[lostalex]

Originally Posted by Shasown

You mean kettles and pots and grimey arses? Or throwing stones in Glass houses?

Looks like you are suffering from a bad case of mixed metaphors mate.

If you want to educate us at least get your proverbs correct. People might even look upon your posts as more than some ramblings from a PTT

you just don't get the American sense of humor...

[MTVN]

Originally Posted by lostalex

well really that only shows how transparent they are, even if it was transparently currupt. how many government are holding elections that have no monitorring and no one see's how currupt they are?

When's the last time China even had an election? just out of curiosity...

A couple of days ago actually http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Republi...n,_2012#Result

[lostalex]

Originally Posted by MTVN

A couple of days ago actually http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Republi...n,_2012#Result

really?

[Shasown]

Originally Posted by lostalex

you just don't get the American sense of humor...

Just like the existance of god, am still waiting for proof.


Another smokescreen there, Al?

[Me. I Am Salman]

Originally Posted by Shasown

Try telling that to a group of generally poorly educated young men who a few minutes earlier were fighting for their lives. Men who go through the same sort of extreme high pressure day, for weeks on end.

Men who know if they get taken captive by the enemy who hates them with a religious fervour wont be treated according to the Geneva Convention but will be tortured in the most painful way by that same enemy.

Live under those conditions for a few weeks and maybe you will start to understand why they did what they did.

i still wouldn't piss on a dead human being.

[Shasown]

Originally Posted by Salman!

i still wouldn't piss on a dead human being.

There is an aphorism/adage credited to the Native American that states you should never condemn a man till you have walked a mile (spent a day/week) in his moccasins.

Go through the same things and see how you react before you criticise too hashly.

[lostalex]

Originally Posted by Shasown

Just like the existance of god, am still waiting for proof.


Another smokescreen there, Al?

don't call me Al, i'm not a truck driver.

[Shasown]

Originally Posted by lostalex

don't call me Al, i'm not a truck driver.

oooh I am sorry, you think there is something wrong with Truck drivers?

[MTVN]

I suppose it's definitely true that war dehumanises people, it'd be stupid to think things like this, and far worse, haven't gone on in almost every war throughout history, they just didn't have phones to film it on

Originally Posted by lostalex

Why did the Native Americans cut off the scalps of white settlers in America after the various battles?

Taking trophies and demeaning the dead of the enemy is part of war historically. This is not new.

You really don't want to bring up native Americans as an American. Your treatment of them was appalling, and inexcusable.

[Me. I Am Salman]

Originally Posted by Shasown

There is an aphorism/adage credited to the Native American that states you should never condemn a man till you have walked a mile (spent a day/week) in his moccasins.

Go through the same things and see how you react before you criticise too hashly.

you seem to be condoning their behaviour when even the American government themselves find the act done by their own soldiers disgusting

[lostalex]

Originally Posted by Jesus.H.Christ

You really don't want to bring up native Americans as an American. Your treatment of them was appalling, and inexcusable.

compared to what? compared to the wars for land in europe? you must be joking. North America has nothing to be ashamed of compared to the other continents. North America is the least violent continent in history except for Antartica and Australia(which really isn't a true continent)

South America, Europe, Africa, and Asia have been far worse than anything that's happened in North America.

[Me. I Am Salman]

Originally Posted by Shasown

There is an aphorism/adage credited to the Native American that states you should never condemn a man till you have walked a mile (spent a day/week) in his moccasins.

Go through the same things and see how you react before you criticise too hashly.

so say if someone gave me a hard life. do i have the right to piss on them after they die?
its inhumane and i cant believe that somebody is actually condoning it

[lostalex]

Originally Posted by Salman!

so say if someone gave me a hard life. do i have the right to piss on them after they die?
its inhumane and i cant believe that somebody is actually condoning it

i have no problem with someone pissing on a terrorist, dead or alive. i only have a problem with them filming it, because the enemy will use it for propaganda.

[MTVN]

Originally Posted by lostalex

compared to what? compared to the wars for land in europe? you must be joking. North America has nothing to be ashamed of compared to the other continents. North America is the least violent continent in history except for Antartica and Australia(which really isn't a true continent)

South America, Europe, Africa, and Asia have been far worse than anything that's happened in North America.

fgs it isn't a ******ing competition

Originally Posted by Salman!

so say if someone gave me a hard life. do i have the right to piss on them after they die?
its inhumane and i cant believe that somebody is actually condoning it

It's less about condoning and more about understanding I think, sure it's inhumane but that's what war does

[lostalex]

Originally Posted by MTVN

fgs it isn't a ******ing competition

dunno why yur telling me this. Try telling that to the person i was responding to. let's put things in perspective plzzzz.

[MTVN]

Originally Posted by lostalex

dunno why yur telling me this. Try telling that to the person i was responding to. let's put things in perspective plzzzz.

But every time someone says anything critical about America you insist on making these inane comparisons between the US and Europe to try and show that America is the lesser evil, or that other places are far worse, it's tedious

Yes maybe Jesus H Christ's comment was a bit provocative but he never said that America alone had committed atrocities, why can't we just accept that all countries have blood on their hands without getting overly defensive of the country to which we were born

[lostalex]

Originally Posted by MTVN

But every time someone says anything critical about America you insist on making these inane comparisons between the US and Europe to try and show that America is the lesser evil, or that other places are far worse, it's tedious

Yes maybe Jesus H Christ's comment was a bit provocative but he never said that America alone had committed atrocities, why can't we just accept that all countries have blood on their hands without getting overly defensive of the country to which we were born

Well i think you are ignoring the obvious then. If you don't think i'll respond to criticisim of America by pointing out the hypocrisy of it comming from a European, when Europe is the most violent continent on the planet, i'm sorry, but you arn't looking at things objectively.

How is it weird for me to respond to jibes about America by giving it back to Europe?? You don't understand that really??
What is confusing or unfair about that???

You think there should be a double standard?? Sorry, but i know history, and i'm not gonna let someone from Europe say that America is violent or imperialist, when Europe's history, especially Britains is FAR FAR worse. It's about acknowledging the truth. I'm not British, I'm American, and if you talk trash about America, i'm gonna educate you about the hypocrisy.

[Me. I Am Salman]

Originally Posted by lostalex

i have no problem with someone pissing on a terrorist, dead or alive. i only have a problem with them filming it, because the enemy will use it for propaganda.

Originally Posted by lostalex

compared to what? compared to the wars for land in europe? you must be joking. North America has nothing to be ashamed of compared to the other continents. North America is the least violent continent in history except for Antartica and Australia(which really isn't a true continent)

South America, Europe, Africa, and Asia have been far worse than anything that's happened in North America.

I have no problems admitting that England have acted appallingly towards most other countries in the world, at some point or other. That really is a bizarre answer you've provided. I really can't put into words the disgust with which I review our history. Of course, I am fortunate in one regard, that being that I have no patriotic thoughts in my head. I view the country of my birth as nothing more than an accident of my family tree. I have no loyalty to "england" as a whole, only to my friends and family, regardless of where they happen to reside or were born on this planet.

Originally Posted by lostalex

dunno why yur telling me this. Try telling that to the person i was responding to. let's put things in perspective plzzzz.

You're the one that who brought native Americans into this thread. I merely informed you that you were on shaky ground by doing so, which is historically accurate.

[MTVN]

Originally Posted by lostalex

Well i think you are ignoring the obvious then. If you don't think i'll respond to criticisim of America by pointing out the hypocrisy of it comming from a European, when Europe is the most violent continent on the planet, i'm sorry, but you arn't looking at things objectively.

How is it weird for me to respond to jibes about America by giving it back to Europe?? You don't understand that really??
What is confusing or unfair about that???

You think there should be a double standard??
Sorry, but i know history, and i'm not gonna let someone from Europe say that America is violent or imperialist, when Europe's history, especially Britains is FAR FAR worse. It's about acknowledging the truth. I'm not British, I'm American, and if you talk trash about America, i'm gonna educate you about the hypocrisy.

You're missing the point and this is the problem, the citizens of a country are not accountable for what their nation did in the past, nor are they representative of an entire country or continent. Of course European countries have committed atrocities but that doesn't mean Britons shouldn't be allowed to criticise American ones, it doesn't suddenly lose all it's weight.

Why do you view everything as a contest between Europeans and Americans, if someone points out an American atrocity it doesn't mean they are trying to get one over on Americans, and the same if an American criticised British colonialism. You say you know history but you're just reducing it down to a complete point scoring contest.

I'm happy to criticise the UK's history and it's state today, I've done so a lot on here, I'm also going to criticise America because it's futile to take the side of your own country by default. Like with Jesus, I also view my nationality as an accident and hold no loyalty to it which commits me to having to defend it

[Me. I Am Salman]

Originally Posted by MTVN

fgs it isn't a ******ing competition



It's less about condoning and more about understanding I think, sure it's inhumane but that's what war does

if we're trying to understand bad behaviour maybe we should try to understand the terrorists way of thinking too. i bet they werent even terrorists they were just people who were unlawfully killed. wouldnt be surprised as it has been done before by the us troops. what if they were afraid and were just defending themselves and were killed in the process?

[MTVN]

Originally Posted by Salman!

if we're trying to understand bad behaviour maybe we should try to understand the terrorists way of thinking too. i bet they werent even terrorists they were just people who were unlawfully killed. wouldnt be surprised as it has been done before by the us troops. what if they were afraid and were just defending themselves and were killed in the process?

Yes I agree, we should understand terrorists, it's certainly not just a black and white picture of America/Britain = good, Taleban = bad.

[lostalex]

Originally Posted by MTVN

You're missing the point and this is the problem, the citizens of a country are not accountable for what their nation did in the past, nor are they representative of an entire country or continent. Of course European countries have committed atrocities but that doesn't mean Britons shouldn't be allowed to criticise American ones, it doesn't suddenly lose all it's weight.

Why do you view everything as a contest between Europeans and Americans, if someone points out an American atrocity it doesn't mean they are trying to get one over on Americans, and the same if an American criticised British colonialism. You say you know history but you're just reducing it down to a complete point scoring contest.

I'm happy to criticise the UK's history and it's state today, I've done so a lot on here, I'm also going to criticise America because it's futile to take the side of your own country by default. Like with Jesus, I also view my nationality as an accident and hold no loyalty to it which commits me to having to defend it

I think you understand it.

It's like when someone has something nasty to say about your family. Now they may be saying the same things you've said to your own family members, but if someone outside the family says it, you will be defensive. The point is, it's none of your business, you are not American, you are European, you have plenty of problems in Europe, how DARE you have anything to say about America.

You saying something about my family, is not the same as me saying something nasty about my family. Why do Europeans think they have the RIGHT to have a comment? it's none of you're business.

You will not find a single comment on this forum where i criticized Europe without them saying something about America first.

I have no interest in giving my 2 cents into European business. But once you talk about ME and MINE, then the flood gates open. You wanna talk about America, then i have every right to start talking about Europe.

That's fair, imo.

[Me. I Am Salman]

Originally Posted by mtvn

yes i agree, we should understand terrorists, it's certainly not just a black and white picture of america/britain = good, taleban = bad.

THANK YOU