paying 50p a week until becoming an affiliate member by 8 August.

This would allow members or anyone interested, including students and the unemployed, to vote in the upcoming election.

Secondly, if you are black, Asian or belong to an ethnic minority, you would be eligible to vote in the election after paying £5 for a two-year membership of BAME Labour.

If you are LGBT, you could gain a say in the leadership election if you join LGBT Labour for £8 a year.

Alternatively, you could join Scientists for Labour for a concession rate of £5 to vote.

Labour membership numbers are thought to have reached around half a million, more than the 405,000 it reached during the high point of Tony Blair's premiership.

Mr Corbyn has been allowed by the NEC to stand in the party's leadership election without needing to secure 51 nominations from Labour MPs or MEPs.'


http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/labour-party-leadership-contest-vote-jeremy-corbyn-new-members-momentum-vote-avoid-paying-25-fee-a7133851.html

http://www.newstatesman.com/politics/uk/2016/07/labour-rules-freeze-voter-eligiblity-also-applies-affiliate-members


However, anyone can become registered supporters of the Labour Party - giving them a one-off vote - if they pay £25 and "share" Labour's aims and values. There is a two-day window for people to sign up, expected to be between 18 and 20 July although this has not been confirmed.

Registered supporters who paid £3 to vote in last year's leadership election will have to reapply.

Fcuk it, they can have my £25.
This is exactly what I signed up for. I'm not gonna be put off by those wankers moving the goalposts.

[Kizzy]

http://www.newstatesman.com/politics/uk/2016/07/labour-rules-freeze-voter-eligiblity-also-applies-affiliate-members


However, anyone can become registered supporters of the Labour Party - giving them a one-off vote - if they pay £25 and "share" Labour's aims and values. There is a two-day window for people to sign up, expected to be between 18 and 20 July although this has not been confirmed.

Registered supporters who paid £3 to vote in last year's leadership election will have to reapply.

Fcuk it, they can have my £25.
This is exactly what I signed up for. I'm not gonna be put off by those wankers moving the goalposts.

Not sure if it's been confirmed you can join and vote by joining the unite union community for £2, if it has I'll do that if not then yep I'm also paying.

http://www.unitetheunion.org/

[Jack_]

Yeah, looks like they've put a stop to that too

753528133505220608

Oh and they've suspended all CLP meetings for the duration of the campaign

This gerrymandering is disgraceful

[Kizzy]

It is Jack, democracy?....pffffft :/

[Kizzy]

'NEC has just suspended Brighton and Hove CLP - 6000 members who had voted 60+% supporting Corbyn!'

This is in the comments of this article, not sure if it's true, but if it is....wtaf?... :eek:


http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/labour-leadership-election-nec-bars-new-union-members-from-voting-a7137176.html

[MTVN]

Labour has suspended all constituency party meetings to try to halt the surge in abuse and threats received by MPs.

The party’s ruling National Executive Committee said all local party meetings had been shelved until the leadership contest ends in September.

The decision came after opponents of Jeremy Corbyn were subjected to intimidation, been spat on and received death and rape threats.

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/labour-suspends-local-party-meetings-8413263

Got to love the new politics

[joeysteele]

Got to love the new politics

It's actually really sad and on both sides, some of those who are against Corbyn and some who are against anyone against him.

What the answer is here other than hoping things work out,is now beyond a lot of people's understanding in the Party,it is certainly at present beyond mine for sure.
I really hope things work out but I have said in the recent past the party would not split, that it would be surely seen how damaging that would be, however now I would not bet on it not happening.

If it does, votes will be split considerably, and much more to the point votes that are vital will be lost as to both factions.
They have been told this,the NEC, the MPs and Constituency/ward secretaries.

If the MPs do not accept the result of this leadership contest then quite honestly, the Conservative party will more than probably be in govt. for decades with at best very little and at worst no real opposition.

This is going to be a truly awful and likely badly damaging leadership election.

[Kizzy]

Got to love the new politics

Have you? Not sure why, if suspending votes was the way to go following threats or violent acts then why was the referendum allowed to proceed? :/

[Kizzy]

Labour grassroots members are in open revolt over a series of restrictions imposed by the party’s ruling national executive over the leadership contest – with some branches holding unofficial meetings in defiance of a ban imposed nationally earlier this week.

Labour branches in London, the Midlands, Liverpool and elsewhere all defied the order and organised impromptu events, reflecting unhappiness in some parts of the party’s membership at the decision taken at the same meeting that confirmed that Jeremy Corbyn would be on the leadership ballot.

After Corbyn’s candidacy was validated, the NEC ruled that only those who had been members for more than six months would be allowed to vote, while new supporters wishing to cast their vote would be given two days to sign up as registered supporters. They will have to pay £25, far more than the £3 many Corbyn-backers paid in the contest last year.

Pro-Corbyn members are also protesting over the suspension of all constituency party meetings until the election for leader is over at the end of September. In Wallasey, the Merseyside constituency of Angela Eagle – one of the two challengers to Corbyn – members booked a hall for a meeting of the New Brighton branch on Wednesday night. It went ahead as an informal meeting of Labour members rather than an official event.

At the end of the two-hour meeting, a vote of no confidence in Eagle was passed by 54 to nine. In a second vote, they unanimously rejected the £25 membership fee, which one of those in the hall denounced as “a surcharge on democracy”.


http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2016/jul/14/labour-grassroots-rebel-against-nec-restrictions-on-leadership-contest

[bots]

Democracy can appear in many guises, but this isn't one of them. I may be reading too much into it, but it appears to me there are more sinister forces at play and hiding under the guise of labour "rank and file members" I'm not for a moment suggesting this is a rank and file issue but that coercion, threats and block voting by proxy, are some of the tactics being used to subvert the democratic process, because what we are seeing is attempts to rectify that.

[Kizzy]

Democracy can appear in many guises, but this isn't one of them. I may be reading too much into it, but it appears to me there are more sinister forces at play and hiding under the guise of labour "rank and file members" I'm not for a moment suggesting this is a rank and file issue but that coercion, threats and block voting by proxy, are some of the tactics being used to subvert the democratic process, because what we are seeing is attempts to rectify that.

So you agree with this gerrymandering?....

People who wish to support labour and the labour leader are effectively being prohibited, in what universe is this an acceptable democratic process?

Who is going to pay £25 to vote Eagle or Smith, have they not split their own party in an attempt to oust a leader who has the support of grassroots voters?

[bots]

So you agree with this gerrymandering?....

People who wish to support labour and the labour leader are effectively being prohibited, in what universe is this an acceptable democratic process?

Who is going to pay £25 to vote Eagle or Smith, have they not split their own party in an attempt to oust a leader who has the support of grassroots voters?

I have no problem with individuals having a free say in voting for their new leader. The problem is that the whole process has been subverted, and rather than sorting it out, before they even think about having a vote, they are applying counter measures to minimise its impact.

[the truth]

why do new labour think they can win by destroying corbyn and riding roughshod over 600,000 mostly new members?

[kirklancaster]

I have no problem with individuals having a free say in voting for their new leader. The problem is that the whole process has been subverted, and rather than sorting it out, before they even think about having a vote, they are applying counter measures to minimise its impact.

Well analysed BOTS. I totally agree with you.

[joeysteele]

I have no problem with individuals having a free say in voting for their new leader. The problem is that the whole process has been subverted, and rather than sorting it out, before they even think about having a vote, they are applying counter measures to minimise its impact.

You are right.
I was at a meeting earlier in the week,I can accept the result of any leadership election but that does not mean I have to agree with the format or all any potential leader may say or stand for.

One comment I and others made was what has to be done to even try to heal, after this leadership election, the probability of the MPs and leader not being able to work together, as is the case now.
We never mentioned any names,never said who we would vote for in that leadership election,it was in my view a very relevant question.

Instantly we were 'termed' as likely Corbyn haters.
The atmosphere is really bad and as for comradeship,for goodness sake, non existent.

Each camp now is just shouting the other down,anyone not declaring for any one candidate is seen as a likely Corbyn hater.
Then you have Angela Eagle's camp and indeed herself, not wanting any other candidates to stand, in order to give her the best chance of beating Jeremy Corbyn.

The people meant to be leading the party are not in any way.
This leadership election has a large electorate admittedly but the result will not be accepted whoever wins.

Look, I like Jeremy Corbyn, I like just about all his policies but I can see that if I was expected to lead a team of people,if I knew that three quarters of them would not work with me and had no confidence in me, then what is the point of me stoking up fuel on the fires of discontent.
A good leader needs to realise their position and needs to be in a position of strength with at least most of the people they have to lead and work with on a daily basis.

I probably would vote for Corbyn over Angela Eagle however as I think the divisions would then be as bad with her as to the wider party afterwards.
Not so with MPs however.
Although she couldn't last year even get the votes to be Deputy leader let alone votes now for leader.

This is dangerous for Labour and anyone who thinks a split and loss of many sitting MPs in vital seats will be of assistance are badly mistaken.
Sometimes being a really good leader is knowing when the time has come to stand aside, for the good in the end of the whole party.
This is a massive mess and it really does appear that the hierarchy of Labour and the NEC are just burying their heads in the sand even further, rather than really taking control and making more appropriate efforts to sort this nightmare out and deal with very effectively the rising nastiness on both sides.

It seems very sadly, the very worst of what went on the EU referendum has now rubbed off on the Labour party.
If it continues, then if they thought last years election was bad, they haven't seen nothing yet if they don't now work and pull together and 'fast'.

[Kizzy]

What has to be addressed is the discord between what is the labour party ethos and what some labour party MPs think is the labour party ethos..

[arista]

"No one who hasn't done anything wrong is going to be de-selected.
That would be an unforgivable outrage."

Wrong The Dissed the Leader JC,
Joey.


One By One
Start Evicting them
Replacing them with a Member that Respects JC.


LOGICAL

[Kizzy]

If the people who elected them feel strongly enough to put in a vote of no confidence then that should be enough to warrant some action?

[arista]

If the people who elected them feel strongly enough to put in a vote of no confidence then that should be enough to warrant some action?


A Massive Amount who are
in A. Eagles
Zone Hate Her
want her gone.


The Examples are being Hidden by the BBC


Well Done LBC

[arista]

Corbyn Vs Smith in Cardiff
is on BBCNewsHD now Live

Smith gets Booo's
And this is His area


On Ch4HD News
Michael Crick
showed a clip when Smith got massive Booo's


JC is Winning Kizzy, dear

[joeysteele]

For me, Jeremy Corbyn wiped the floor with Owen Smith here.

[Pete.]

Corbyn taking out trash :clap1:

[arista]

http://e3.365dm.com/16/08/206x116/e73068a5ab59f61a4ceff8deea66daa4c0477c8b1923991965 7069433794e55f_3757694.jpg?20160804114104

http://news.sky.com/story/jeremy-v-smith-spot-the-difference-10522482

[Kizzy]

What a guy :)

[Kizzy]

sfxw_x86NMU

[MTVN]

It’s worth underlining again the full extent of Corbyn’s duplicity. He pledged not to nominate any new peers. He did. He pledged his inquiry into anti-Semitism would be independent. It was not.

He attacked Cameron for cronyism for producing a resignation honours list. Yet he had lobbied for his own crony to appear on the list. He told journalists that Chakrabarti was ‘fiercely independent’. But she wasn’t, and he knew she wasn’t. Because if she had been, she would have turned down his offer of a peerage out of hand.

...

But there is one good thing to come out of it all. Shami Chakrabarti will now be what she has always wanted to be – an icon. An icon for Corbynism. Every time she rises in the House of Lords, every time she speaks, every time her face appears nodding sagely during one of their lordships’ debates – people will remember. How she got there. Why she got there. Who got her there.

All the bullying, all the hypocrisy, all the incompetence, all the venality – Shami Chakrabarti is about to become the poster girl for this whole sordid, squalid period in Labour’s history.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-3727401/DAN-HODGES-Arise-Lady-Chakrabarti-poster-girl-squalid-hypocrisy.html#ixzz4Ge1TeEKP

Great article

[kirklancaster]

It’s worth underlining again the full extent of Corbyn’s duplicity. He pledged not to nominate any new peers. He did. He pledged his inquiry into anti-Semitism would be independent. It was not.

He attacked Cameron for cronyism for producing a resignation honours list. Yet he had lobbied for his own crony to appear on the list. He told journalists that Chakrabarti was ‘fiercely independent’. But she wasn’t, and he knew she wasn’t. Because if she had been, she would have turned down his offer of a peerage out of hand.

...

But there is one good thing to come out of it all. Shami Chakrabarti will now be what she has always wanted to be – an icon. An icon for Corbynism. Every time she rises in the House of Lords, every time she speaks, every time her face appears nodding sagely during one of their lordships’ debates – people will remember. How she got there. Why she got there. Who got her there.

All the bullying, all the hypocrisy, all the incompetence, all the venality – Shami Chakrabarti is about to become the poster girl for this whole sordid, squalid period in Labour’s history.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-3727401/DAN-HODGES-Arise-Lady-Chakrabarti-poster-girl-squalid-hypocrisy.html#ixzz4Ge1TeEKP

Great article

:clap1::clap1::clap1: GREAT post - as usual.

[Livia]

It’s worth underlining again the full extent of Corbyn’s duplicity. He pledged not to nominate any new peers. He did. He pledged his inquiry into anti-Semitism would be independent. It was not.

He attacked Cameron for cronyism for producing a resignation honours list. Yet he had lobbied for his own crony to appear on the list. He told journalists that Chakrabarti was ‘fiercely independent’. But she wasn’t, and he knew she wasn’t. Because if she had been, she would have turned down his offer of a peerage out of hand.

...

But there is one good thing to come out of it all. Shami Chakrabarti will now be what she has always wanted to be – an icon. An icon for Corbynism. Every time she rises in the House of Lords, every time she speaks, every time her face appears nodding sagely during one of their lordships’ debates – people will remember. How she got there. Why she got there. Who got her there.

All the bullying, all the hypocrisy, all the incompetence, all the venality – Shami Chakrabarti is about to become the poster girl for this whole sordid, squalid period in Labour’s history.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-3727401/DAN-HODGES-Arise-Lady-Chakrabarti-poster-girl-squalid-hypocrisy.html#ixzz4Ge1TeEKP

Great article

Fantastic post MTVN. I've been angered by the fact that Corbyn's anti-Semitism enquiry ended up being the whitewash and the farce that I suspected it would. And yes, every time Chakrabarti speaks people will recall how she got there and why.

[joeysteele]

It was an independent enquiry,I have to disagree there as to that.
It should have had a bigger scope in my opinion however.

What I do find unacceptable is this honour,first Jeremy Corbyn should have not put any name forward and secondly the lady should refuse it in my view.

Really things go from bad to worse,I cannot disagree with that at all.

[MTVN]

Must admit that the text in my post was just copy and pasted from the article, Dan Hodges put it better than I could!

[arista]

Sept 24th

JC to Win


FECK BlairLabourWarmongers

[Kizzy]

Thank you for the copy pasta Matt :thumbs: I support his decision based on her proud record of public service, an accolade no new tory peer can boast.
He was hasty to suggest he wouldn't put forward peers in my opinion, we will never get reform in the lords or good judgement should the house be too one sided.

[Livia]

Matt had already said it was a "copy pasta [sic]" job.

Isn't it amusing how some people will support ANYTHING that Corbyn does. At least we know now that Jews are fair game as far as the Labour Party are concerned. Nice to know where we stand.

[arista]

Matt had already said it was a "copy pasta [sic]" job.

Isn't it amusing how some people will support ANYTHING that Corbyn does. At least we know now that Jews are fair game as far as the Labour Party are concerned. Nice to know where we stand.


NO
J. C has said that is wrong - every time.

He is against attacks on Jews or any other peoples

You do not know if its from the other BlairLabour
saboteurs

[Kizzy]

Matt had already said it was a "copy pasta [sic]" job.

Isn't it amusing how some people will support ANYTHING that Corbyn does. At least we know now that Jews are fair game as far as the Labour Party are concerned. Nice to know where we stand.

I'm aware of his comment , I don't require your prompts thank you.

Who are these 'some people'? I don't know anyone who does that. Could you please epxand on your last sentence please I have no idea what you mean with this statement.. The Jewish are fair game how?

[Livia]

Taken from the website of Ruth Smith MP:


“This morning, at the launch of the Chakrabarti Inquiry into anti-Semitism, I was verbally attacked by a Momentum activist and Jeremy Corbyn supporter who used traditional anti-Semitic slurs to attack me for being part of a 'media conspiracy'. It is beyond belief that someone could come to the launch of a report on anti-Semitism in the Labour Party and espouse such vile conspiracy theories about Jewish people, which were ironically highlighted as such in Ms Chakrabarti's report, while the leader of my own party stood by and did absolutely nothing.”

She has made an official complaint to Labour HQ, and is calling on Corbyn to resign “immediately and make way for someone with the backbone to confront racism and anti-Semitism in our party and in the country”.


Whichever way you twist it, Labour, with Corbyn at the helm, is seen by many Jews as being anti-Semitic... and not without reason.

[joeysteele]

NO
J. C has said that is wrong - every time.

He is against attacks on Jews or any other peoples

You do not know if its from the other BlairLabour
saboteurs

Well said arista, I am tired of this unsubstantiated charge being made against the whole Labour party but it comes up regularly on threads on here it seems these days and therefore must be allowed it seems.
Even though there are members of the Labour party on here too.
You make valid points.

I too believe that Corbyn is against anti semitism, and this aggravating inflammatory language that he isn't, encompassing the whole Labour party and the left often generally brought into the false accusations into it too, is never going to help eradicate the problem, when the wrong people are blamed for it and are on the receiving end of those with almost near spiteful prejudice against Labour and/or the left of politics, no matter who they may be.

[Kizzy]

Random comment at a meeting

brexit

bigginsgate

#blamecorbyn

[Kizzy]

Whoop!

'The High Court has ruled that 130,000 people who recently joined the Labour party could be allowed to cast a vote in the upcoming leadership election, in a move that many expect to be advantageous to Jeremy Corbyn’s campaign.

Lawyers representing a group of five, who have argued they have “paid their dues”, claimed their clients had been unfairly excluded from participating in the labour leadership contest. Stephen Cragg QC accused the party’s governing body, the National Executive Committee, of unlawfully “freezing” them and many others out of the election process between Mr Corbyn and his challenger Owen Smith, the former shadow work and pensions secretary.'

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/labour-leadership-contest-jeremy-corbyn-members-how-to-vote-rules-ruling-verdict-owen-smith-latest-a7178436.html

[Kizzy]

Excellent article in the canary..

There appears to be a trend among high-profile, left-wing commentators of late, specifically those who have been vocal advocates of Jeremy Corbyn in the past. A number of them are now publicly dropping support for the Labour leader by writing lengthy articles critiquing why he will fail. But all these blogs share similar problems. They leave out crucial facts and completely underestimate the importance of Corbyn staying as leader of the Labour Party.

Like a medieval plague that is sweeping the liberal media, these journalists and writers have all been attempting to purge themselves of their support for Corbyn. The metaphorical bloodletting in the form of blogs has been frequent. Dr Frances Ryan wrote in The Guardian on 25 July; Owen Jones penned one which went viral on 31 July; Alex Andreou released one on the news site Byline Media on 6 August.

Cards on the table. I’m all for as much varied opinion being out there as possible. As I wrote in an article for The Canary on 1 August, I think everyone who wants to write a blog should. And I’m not dismissing the content of these journalists’ comment pieces out of hand. They all (especially Jones’) had some valid points which should be heeded.

It's quite long but well worth a read, Steve Topple get's it bang on.

http://www.thecanary.co/2016/08/08/the-left-wing-journalists-attacking-corbyn-need-urgent-reality-check/

[kirklancaster]

You are right.
I was at a meeting earlier in the week,I can accept the result of any leadership election but that does not mean I have to agree with the format or all any potential leader may say or stand for.

One comment I and others made was what has to be done to even try to heal, after this leadership election, the probability of the MPs and leader not being able to work together, as is the case now.
We never mentioned any names,never said who we would vote for in that leadership election,it was in my view a very relevant question.

Instantly we were 'termed' as likely Corbyn haters.
The atmosphere is really bad and as for comradeship,for goodness sake, non existent.

Each camp now is just shouting the other down,anyone not declaring for any one candidate is seen as a likely Corbyn hater.
Then you have Angela Eagle's camp and indeed herself, not wanting any other candidates to stand, in order to give her the best chance of beating Jeremy Corbyn.

The people meant to be leading the party are not in any way.
This leadership election has a large electorate admittedly but the result will not be accepted whoever wins.

Look, I like Jeremy Corbyn, I like just about all his policies but I can see that if I was expected to lead a team of people,if I knew that three quarters of them would not work with me and had no confidence in me, then what is the point of me stoking up fuel on the fires of discontent.
A good leader needs to realise their position and needs to be in a position of strength with at least most of the people they have to lead and work with on a daily basis.

I probably would vote for Corbyn over Angela Eagle however as I think the divisions would then be as bad with her as to the wider party afterwards.
Not so with MPs however.
Although she couldn't last year even get the votes to be Deputy leader let alone votes now for leader.

This is dangerous for Labour and anyone who thinks a split and loss of many sitting MPs in vital seats will be of assistance are badly mistaken.
Sometimes being a really good leader is knowing when the time has come to stand aside, for the good in the end of the whole party.
This is a massive mess and it really does appear that the hierarchy of Labour and the NEC are just burying their heads in the sand even further, rather than really taking control and making more appropriate efforts to sort this nightmare out and deal with very effectively the rising nastiness on both sides.

It seems very sadly, the very worst of what went on the EU referendum has now rubbed off on the Labour party.
If it continues, then if they thought last years election was bad, they haven't seen nothing yet if they don't now work and pull together and 'fast'.

This is 1,000% sincere Joey - I REALLY feel for you. If only the Labour Party hierarchy was as passionate and principled as you. Let's hope that this mess is sorted - and sooner than later - so the party can start to regroup until it begins to resemble a much-needed, viable alternative to Government.

[joeysteele]

This is 1,000% sincere Joey - I REALLY feel for you. If only the Labour Party hierarchy was as passionate and principled as you. Let's hope that this mess is sorted - and sooner than later - so the party can start to regroup until it begins to resemble a much-needed, viable alternative to Government.

Thank you Kirk,its a few weeks since I made that post but the fears and points I raise in it still stand and are more relevant than then.

We have court hearings going on now,this is no way for a major party to be conducting affairs.
We have party members and even some MPs who do not even understand the contest rules.

The only change to my post is that Angela Eagle dropped out and Owen Smith took her place, again however that changes little, if indeed anything at all.
Whatever the result is of this leadership contest, if the losing side will not accept the result, we stay firmly in square one with all the divisions that will leave still wide open.

This really is a worrying time for Labour, no one who really cares about the party and its future should underestimate that.

[arista]

Feck Owen
he is Hated

NewBlairLabour Ponce

[joeysteele]

Feck Owen
he is Hated

NewBlairLabour Ponce

I really like his accent though.

[bots]

Thank you Kirk,its a few weeks since I made that post but the fears and points I raise in it still stand and are more relevant than then.

We have court hearings going on now,this is no way for a major party to be conducting affairs.
We have party members and even some MPs who do not even understand the contest rules.

The only change to my post is that Angela Eagle dropped out and Owen Smith took her place, again however that changes little, if indeed anything at all.
Whatever the result is of this leadership contest, if the losing side will not accept the result, we stay firmly in square one with all the divisions that will leave still wide open.

This really is a worrying time for Labour, no one who really cares about the party and its future should underestimate that.

We all care for the labour party's future, be in no doubt about that. No government should be allowed to govern with no effective opposition, no matter how much we may disagree with that opposition.

As a concerned bystander, i'm struggling to understand why the rank and file of the labour party don't see the absolute hypocrisy of Jeremy Corbyn shining through. If it was on just one topic, he could may be get away with it, but its been on a huge range of issues now, and he has been leader for less than a year. How can anyone trust this man. People rightly condemn Blair for his antics, but Jeremy Corbyn is at least 10 times worse. It really shocks me.

[kirklancaster]

We all care for the labour party's future, be in no doubt about that. No government should be allowed to govern with no effective opposition, no matter how much we may disagree with that opposition.

As a concerned bystander, i'm struggling to understand why the rank and file of the labour party don't see the absolute hypocrisy of Jeremy Corbyn shining through. If it was on just one topic, he could may be get away with it, but its been on a huge range of issues now, and he has been leader for less than a year. How can anyone trust this man. People rightly condemn Blair for his antics, but Jeremy Corbyn is at least 10 times worse. It really shocks me.

Another GREAT post BOTS.

[joeysteele]

We all care for the labour party's future, be in no doubt about that. No government should be allowed to govern with no effective opposition, no matter how much we may disagree with that opposition.

As a concerned bystander, i'm struggling to understand why the rank and file of the labour party don't see the absolute hypocrisy of Jeremy Corbyn shining through. If it was on just one topic, he could may be get away with it, but its been on a huge range of issues now, and he has been leader for less than a year. How can anyone trust this man. People rightly condemn Blair for his antics, but Jeremy Corbyn is at least 10 times worse. It really shocks me.

I don't agree with all you say and I don't see Corbyn as bad as some do.

However, you are someone the party does need to listen to and those who think as you do too.
I prefer to get the views of those we should be trying to get the votes back or even for the first time.

We can pile up votes all we like in the safest seats but if Labour cannot pull in votes in the real power game and seats needed to win,then opposition is the best to hope for.

I just cannot see this leadership election resolving anything, I am angry we only have a forced choice of 2 on the ballot paper.
What kind of leadership election is that.

I'll support the party and will not leave it now because I believe in true social justice and I trust Labour totally as to that,not the lip service given to same by the Conservatives.
My main fight now however is to try to get the agenda to PR for elections.
I have moaned on here loads at parties governing unfettered getting a ridiculous 35% to 37% of the votes cast at best now.

However, securing Labour's future is what is at stake now and whether Corbyn wins well as he did last time or whether Owen Smith scrapes a win,I cannot see where much will change and that really worries me.

Because even if there is a time of calm after this leadership election, I fear the same issues are slowly going to surface again in the likely near future.

[Kizzy]

We all care for the labour party's future, be in no doubt about that. No government should be allowed to govern with no effective opposition, no matter how much we may disagree with that opposition.

As a concerned bystander, i'm struggling to understand why the rank and file of the labour party don't see the absolute hypocrisy of Jeremy Corbyn shining through. If it was on just one topic, he could may be get away with it, but its been on a huge range of issues now, and he has been leader for less than a year. How can anyone trust this man. People rightly condemn Blair for his antics, but Jeremy Corbyn is at least 10 times worse. It really shocks me.

10 times worse than a war criminal?... lo nah.

[arista]

JC is Live on BBCNewsHD
but as it gets near 1PM
they stupidly merge to bbc1 news

"What BBCNewsHD Ch needs is to stay Live
on a Live Link even if it goes on the hour"

He was also Live on SkyNewsHD
but they cut off 10mins early

So he was just Cut short
on BBCNewsHD
No Red Button Live

BBC fecking Crap

[Scarlett.]

As someone who in the past has been quite pro-Jeremy, I've got to admit I've begun losing faith in him, he's starting to come across as a super pacifist, there is nothing wrong with pacifism, but we need to be able to defend ourselves, and our NATO allies.

[joeysteele]

As someone who in the past has been quite pro-Jeremy, I've got to admit I've begun losing faith in him, he's starting to come across as a super pacifist, there is nothing wrong with pacifism, but we need to be able to defend ourselves, and our NATO allies.

It is something he will never change on, I personally don't condemn him for that as he has fought and campaigned as to the issue and the stance he holds to it, all his political career.

What he does need to do is realise,that as a leader of a party aspiring to be in Govt, some decisions he will possibly have to take,(hopefully very few), will likely have to be ones against his hopes and principles, if circumstances dictate same.

[bots]

a little story for those that think Corbyn is genuine. Photographed sitting on the floor on a virgin train, where he passed the opportunity to sit in available seats. Virgin trains have there own photos showing the game he was playing :laugh:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-37167700

[Kizzy]

Can you not see the sets are all reserved?...How would it look if he had taken a seat already bought and paid for by someone?...pffft! Another non story.

[arista]

http://news.sky.com/story/virgin-casts-doubt-on-jeremy-corbyns-packed-train-claim-10548675

Kizzy if you can ,please watch the JC video
loads support what he says.
of course you may have watched it
from the other link.


Branson can Feck Off

[Kizzy]

I've seen it thanks Arista :)

[arista]

update
From Ch5HD news a former blair adviser Lance Price
said JC was making valid points
that matter.

[smudgie]

Pftt, he walked through a carriage with plenty of empty seats before the reserved seats n the next carriages.
Plonker.

[Kizzy]

Pftt, he walked through a carriage with plenty of empty seats before the reserved seats n the next carriages.
Plonker.

Yes 1st class, he didn't want to sit in first class, he says that in the vid.

[smudgie]

Yes 1st class, he didn't want to sit in first class, he says that in the vid.

Tight git.:joker:

[MTVN]

A lot of empty seats he walked past were not reserved and he is shown sitting on an unreserved standard class seat once he'd finished his little stunt. Even with reserved seats they are available to sit in while not occupied, just find one where the passengers journey was supposed to have started at an earlier station.

Would be interested to see the reaction if this was anyone else than Saint Jeremy.

[Kizzy]

Sigh... what if it was someone else blah blah ... If it was David Cameron he would have just used his £10 million private jet bought with pubic funds, but that was totally fine :/

[Kizzy]

The row over whether Jeremy Corbyn had to sit on the floor of a Virgin train has taken a new twist after passengers on the service disputed the company’s version of events.

Earlier this month Mr Corbyn released a video of himself sitting on the floor of a Virgin East Coast train arguing that “this is a problem that many passengers face every day”.

The train company, however, has released CCTV stills showing Mr Corbyn finding a seat on the train, saying that it “clearly wasn’t the case” he could not find somewhere to sit. Though Mr Corbyn did not claim that there were no seats on the train, he said it was “ram-packed”.


http://www.independent.co.uk/news/passengers-dispute-virgin-trains-version-of-jeremy-corbyn-sitting-on-floor-video-a7205631.html

[smudgie]

Did I hear on the news that his new excuse was that he needed two seats together, none for his wife?
Didn't notice her sat next to him in the floor in his propaganda bull**** video.:joker:

[billy123]

This is great i love watching the establishment luvvies wet their knickers in desperation at thinking they found a chink in Jeremy's armour something to attack him for and falling flat on their arses when then realise they are getting excited about a train seat a bloody train seat :joker:
Its not like Richard Branson might have an ulterior motive is it :joker:

Good stuff luvvies great entertainment. If you think the nation as a whole doesnt know the train system is overpriced and overcrowded then you dont use them.

Ignore the facts all you like it just makes it funnier.

[Vicky.]

This guy cannot fart recently without it becoming a huge headline.

I cannot get all outraged that he didn't do what the others would do and book first class, along with a slapup meal and a bottle of champagne, be picked up at the station by a limo then on to the 5* hotel you have booked all inclusive for a week..obviously all claimed on expenses because you have an hour long conference.

On the 'did he lie' stuff. I would rather believe the unbiased passengers than the company who is involved in it all. Also even if it was a publicity stunt, i don't much care. Its a real problem. Its been highlighted. Job done.

As a side note, I used a train for the first time ever without parents a few years back. I didn't actually realize that paying for a ticket in advance didn't actually book you a seat, until we were stuck with 3 young kids in the door part sat on the floor as we had no seat. What kind of nonsense is that? :laugh:

[MTVN]

This is great i love watching the establishment luvvies wet their knickers in desperation at thinking they found a chink in Jeremy's armour something to attack him for and falling flat on their arses when then realise they are getting excited about a train seat a bloody train seat :joker:
Its not like Richard Branson might have an ulterior motive is it :joker:

Good stuff luvvies great entertainment. If you think the nation as a whole doesnt know the train system is overpriced and overcrowded then you dont use them.

Ignore the facts all you like it just makes it funnier.

Yes ignore the facts - facts like Corbyn walked past empty seats before filming his stunt then sat in one right after his video was finished. I guess Derek who operates the CCTV is in on the 'establishment' conspiracy, was put up to it by Branson, and its all doctored to smear Honest Jeremy! After all, he'd never mislead the public like all those Westminster types

[MTVN]

768111608593838080

And tbh Corbyn is the one who first tried to make a point about this by filming his video and having it reported by the Guardian so he can hardly complain when other people talk about it

[Vicky.]

Yes ignore the facts - facts like Corbyn walked past empty seats before filming his stunt then sat in one right after his video was finished. I guess Derek who operates the CCTV is in on the 'establishment' conspiracy, was put up to it by Branson, and its all doctored to smear Honest Jeremy! After all, he'd never mislead the public like all those Westminster types

Other passengers said Jeremy got a seat after the staff upgraded a family to first class to make more seats...

[MTVN]

Other passengers said Jeremy got a seat after the staff upgraded a family to first class to make more seats...

I'm afraid I'm sceptical given he clearly walked past numerous unreserved seats on the footage and then walked past numerous reserved but unoccupied seats. It just does not ring true that they moved a whole family up to first class for no other reason than to make room for Mr Corbyn and that it was only good fortune that left him able to snag the last free seat available on the train

[MTVN]

I mean you can even see when he does take his seat that there are loads of other free seats around him..

http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2016/08/23/15/37839EBC00000578-3754665-image-a-56_1471962002162.jpg

[Vicky.]

I was under the impression you werent allowed to sit in 'reserved' seats. However, I know not much about trains tbh, given my one experience I wrote about upthread :laugh:

[MTVN]

You can if they haven't been occupied, this train set off from London Kings Cross and its first stop was York so if theres an empty seat that was supposed to be for someone starting their journey at Kings Cross then its fair game

I do it all the time lol, check the reserved ticket and if the starting stop has already been then I'll take it. I have also not bothered scouting for a seat on trains even when there are some and just stood/sat between the carriages before which is why I suspect Corbyn might not have been the only one doing so

[joeysteele]

You can if they haven't been occupied, this train set off from London Kings Cross and its first stop was York so if theres an empty seat that was supposed to be for someone starting their journey at Kings Cross then its fair game

I do it all the time lol, check the reserved ticket and if the starting stop has already been then I'll take it. I have also not bothered scouting for a seat on trains even when there are some and just stood/sat between the carriages before which is why I suspect Corbyn might not have been the only one doing so

Being fair, I have done that too like you,the reserved ticket generally has from what station it is reserved from.
Like you, I have found reserved seats where the people who reserved them have not got on the train at all.
I just take that seat then if the train is crowded.

[arista]

I mean you can even see when he does take his seat that there are loads of other free seats around him..

http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2016/08/23/15/37839EBC00000578-3754665-image-a-56_1471962002162.jpg


Yes the Guard Manager of that Train
got him those TWO seats together
by moving those folks to 1st class

[arista]

Other passengers said Jeremy got a seat after the staff upgraded a family to first class to make more seats...


Yes the Real Truth

[bots]

Jeremy the beacon for fairness and truth never misleads loool :laugh:

Some of his supporters may be blind to his repeated hypocrisy, but the voting public are not

[arista]

G4S has now said
they will not do Security
at the Labour Conference in Liverpool

Typical , Like Branson.

[Kizzy]

Why would anyone endorse G4S anyway following the expose?... Surely there are other security firms with a better reputation?

[arista]

Why would anyone endorse G4S anyway following the expose?... Surely there are other security firms with a better reputation?


Yes they must get another
Security Contract




http://news.sky.com/story/fears-for-labour-conference-as-security-firm-g4s-rejects-approach-10551627


[Security firm G4S says it has rejected an approach by Labour to cover its conference, sparking fears it could be cancelled.
G4S said it was contacted by Labour this week, despite being boycotted previously over links to Israel and detention centres.]

[joeysteele]

G4S has now said
they will not do Security
at the Labour Conference in Liverpool

Typical , Like Branson.

If the labour party want proper security at their conference, the last company I would look to and use would be G4S.

[bots]

As a pacifist, why does Corbyn want/need security anyway ... surely it would be wrong to take action against anyone who wanted to do him harm

[joeysteele]

As a pacifist, why does Corbyn want/need security anyway ... surely it would be wrong to take action against anyone who wanted to do him harm

Its not for him it is to ensure all delegates at the conference are safe as well.
All party conferences have strong security at them, especially now.

[bots]

Its not for him it is to ensure all delegates at the conference are safe as well.
All party conferences have strong security at them, especially now.

would be an interesting experiment to have him treat the conference the same way he would the country if he were to become pm though .... after all, he would be responsible for everyones protection then ... and would still not raise a finger to protect any of them

[joeysteele]

would be an interesting experiment to have him treat the conference the same way he would the country if he were to become pm though .... after all, he would be responsible for everyones protection then ... and would still not raise a finger to protect any of them

A lot of people go to the conference where just innocent and ordinary members and others attend for the debates,you have to have protection for them.

I could have gone to this conference but decided against, if I did I would certainly want protection and at least security in place for myself and my fellow members and friends attending.

I think you are being just a little unfair here, Corbyn is against, rightly or wrongly, nuclear weapons as protection, not any conventional forces as to protection and security.
He never has been against those means of security and protection.

[smudgie]

Other passengers said Jeremy got a seat after the staff upgraded a family to first class to make more seats...

Yes, he must have needed quite a few seats for his entourage, can't see wifey sat next to him in the picture mind, she must have been taking a loo break.
Must have been a ruddy big family they moved going by all those empty seats in the carriage he is sat in.

[arista]

If the labour party want proper security at their conference, the last company I would look to and use would be G4S.



No FECK G4S


JC has found another Security firm
Great News Kizzy

Ref: Ian Dale show LBC / SkyNewsHD

[arista]

rPC_phLWNK4

In conversation with Jeremy Corbyn |
documented by Ken Loach



for Kizzy , Joey and Jack

[Brother Leon]

Good to see so many pages on this forum for this Great Country's last hope.

[Pete.]

Hoping for a landslide vote in support today :fc:

[Black Dagger]

Imagine trying to oust him with Owen Smith. Long live Jezza.

[arista]

Yes Jeremy 61.8
O.Smith 38.2


Jeremy Leader Again

[Lostie!]

:clap1:

[Firewire]

KING

[arista]

http://news.sky.com/story/live-labour-leadership-battle-jeremy-corbyn-v-owen-smith-10590541

[Cherie]

It was dumb and dumber so I guess dumb was the only option

[bots]

big surprise that one :laugh:

Now the fun really starts

[kirklancaster]

R.I.P. THE LABOUR PARTY

TUt4DfGnyJQ

[jaxie]

It was dumb and dumber so I guess dumb was the only option

:laugh:

[Northern Monkey]

Well we 'May' as well get used to the Tories for the next 9 years atleast.

[kirklancaster]

Well we 'May' as well get used to the Tories for the next 9 years atleast.

:laugh:

[arista]

Old Labour want a
£10 Min Wage.
(ref: Paul Mason on BBC2HD D.P.)


Ideal for Hog.

[Crimson Dynamo]

Great news for the Conservatives, The Daily Mail, the Express and the Times and Telegraph

:clap1:

[bots]

Great news for the Conservatives, The Daily Mail, the Express and the Times and Telegraph

:clap1:

if the tories can't beat labour now, they deserve to be put in a slow boat to somewhere

[Crimson Dynamo]

The labour woman in Scotland hates him so that should be fun..

[arista]

One to make Kizzy happy

"if" Labour wins power
Fracking will be Banned,

[Crimson Dynamo]

One to make Kizzy happy

"if" Labour wins power
Fracking will be Banned,

They have no fracking chance of ever getting to power

[bots]

Seriously funny that the shadow defence secretary had his speech changed for him .... if that's not a sinister wakeup call to Corbyn and his "friendly and inclusive " approach, I don't know what is.

[Kizzy]

Well pleased with the result :D
LT-j-TGWuGQ

[Livia]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/COsmTt8WgAAgvSa.jpg

[kirklancaster]

They have no fracking chance of ever getting to power

:laugh::laugh::laugh:

[kirklancaster]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/COsmTt8WgAAgvSa.jpg

:laugh: One picture is worth a thousand words - 20,000 words if they are from Corbyn's Manifesto. :hee:

[Kizzy]

Not sure of the relevance of the pic, Corbyn is Labour... His values are Labour values.

[Livia]

The Tories must be delighted that Labour have declared themselves completely unelectable for the forseeable future. It's bad news for all of us, really because we need a strong opposition... not one led by someone whose hardcore following is so rabid they will refuse to accept anything but their own line. There's a reason the only Labour government in the last forty years has been New Labour. It's because Old Labour are unelectable.

[Kizzy]

There is a resurgence in support for old Labour values, and with good reason. Not sure where the 'rabid' following is, unless you mean 61% of the Labour membership, as well as I would have thought a sizable chunk of the 250,000 not permitted a vote for reasons such as supporting the red hot chilli peppers :/

[arista]

Today
JC has given Interviews with every station
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