[bots]

Originally Posted by kirklancaster

The simple truth is; that no one should be FORCED to do anything by law if it is in genuine conflict with their beliefs - religious or otherwise - if there are viable alternatives available.

There is a simple reason why people are FORCED to do things by law, irrespective of religion. It is because The law is paramount.

In your example, all I would need to do would be create a religion that believed murder was a valid option if I disagreed with someone, and I then could not be prosecuted for it. Completely unworkable and that is why all religious groups, or any other group for that matter must abide by the law.

[the truth]

Originally Posted by bitontheslide

There is a simple reason why people are FORCED to do things by law, irrespective of religion. It is because The law is paramount.

In your example, all I would need to do would be create a religion that believed murder was a valid option if I disagreed with someone, and I then could not be prosecuted for it. Completely unworkable and that is why all religious groups, or any other group for that matter must abide by the law.

that's false argument, or a false dichotomy
the law does not force people to agree to gay marriage, in this case individuals are allowed as in many cases to simply not conform and agree on grounds of religious consciousness. the only people breaking the law are radical gay activists making death threats. these people should be locked up.

There is also a distinction to be drawn between old and new testament. The new convenant of Christianity over rode the hard line of the old testament in many key areas. fundamentally Christ and his life and death allowed repentance, forgiveness and redemption. I have read the book and I find nothing of Christ denouncing homosexuality either. Though some people choose to look at the old testament, I don't. I think homosexuality is fine as far as Im concerned. frankly if 2 men or 2 women choose to love each other have sex together etc its none of my business

The new covenant is spoken about first in the book of Jeremiah. The old covenant that God had established with His people required obedience to the Old Testament Mosaic law. Because the wages of sin is death (Romans 6:23), the law required that people perform rituals and sacrifices in order to please God and remain in His grace. The prophet Jeremiah predicted that there would be a time when God would make a new covenant with the nation of Israel.

"‘The day will come,’ says the Lord, ‘when I will make a new covenant with the people of Israel and Judah. . . . But this is the new covenant I will make with the people of Israel on that day,’ says the Lord. ‘I will put my law in their minds, and I will write them on their hearts. I will be their God, and they will be my people’" (Jeremiah 31:31, 33). Jesus Christ came to fulfill the law of Moses (Matthew 5:17) and create a new covenant between God and His people. The old covenant was written in stone, but the new covenant is written on our hearts, made possible only by faith in Christ, who shed His own blood to atone for the sins of the world. Luke 22:20 (ESV) says, "And likewise the cup after they had eaten, saying, ‘This cup that is poured out for you is the new covenant in my blood.’"

Now that we are under the new covenant, we are not under the penalty of the law. We are now given the opportunity to receive salvation as a free gift (Ephesians 2:8-9). Through the life-giving Holy Spirit who lives in all believers (Romans 8:9-11), we can now share in the inheritance of Christ and enjoy a permanent, unbroken relationship with God. Hebrews 9:15 declares, “For this reason Christ is the mediator of a new covenant, that those who are called may receive the promised eternal inheritance—now that He has died as a ransom to set them free from the sins committed under the first covenant.”

Read more: http://www.gotquestions.org/new-cove...#ixzz3Ykq3D4gS

[bots]

Originally Posted by the truth

that's false argument, or a false dichotomy
the law does not force people to agree to gay marriage, in this case individuals are allowed as in many cases to simply not conform and agree on grounds of religious consciousness. the only people breaking the law are radical gay activists making death threats. these people should be locked up.

There is also a distinction to be drawn between old and new testament. The new convenant of Christianity over rode the hard line of the old testament in many key areas. fundamentally Christ and his life and death allowed repentance, forgiveness and redemption. I have read the book and I find nothing of Christ denouncing homosexuality either. Though some people choose to look at the old testament, I don't. I think homosexuality is fine as far as Im concerned. frankly if 2 men or 2 women choose to love each other have sex together etc its none of my business

The new covenant is spoken about first in the book of Jeremiah. The old covenant that God had established with His people required obedience to the Old Testament Mosaic law. Because the wages of sin is death (Romans 6:23), the law required that people perform rituals and sacrifices in order to please God and remain in His grace. The prophet Jeremiah predicted that there would be a time when God would make a new covenant with the nation of Israel.

"‘The day will come,’ says the Lord, ‘when I will make a new covenant with the people of Israel and Judah. . . . But this is the new covenant I will make with the people of Israel on that day,’ says the Lord. ‘I will put my law in their minds, and I will write them on their hearts. I will be their God, and they will be my people’" (Jeremiah 31:31, 33). Jesus Christ came to fulfill the law of Moses (Matthew 5:17) and create a new covenant between God and His people. The old covenant was written in stone, but the new covenant is written on our hearts, made possible only by faith in Christ, who shed His own blood to atone for the sins of the world. Luke 22:20 (ESV) says, "And likewise the cup after they had eaten, saying, ‘This cup that is poured out for you is the new covenant in my blood.’"

Now that we are under the new covenant, we are not under the penalty of the law. We are now given the opportunity to receive salvation as a free gift (Ephesians 2:8-9). Through the life-giving Holy Spirit who lives in all believers (Romans 8:9-11), we can now share in the inheritance of Christ and enjoy a permanent, unbroken relationship with God. Hebrews 9:15 declares, “For this reason Christ is the mediator of a new covenant, that those who are called may receive the promised eternal inheritance—now that He has died as a ransom to set them free from the sins committed under the first covenant.”

Read more: http://www.gotquestions.org/new-cove...#ixzz3Ykq3D4gS

With respect, my argument is anything but false. NO individual is above the law, and certainly not one who hides behind religion. Kirk stated that people should be exempt from law if it conflicted with their religious beliefs. I merely stated the reality which is that religion CANNOT be used as an excuse not to abide by the laws of the land.

Also, Farage would be on dangerous ground if he attempted to exempt a religious group from the law as it would create an incredibly dangerous legal precedent. Thank god he has no chance of getting into power

[Niamh.]

Originally Posted by bitontheslide

There is a simple reason why people are FORCED to do things by law, irrespective of religion. It is because The law is paramount.

In your example, all I would need to do would be create a religion that believed murder was a valid option if I disagreed with someone, and I then could not be prosecuted for it. Completely unworkable and that is why all religious groups, or any other group for that matter must abide by the law.

Exactly.