[Johnnyuk123]

Originally Posted by joeysteele

1. If we leave there will I believe be a rush to get here before we do so, however I think te figures will not decrease that much nor do I think they will after we leave.
Why because I cannot see a responsible UK govt. leaving the single market.
I also think and believe no way at all will it be that all the other 27 Nations of the EU, will give the UK a deal that does not include the free movement still of EU citizens.
So I do not think we will be able to do anything about the numbers except the numbers we can now, from non EU Countries.

2. The contribution that is around £175 million a week now, not the £350million lie 'leave' state now, I largely expect to in reality stay the same.
You may want to join in the other Conservatives who are calling Cameron a liar on this but he has stated that our contribution cannot now be changed without our agreement.
So I do not think in reality the EU will even attempt it, we may be asked to help with more contributions, however I take his word that if a UK govts does not want to, then it will not have to.
If I was a betting man, I would say I;d expect an increase at some time with the UK govts agreement,but I doubt anything of note.

Now you answer me this, where in any shape or form has the EU stated that the leave sides claim of us leaving the EU will mean we can stop EU free movement of its citizen and still get a trading deal.
Name one EU nation or any of the RU hierarchy that has said that is even possible never mind probable.
Are you guaranteeing our govt,will definitely insist on no free movement of EU citizens.
They are not bound to do so by this referendum, which is only about EU membership not the finer detail.

Also, tell me one Nation out of the EU, who is a friend and/or ally of the UK, that has jumped up and said, if the UK leaves the EU, they will really step up to the mark, give us much bigger and better trading deals with them.

Even from the likes of China,India, Australia,and the USA comes te advice that we should stay in the EU, for us.
So just what 'real' deals can you substantiate for your argument on that.

Just one Nation form either point because I know of not one.

You know what, why on earth should I be cross examined by you anyway, it is a bit rich when all the leave side arguments are ifs, maybe's and don't knows.
Whereas, I know what we have with being a member of the EU, as does just a bout everyone committed on the leave and remain sides know what the deals is as members of the EU anyway.

What you have just posted above are also if's and buts too Joey because the reality of the situation of IN or OUT is that no one actually knows for certain. Not me or you. No one but the un elected presidents of the EU who will decide for me and for you. From reading your posts i take it you are pro democracy. The EU is anti democracy. So i hope you understand just what you are giving up. You mentioned gambling, if you were to bet etc... You have also clearly stated in other posts that you are not willing to gamble on this issue so i'm confused now because to me voting to remain IN the EU is a massive gamble. Democracy is something you yourself cherish. That will be gone if the vote to remain wins on the 23rd of June. Also throughout this whole campaign you have asked quite rightly for assurances from those wanting to leave the EU. It isn't a one way street Joey i too could ask you for assurances on why we should remain within the EU.

[joeysteele]

Originally Posted by Johnnyuk123

What you have just posted above are also if's and buts too Joey because the reality of the situation of IN or OUT is that no one actually knows for certain. Not me or you. No one but the un elected presidents of the EU who will decide for me and for you. From reading your posts i take it you are pro democracy. The EU is anti democracy. So i hope you understand just what you are giving up. You mentioned gambling, if you were to bet etc... You have also clearly stated in other posts that you are not willing to gamble on this issue so i'm confused now because to me voting to remain IN the EU is a massive gamble. Democracy is something you yourself cherish. That will be gone if the vote to remain wins on the 23rd of June. Also throughout this whole campaign you have asked quite rightly for assurances from those wanting to leave the EU. It isn't a one way street Joey i too could ask you for assurances on why we should remain within the EU.

I have answered that.

We are in the EU, we know what it is like we know what is likely to come, we have decades of experience of being in the EU, of course we have a much better and clearer picture of what in looks like and is likely to be.

There are always ifs and maybes, there have been many over our decades in the EU but we have come through them, in the EU and still prospered as a Nation a successful economy and Worlds 5th biggest.

So that is the answer of remain, it is all remain ever had to do,point out all we have achieved, done and worked through and dealt with while in the EU for decades.

It was always for the leave side to get out there and substantiate any claim it made that things could be better or even the same.
That they have not done, they have no support and real substantiation as to their claims from any major Nations or anyone we will even need to deal with more, if out.

the experience, the facts and the example of what we have done and how things are as a member of the EU for decades is there for all to see.
Our continued success and status,there for all to see.

It is for the leave side to show fully with full facts that we can do the same for sure or even better if out.

You are looking at all those decades of experience and example of the UK being in the EU and you have decided you want out.
I have done the same and think the opposite I want to stay in from that example and experience of being in the EU, I have witnessed.

You show me with facts that are substantiated that our success and status will not threatened, or downgraded any way,if we leave.
Also show me the facts from anywhere that says for sure, we will not have to accept free movement of EU citizens in the end to get a trading deal with the EU.
Then you are likely to have an argument backed up more.

[Johnnyuk123]

Originally Posted by joeysteele

I have answered that.

We are in the EU, we know what it is like we know what is likely to come, we have decades of experience of being in the EU, of course we have a much better and clearer picture of what in looks like and is likely to be.

There are always ifs and maybes, there have been many over our decades in the EU but we have come through them, in the EU and still prospered as a Nation a successful economy and Worlds 5th biggest.

So that is the answer of remain, it is all remain ever had to do,point out all we have achieved, done and worked through and dealt with while in the EU for decades.

It was always for the leave side to get out there and substantiate any claim it made that things could be better or even the same.
That they have not done, they have no support and real substantiation as to their claims from any major Nations or anyone we will even need to deal with more, if out.

the experience, the facts and the example of what we have done and how things are as a member of the EU for decades is there for all to see.
Our continued success and status,there for all to see.

It is for the leave side to show fully with full facts that we can do the same for sure or even better if out.

You are looking at all those decades of experience and example of the UK being in the EU and you have decided you want out.
I have done the same and think the opposite I want to stay in from that example and experience of being in the EU, I have witnessed.

You show me with facts that are substantiated that our success and status will not threatened, or downgraded any way,if we leave.
Also show me the facts from anywhere that says for sure, we will not have to accept free movement of EU citizens in the end to get a trading deal with the EU.
Then you are likely to have an argument backed up more.

For some reason you think that the UK needs the EU trade deals to survive. The UK needs it's hand held by the EU or we will just vanish from the face of the earth. There is a whole new world out there Joey with new deals to be made that are currently not allowed under EU rules. The EU is small fry in a very large pond. It stops the UK from trading with other countries outside of the EU. You seriously believe that the UK as the 5th largest economy is all down to the help of being in the EU? Seriously? The EU economy like i said before... in 1980 it was at 30%, today it is just under 17% and getting worse and you want to vote for that?