[Bluelight]

Originally Posted by susie q

The NHS has a limited budget, which means that sometimes tough decisions have to be made. Someone is always going to loose out. More money for the NHS isnt always option either, because that would mean paying more NI, tax etc. Speaking as someone who struggles to make ends meet, I would find this difficult, and wouldnt be happy to fund things that dont require treatment for medically recognised conditions. Im happy for transgender to undergo surgery to achieve there goal, but not at someone elses expense.
Perhaps there are other workable solutions out there that they shoould explore.

Be interesting to know your view if you had a son or daughter who was born with gender dysphoria. I guess then it would become very important. I don’t think we can accept that 50% of people with a particulat condition (whatever it is) will die - when a treatment is there. Only 1% of the world population are transgender. So in terms of funding, it’s tiny. How many people who have transitioned do you onow? Puts it in perspective.

[chuff me dizzy]

Originally Posted by Bluelight

Be interesting to know your view if you had a son or daughter who was born with gender dysphoria. I guess then it would become very important. I don’t think we can accept that 50% of people with a particulat condition (whatever it is) will die - when a treatment is there. Only 1% of the world population are transgender. So in terms of funding, it’s tiny. How many people who have transitioned do you onow? Puts it in perspective.

Its not a medical treatment

[Bluelight]

Originally Posted by chuff me dizzy

Its not a medical treatment

What is it then? It’s listed as a medical condition by the World Health Organisation. You need to see pyscotherapists, doctors, surgeons...you go to hospital.
Tell me why gender dysphoria and the resulting treatment is not medical?

[Vicky.]

Originally Posted by chuff me dizzy

Its not a medical treatment

It is a medical treatment, as its done to relieve dysphoria.

The 50% figure is a bit wrong though, 50% of transpeople will not actually kill themselves. They will attempt to though, which is obviously a problem. Its unclear whether this is because of the sex dysphoria or because of underlying mental health issues that seem extremely prevalent though.

People took the piss when I mentioned my family member before (in a serious debates thread) as it was a long introduction, so I will instead say cousin. She has had hormones for the past 10 years and has had a boob job (paid for herself, before you go off on one) but has had absolutely huge issues finding a suitable therapist to try and work through her issues as apparently they absolutely have to go down the affirmation route. She wants to come to terms with being male, and while she does want genital surgery, her partner says that...bluntly...she wants a penis to shag as she is not a lesbian. So my cousin is between a rock and a hard place, wanting full SRS but if she gets it she will be single. So has been trying to find a counsellor to help her try and get over the dysphoria. And found it ridiculously hard to do so. She does have one now though, but it took forever.

I do not see it the same as gay conversion therapy at all. Gay people are gay. Where male people are male. Female people are female. So basically...gay conversion therapy is trying to get someone to get over what they are. Where therapy to help trans people come to terms with their sex, it trying to help them to come to terms with what they are. So I guess this would be, when equated to gay people, the same as having a counselor to help you accept being gay. Obviously this kind of approach would not work for all trans people, maybe not even many...but the option should be there, and easy to find.

[chuff me dizzy]

Originally Posted by Vicky.

It is a medical treatment, as its done to relieve dysphoria.

The 50% figure is a bit wrong though, 50% of transpeople will not actually kill themselves. They will attempt to though, which is obviously a problem. Its unclear whether this is because of the sex dysphoria or because of underlying mental health issues that seem extremely prevalent though.

People took the piss when I mentioned my family member before (in a serious debates thread) as it was a long introduction, so I will instead say cousin. She has had hormones for the past 10 years and has had a boob job (paid for herself, before you go off on one) but has had absolutely huge issues finding a suitable therapist to try and work through her issues as apparently they absolutely have to go down the affirmation route. She wants to come to terms with being male, and while she does want genital surgery, her partner says that...bluntly...she wants a penis to shag as she is not a lesbian. So my cousin is between a rock and a hard place, wanting full SRS but if she gets it she will be single. So has been trying to find a counsellor to help her try and get over the dysphoria. And found it ridiculously hard to do so. She does have one now though, but it took forever.

I do not see it the same as gay conversion therapy at all. Gay people are gay. Where male people are male. Female people are female. So basically...gay conversion therapy is trying to get someone to get over what they are. Where therapy to help trans people come to terms with their sex, it trying to help them to get over what they are not. Obviously this kind of approach would not work for all trans people, maybe not even many...but the option should be there, and easy to find.

My point and the subject of this thread and poll is, people can have whatever op they want,as long as they pay for it

[Vicky.]

Originally Posted by chuff me dizzy

My point and the subject of this thread and poll is, people can have whatever op they want,as long as they pay for it

I get thats the point of the poll. Just felt I had to reply to that as its false that its not a medical treatment. It clearly is a medical treatment. Jurys out on if it should be actually paid for on the NHS. I don't know how I feel about that myself and do think that this whole thing is going to get worse as the NHS becomes more and more skint.

I think my opinion on this is probably that the therapies and hormones and such should be provided on the NHS. But actual SRS should be means tested. If its deemed to be absolutely necessary and the person cannot afford it then yes, NHS. But if they can afford to pay then thats how it should be.

That opens the door though to many many issues and a whole other debate though. Should everything on the NHS be means tested? Quite possibly, would ease the pressure on the NHS for sure. Either that, or the government can start funding the NHS properly...which is not likely to happen

[Bluelight]

Originally Posted by Vicky.

I get thats the point of the poll. Just felt I had to reply to that as its false that its not a medical treatment. It clearly is a medical treatment. Jurys out on if it should be actually paid for on the NHS. I don't know how I feel about that myself and do think that this whole thing is going to get worse as the NHS becomes more and more skint.

I think my opinion on this is probably that the therapies and hormones and such should be provided on the NHS. But actual SRS should be means tested. If its deemed to be absolutely necessary and the person cannot afford it then yes, NHS. But if they can afford to pay then thats how it should be.

That opens the door though to many many issues and a whole other debate though. Should everything on the NHS be means tested? Quite possibly, would ease the pressure on the NHS for sure. Either that, or the government can start funding the NHS properly...which is not likely to happen

Good post - and very fair I think ❤️

[Bluelight]

Originally Posted by chuff me dizzy

My point and the subject of this thread and poll is, people can have whatever op they want,as long as they pay for it

Including cancer and heart operations.

[chuff me dizzy]

Originally Posted by Bluelight

Including cancer and heart operations.

Don't be ridiculous .... have you voted in the poll which is about sex change ops, nothing else

[Bluelight]

Originally Posted by chuff me dizzy

Don't be ridiculous .... have you voted in the poll which is about sex change ops, nothing else

So you’re starting point is that dying from a heart condition is worse than dying from gender dysphoria? You are not treating it as the serious situation it is - but on a par with botox or a boob job. It’s not. As the NHS or any medical organisation will tell you.

[Bluelight]

Originally Posted by chuff me dizzy

Don't be ridiculous .... have you voted in the poll which is about sex change ops, nothing else

You love Ann. There is nothing more to say on this matter. And your ridiculous, offensively titled introduction to this thread. Gender Dysphoria IS just as “medical” as cancer or heart treatments, and is not a “fancy.” Don’t forget your copy of the Daily Mail.

[susie q]

Originally Posted by Bluelight

Be interesting to know your view if you had a son or daughter who was born with gender dysphoria. I guess then it would become very important. I don’t think we can accept that 50% of people with a particulat condition (whatever it is) will die - when a treatment is there. Only 1% of the world population are transgender. So in terms of funding, it’s tiny. How many people who have transitioned do you onow? Puts it in perspective.

My opinion wouldnt change, but as mother would support my child and do what I to help them achieve their goal, and would probably look into fund raising loans etc.

So does this mean that you would be happy to give up your sick childs place on the surgical waiting list, so that a transgender person could have there surgery instead? Like I said a limited budget sometimes means making harsh decisions.

[chuff me dizzy]

Originally Posted by susie q

My opinion wouldnt change, but as mother would support my child and do what I to help them achieve their goal, and would probably look into fund raising loans etc.

So does this mean that you would be happy to give up your sick childs place on the surgical waiting list, so that a transgender person could have there surgery instead? Like I said a limited budget sometimes means making harsh decisions.

Exactly my point ,its about priorities and a sex change is not a medical condition and certainly not a priority for NHS money ... If you want this type of op pay for it ....Simples

[susie q]

Originally Posted by susie q

My opinion wouldnt change, but as mother would support my child and do what I to help them achieve their goal, and would probably look into fund raising loans etc.

So does this mean that you would be happy to give up your sick childs place on the surgical waiting list, so that a transgender person could have there surgery instead? Like I said a limited budget sometimes means making harsh decisions.

Forgot to add that I am an ex nurse, who once nursed (in her old age) the first ever British person to undergo transition surgery. It wasnt done on the NHS nor did she expect it. She was a lovely, caring, lively lady, who didnt expect everything to be handed to her on a plate, (ok that was probably a generational thing) she led an interesting life, and I was glad to have known her. I dont blame you for making genrelisations about people you dont know, its easy on line, its just not for me. Furthermore Im pretty sure that Im not the onlly one who finds it hard to make ends meet, without paying extra taxes. perhaps you dont work as yet.