General Election on Thursday Dec 12th : Conservative Win

[Twosugars]

Meanwhile piers morgan ripped cleverly to pieces over that doctored video of kier steamer

Cons can't help lying

[Beso]

Corbyn can't even keep his understudy in the party...

[Oliver_W]

I hope Labour ditch their stupid "completely open borders" thing if they're gonna get near power.

Is that an actual proposed policy, or was it just Abbott spewing rubbish?

[arista]

Anyway - Tom Watson stepping down


Yes Roll on Dec 12th.

[Liam-]

I hope Labour ditch their stupid "completely open borders" thing if they're gonna get near power.

Is that an actual proposed policy, or was it just Abbott spewing rubbish?

Definitely not a policy from what I’ve seen

[MTVN]

1192195712156651521

Nice bunch

[Kizzy]

A very accurate bunch.

[arista]

[Ian Austin , a former Gordon Brown aide
and Labour minister who quit
the party this year, has urged Labour
supporters to "lend the Tories our votes"
in next month's general election.]


https://news.sky.com/story/general-election-former-labour-minister-urges-party-supporters-to-lend-the-tories-our-votes-11856077

[Kizzy]

The ultimate betrayal... no chance of retaining his seat as an independant at the election so he attempts to sabotage Labour! Judas!

[arista]

The ultimate betrayal... no chance of retaining his seat as an independant at the election so he attempts to sabotage Labour! Judas!


Yes he is just that.
He managed to get on Radio4
SkyNewsHD breakfast
and BBC1 AM

[arista]

1192217467076132864

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EIvrUFGWkAAWbkZ?format=jpg&name=large

The Utter Truth
Matters Slim.
That MP was Not booked for her show - Fact.

Meanwhile Slim, yesterday posted Fake Twitter

[arista]

1192383013872709633

[Livia]

I never thought I'd see the day when a Labour politician urged people to vote Tory. But I have to say, my Labour supporting friends would never vote for Corbyn. He's poison to the party.

[MTVN]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EIwcr2nWsAAOQWd.jpg

[Liam-]

1192387050818953216

[Livia]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EIwcr2nWsAAOQWd.jpg

Powerful piece.

It will not be generally welcomed here, I think.

[Kizzy]

The JC is entitled to its opinion however I still feel that the rise of the old threat... the very real threat of far right expansion is going undocumented in the same way. And I simply can't understand that :/

[arista]

Reported today
60 seats now in a Pact with LibDem /Greens /Welsh
and others all on Remain

[Liam-]

The JC is entitled to its opinion however I still feel that the rise of the old threat... the very real threat of far right expansion is going undocumented in the same way. And I simply can't understand that :/

Because the far right isn’t going to make the elite that run the media pay their fair share in taxes, it’s that simple in my mind

[bots]

In to the 2nd day of campaigning and the tories, labour, lib dems and greens are all a complete disaster to my mind. I don't think we should have to settle for the best of a bad lot. They are all grim but for different reasons. This is absolutely the worst election i've ever experienced.

[Beso]

The ultimate betrayal... no chance of retaining his seat as an independant at the election so he attempts to sabotage Labour! Judas!



Comparing him to a disgraced jew is what I expected from a labour supporter.

[Kizzy]

Comparing him to a disgraced jew is what I expected from a labour supporter.

His role as trade envoy for Israel may have something to do with his new veiw, that's my opinion as a Labour supporter.

[The Slim Reaper]

The Jewish Chronicle is a right wing publication. They do have some dissenting voices although a quick look back at how they covered the previous elections will tell you that they'd never stand up for a non-tory.

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EIwZ6EWVUAAZtc6?format=jpg&name=small

[The Slim Reaper]

https://www.thejc.com/comment/comment/rabbi-s-don-t-vote-corbyn-message-will-only-stoke-jewish-fears-1.491022

Rabbi Jonathan Romain’s decision to write to his community urging them to vote in the forthcoming election for “whichever party is most likely to defeat Labour” in their constituency crosses a red line in the professional and ethical guidelines of UK rabbinic practice.

These codes of conduct and practice in relation to politics are unwritten - but have been well understood for generations.

Of course, rabbis of all denominations will have views on, as well as speak and write about, political issues. How could it be otherwise when the Torah’s vision is filled with concern for the poor and the marginalised in society, care for the outsider, love of the stranger, questions of social justice and how to look after one’s fields and animals and trees?

Jewish ethical principles that affect the way in which the social, legal, economic and environmental policies of a country are arranged are themes that rabbis will think and preach about. But the red line that my friend and colleague has crossed is not to do with politics but party politics.

My concerns about Jonathan Romain’s unwise decision are twofold. The first is the message it sends to the Jewish community. The second is the message it may unwittingly send to the larger, non-Jewish community.

Rabbi Romain considers that his action is justified because we are facing an “unprecedented situation” in relation to antisemitism in the Labour Party.

Although I hold no personal candle for Corbynite Labour and some of his nastier and ignorant fellow-travellers, this situation requires a calm thoughtfulness rather than an emotive, fear-fuelled enactment which merely mirrors the hostility that some Jews feel themselves subjected to.

Jews are understandably upset, angered and fearful when they hear about, or witness, antisemitic remarks or actions. But thoughtful rabbinic leadership at this moment in our history should be helping people manage their anxieties about these trends – which are part of larger, disturbing trends in the society around us: all that toxic swirl of aggression, anger, hatred and victimisation that courses through public discourse and on social media.

A rabbi’s job, I believe, is to help the Jewish community contain its worries and its emotional distress, not by telling people how to cast their vote (as if they didn’t have a mind of their own) but by strengthening their psychological and spiritual wellbeing.

Rabbi Romain’s intemperate action can only stoke Jewish fears, increase people’s anxieties, collude with our historically deep-seated impulses towards paranoid thinking.

And the message it may send to non-Jews? I fear that it colludes with a fantasy that Jews are a homogenous group who are only concerned about themselves rather than the larger shared issues of the society we all live in. And for some it may fan the flames of a belief in Jewish conspiratorial networks that seek to undermine the country’s wellbeing.

Jews are not threatened with organised violence in this country. If it comes, as it might, it will come from the populist right - who have no internal countervailing voices, as the left do. We will then realise that we had our eyes on the wrong ball all along.

Jews are not threatened with organised violence in this country. If it comes, as it might, it will come from the populist right - who have no internal countervailing voices, as the left do. We will then realise that we had our eyes on the wrong ball all along.

[The Slim Reaper]

Like I said in another thread, there is no one zombie-eaque Jewish mind, and to say there is, is an actual anti semitic trope, and not a pretend one like criticising Israel = anti semite.

[MTVN]

Like I said in another thread, there is no one zombie-eaque Jewish mind, and to say there is, is an actual anti semitic trope, and not a pretend one like criticising Israel = anti semite.

You're right but the JC didn't commission the polls that found 87% consider him an anti-Semite and that nearly half would consider emigrating if he were PM. Nor were they behind the resignations of Jewish MPs from Labour because of anti-Semitism in the party

[user104658]

The situation in Israel is - quite literally - one of THE most complex and long-running political conundrums in history... it's constantly ridiculously over-simplified (by many people, with many agendas, for many reasons) in ways that would be comical if it wasn't so infused with tragedy and violence.

People trying to score "political sides" points in the space of a tweet, on an issue that could fill a shelf with textbooks.

[arista]

1192217467076132864

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EIvrUFGWkAAWbkZ?format=jpg&name=large

The Utter Truth
Matters Slim.
That MP was Not booked for her show - Fact.

Meanwhile Slim, yesterday posted Fake Twitter


Posing Again for Slim

[The Slim Reaper]

You're right but the JC didn't commission the polls that found 87% consider him an anti-Semite and that nearly half would consider emigrating if he were PM. Nor were they behind the resignations of Jewish MPs from Labour because of anti-Semitism in the party

The fact that 87% consider him an anti-semite is proof of the value of marketing. Are we then to dismiss Jews that actually support Corbyn and also the Jews that are running in the election for the labour party? Are they not real Jews?

Has anyone got actual quotes from Corbyn that prove him to be anti semitic, or is it just whispers? I could find multiple quotes from Johnson that reveal his actual racism. I agree wholeheartedly that Corbyn didn't deal with the issues in the labour party particularly well, but they are at least addressing them, which is more than you can say for the party leading in the polls, that those same 87% will have no trouble voting for.

No one is blameless, but it's intellectually dishonest to pretend that only labour have their issues.

[The Slim Reaper]

Posing Again for Slim

You can pose for me any day, in your tight little cut off purple hot pants.

I haven't seen the papers this morning, did she not provide any evidence that he'd agreed to go on her show?

[arista]

You can pose for me any day, in your tight little cut off purple hot pants.

I haven't seen the papers this morning, did she not provide any evidence that he'd agreed to go on her show?


NO

which means you are Wrong.............................

[The Slim Reaper]

NO

which means you are Wrong.............................

If that is the case then you are absolutely right - I was wrong.

[arista]

If that is the case then you are absolutely right - I was wrong.


How Nice to See

[The Slim Reaper]

How Nice to See

It's called honesty. Is there anything you want to admit to being wrong about since...say...2016?

[arista]

It's called honesty. Is there anything you want to admit to being wrong about since...say...2016?


Yes Honesty
The 2016 Vote was a Revolution.
Farage Spooked Cameron

Look at this General Election
60 seats in a LibDem/Welsh and Green Remain Pact.

And Today the Bank Of England
backed the New Deal for Brexit.

[Twosugars]

Arista not answering the question.
And employing a distract technique from the four D's of media playbook

[arista]

Arista not answering the question.
And employing a distract technique from the four D's of media playbook


What is your Question?

[MTVN]

The fact that 87% consider him an anti-semite is proof of the value of marketing. Are we then to dismiss Jews that actually support Corbyn and also the Jews that are running in the election for the labour party? Are they not real Jews?

Has anyone got actual quotes from Corbyn that prove him to be anti semitic, or is it just whispers? I could find multiple quotes from Johnson that reveal his actual racism. I agree wholeheartedly that Corbyn didn't deal with the issues in the labour party particularly well, but they are at least addressing them, which is more than you can say for the party leading in the polls, that those same 87% will have no trouble voting for.

No one is blameless, but it's intellectually dishonest to pretend that only labour have their issues.

Not dismiss them but I think it's fair to point out that they are a minority. Anti-Semitism rarely manifests itself in explicit anti-Jewish quotes but Corbyns associations and his world view have undoubtedly made it more mainstream in today's Labour party imo. Things like laying wreaths at the graves of Palestinian terrorists, sharing platforms with Hamas, expressing outrage at a clearly anti-Semitic mural being removed, the decrying of 'Zionist' influence in British politics - it all contributes to many Jewish people feeling uncomfortable and feeling under threat. Some of the testimonies from Jewish Labour members about the bullying they are now subject to within the party speaks volumes

I appreciate that anti-Semitism and anti-Israel are not the same thing but a lot of anti-Semitism now is coded in language against 'Zionism' and the 'Israel lobby'. I posted an example last night ranting about the influence of the Israel lobby which harks back to the classic anti-Semitic stereotype of Jews having too much money and too much power in the world

[Twosugars]

Jewish lobby groups exist and do their lobbying. How stating that is antisemitic?

[MTVN]

Jewish lobby groups exist and do their lobbying. How stating that is antisemitic?

Oops you didn't even use 'Israel lobby' there

[Twosugars]

Oops you didn't even use 'Israel lobby' there

Bc their attitude to Israeli government policies is varied so they cant be described as israel lobby.

I looked up the term to understand your reservations. I see some see it as antisemitic
So I quote a defence of it
In a 2004 speech, Goldberg said, "There has been an awful lot of talk in the last few years about the rise of the Jewish lobby and the influence of the Jewish lobby. It used to be that you couldn't talk about this sort of thing. When I wrote [the book] Jewish Power in 1996... I was accused by various Jewish lobbyists of inflating and buying into the old myths of international Jewish conspiracies simply by the use of the title."[4] Goldberg disagrees with the sensitivity towards the use of the term, arguing that: "There is such a thing as a Jewish lobby, that the network of organizations that works together to put across what might be called the Jewish community's view on world affairs is not insignificant, it's not an invention, but it is not some sort of all-powerful octopus that it's sometimes portrayed as these days."[4] Mearsheimer and Walt wrote in 2006 that "even the Israeli media refer to America's 'Jewish Lobby'",[21] and stated the following year that "AIPAC and the Conference of Presidents and the Israeli media themselves refer to America's 'Jewish Lobby'."[22]
Wikipedia

[The Slim Reaper]

Not dismiss them but I think it's fair to point out that they are a minority. Anti-Semitism rarely manifests itself in explicit anti-Jewish quotes but Corbyns associations and his world view have undoubtedly made it more mainstream in today's Labour party imo. Things like laying wreaths at the graves of Palestinian terrorists, sharing platforms with Hamas, expressing outrage at a clearly anti-Semitic mural being removed, the decrying of 'Zionist' influence in British politics - it all contributes to many Jewish people feeling uncomfortable and feeling under threat. Some of the testimonies from Jewish Labour members about the bullying they are now subject to within the party speaks volumes

I appreciate that anti-Semitism and anti-Israel are not the same thing but a lot of anti-Semitism now is coded in language against 'Zionism' and the 'Israel lobby'. I posted an example last night ranting about the influence of the Israel lobby which harks back to the classic anti-Semitic stereotype of Jews having too much money and too much power in the world

Some valid points, but are you sure that anti semitism doesn't manifest itself publicly?

I think we just see things differently when it comes to your point about criticism of Israel. Israel is an apartheid state, unquestionably, and undeniably. Are you denying or challenging that fact? Israel is also a country that is turning increasingly and even more worryingly rightward, and this pretense that it's become coded is actually the opposite way to how I see things; discussion and debate is actually being shut down because the mere mention of the way successive Israeli governments have treated Palestinians, leaves the accuser open to being labelled an anti semite.

The emphasis on Zionism rather than jews was a way to to avoid such accusations and talk honestly about what is happening over there, without the fear of being labelled as anti-jewish, and that's also now being flipped upside down.

I strongly disagree with the suicide attacks against Israel, but Nelson Mandela was also a terrorist for fighting for his freedom. The UN gives a country under occupation the right to form an army and fight back. These terrorist organisations were setup to fight back. Our media only pushes one side of this issue. None of us know how we would react if we were treated the same way Palestinians.

I just know when one side is oppressed, and one side is the oppressor, I'll always try and support the oppressed. I don't see Corbyn as any different.


I just don't see the same energy when Boris jokes about syria becoming the new Dubai as soon as they've swept the bodies out of the streets, or his letterbox comments, or many of his other directed and pointed racist comments. For Corbyn, it's all innuendo and whispers, with Johnson, people just ignore it because they don't care about genuine racism.

[Tom4784]

It's easy to focus on whispers about an enemy then confronting an issue in your backyard. There was a quote that Reaper posted recently from a Rabbi which basically said that focusing on the left allows far right extremism, that can and has affected jews, to thrive.

I personally think Corbyn needs to step down because he's damaged goods at this point and the boomers are doing their typical thing of believing their feelings over facts. I don't think Labour can win under Corbyn but a lot of the character assassination that has taken place against him from people who brush racism on their own side under the rug.

If there is actual evidence of Corbyn being anti-semitic then crucify him for it but at the moment, it just seems like it's the machine in action, the same machine that convinced people to vote against their own interests, that's slowly making out that the NHS is a failing industry in order to sow seeds for privatisation etc.

[Twosugars]

Speaking of terrorism, I had a further look at various groups, prompted by MTVN posts.

Have you all heard of Irgun? Many later prominent Israeli politicians like Begin or Shamir belonged to it and it waged military and terrorist fight for Israel's independence

Two of the operations for which the Irgun is best known are the bombing of the King David Hotel in Jerusalem on 22 July 1946 and the Deir Yassin massacre, carried out together with Lehi on 9 April 1948.

The Irgun has been viewed as a terrorist organization or organization which carried out terrorist acts.[3][4][5][6] Specifically the organization "committed acts of terrorism and assassination against the British, whom it regarded as illegal occupiers, and it was also violently anti-Arab" according to the Encyclopædia Britannica.[7] In particular the Irgun was described as a terrorist organization by the United Nations, British, and United States governments; in media such as The New York Times newspaper;[8][9] as well as by the Anglo-American Committee of Inquiry,[10][11] the 1946 Zionist Congress[12] and the Jewish Agency.[13]
Wikipedia

[arista]

https://pbs.twimg.com/ad_img/1192456887402422272/38K20ql4?format=jpg&name=small

[Twosugars]

IDS, an architect of universal credit, responsible for human misery across the land.

[MTVN]

Bc their attitude to Israeli government policies is varied so they cant be described as israel lobby.

I liked up the term to understand your reservations. I see some see it as antisemitic
So I quote a defence of it
In a 2004 speech, Goldberg said, "There has been an awful lot of talk in the last few years about the rise of the Jewish lobby and the influence of the Jewish lobby. It used to be that you couldn't talk about this sort of thing. When I wrote [the book] Jewish Power in 1996... I was accused by various Jewish lobbyists of inflating and buying into the old myths of international Jewish conspiracies simply by the use of the title."[4] Goldberg disagrees with the sensitivity towards the use of the term, arguing that: "There is such a thing as a Jewish lobby, that the network of organizations that works together to put across what might be called the Jewish community's view on world affairs is not insignificant, it's not an invention, but it is not some sort of all-powerful octopus that it's sometimes portrayed as these days."[4] Mearsheimer and Walt wrote in 2006 that "even the Israeli media refer to America's 'Jewish Lobby'",[21] and stated the following year that "AIPAC and the Conference of Presidents and the Israeli media themselves refer to America's 'Jewish Lobby'."[22]
Wikipedia

I think the criticisms of the term on that article are far stronger than that solitary defence

Talk of a 'Jewish Lobby' in the UK is particularly far wide of the mark and just not really a thing outside of conspiracy circles

Some valid points, but are you sure that anti semitism doesn't manifest itself publicly?

I think we just see things differently when it comes to your point about criticism of Israel. Israel is an apartheid state, unquestionably, and undeniably. Are you denying or challenging that fact? Israel is also a country that is turning increasingly and even more worryingly rightward, and this pretense that it's become coded is actually the opposite way to how I see things; discussion and debate is actually being shut down because the mere mention of the way successive Israeli governments have treated Palestinians, leaves the accuser open to being labelled an anti semite.

The emphasis on Zionism rather than jews was a way to to avoid such accusations and talk honestly about what is happening over there, without the fear of being labelled as anti-jewish, and that's also now being flipped upside down.

I strongly disagree with the suicide attacks against Israel, but Nelson Mandela was also a terrorist for fighting for his freedom. The UN gives a country under occupation the right to form an army and fight back. These terrorist organisations were setup to fight back. Our media only pushes one side of this issue. None of us know how we would react if we were treated the same way Palestinians.

I just know when one side is oppressed, and one side is the oppressor, I'll always try and support the oppressed. I don't see Corbyn as any different.


I just don't see the same energy when Boris jokes about syria becoming the new Dubai as soon as they've swept the bodies out of the streets, or his letterbox comments, or many of his other directed and pointed racist comments. For Corbyn, it's all innuendo and whispers, with Johnson, people just ignore it because they don't care about genuine racism.

Well I'm not going to be drawn into defending Israeli government policy but given the debate around it I wouldn't consider it a 'fact' and I think we have to be very careful about terminology. Your description of Palestinian terrorists seems overly romanticised given the tactics they use, the language they use (which is definitely explicitly anti-Semitic), their ideology and the backing they get from some quite powerful nations.

In any case though its one thing to criticise Israel's actions but what is more iffy is whipping up this idea of a malign 'Israeli'/'Zionist' influence on our politics and our decision makers. It implies that there are these shadowy Jewish financiers in the background pulling the strings and so every bad thing that happens is then blamed on the 'Israel lobby'. That's what harks back to old anti-Semitic stereotypes as does this idea that Israel is some uniquely evil country and any sympathy you have with them is almost criminal. Take this example of a Labour MP who was trying to improve conditions in Gaza:

She went on the Today programme to talk about the difficulties faced by parents of sick children in Gaza in getting permits to travel to visit them in East Jerusalem and the West Bank. Israel’s deputy ambassador to the UK, Sharon Bar-Li, also appeared on the programme. She invited Allin-Khan to continue their discussion at a meeting at the embassy.

After that meeting Allin-Khan tweeted: “It was a pleasure to meet @SharonBarli again at the Israeli Embassy to continue our constructive discussions about access to healthcare for Palestinians. I look forward to continuing to work together on such crucial humanitarian issues.”

And that’s when it all kicked off.

“The pushback was just horrific, unlike anything I have ever experienced,” said Allin-Khan. “I didn’t anticipate a backlash of this nature at all. I was genuinely astonished, and deeply disappointed, at this unleashing of antisemitic abuse on Twitter.” The tweets included accusations that she was a “direct collaborator in apartheid” for having held talks with Israeli diplomats, and of having been “bought by the Zionists for a bag of silver and a duplex in Marbella”. One said: “Disgusting. Collaboration with occupiers and oppressors. Shameless.”

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/aug/03/rosena-allin-khan-israel-children-hospital-human-rights

That's the sort of thing that has become standard fare

[arista]

IDS, an architect of universal credit, responsible for human misery across the land.


Can that Lady beat him?

[Twosugars]

I think the criticisms of the term on that article are far stronger than that solitary defence

Talk of a 'Jewish Lobby' in the UK is particularly far wide of the mark and just not really a thing outside of conspiracy circles


Haven't had the time to read the full article.

I meant american organisations tbf, like J Street of which I read some time ago.

My concern is about ordinary people unaware of semantic nuances who may be labelled as antisemite for no good reason whatsoever.
I mean I have jewish blood and I'm in danger of being labelled bc I had no clue about the fact jewish lobby as a term is a no-no.
And as I said earlier calling all lobby groups pro israel ie pro israeli state policies is simply not true.

[The Slim Reaper]

Well I'm not going to be drawn into defending Israeli government policy but given the debate around it I wouldn't consider it a 'fact' and I think we have to be very careful about terminology. Your description of Palestinian terrorists seems overly romanticised given the tactics they use, the language they use (which is definitely explicitly anti-Semitic), their ideology and the backing they get from some quite powerful nations.

In any case though its one thing to criticise Israel's actions but what is more iffy is whipping up this idea of a malign 'Israeli'/'Zionist' influence on our politics and our decision makers. It implies that there are these shadowy Jewish financiers in the background pulling the strings and so every bad thing that happens is then blamed on the 'Israel lobby'. That's what harks back to old anti-Semitic stereotypes as does this idea that Israel is some uniquely evil country and any sympathy you have with them is almost criminal. Take this example of a Labour MP who was trying to improve conditions in Gaza:


That's the sort of thing that has become standard fare

I wasn't romanticising the palestinians; I was just highlighting the conditions they are forced to endure, and showing that the other side of the discussion is or should actually be about freedom and rights, because they are an indisputably occupied country. I'd rather everyone be able to reach an agreement through dialogue, but I can't honestly say how the people of this country would react if, say, Germany invaded and occupied us tomorrow.

I'm not romanticising my compatriots by saying we'd be well within our rights to form a militia to fight against them, but to the Germans we'd also be terrorists. Those are the distinctions between an occupier and the occupied.

England is one of the countries that should be able to have an honest discussion about such issues because of our past of just carving up and redrawing maps has contributed to so many deaths/wars over the years, that we still see to this day.

There are no peoples that are inherently "better or worse" than another set of people, yet the distinction with this whole discussion seems to rest on which country currently holds all the power.

https://www.jewishvoiceforlabour.org.uk/article/fifty-times-jeremy-corbyn-stood-with-jewish-people/

It reads:

Corbyn organised the Apr. 1977 defence of Jewish populated Wood Green from a Neo-Nazi march
EDM3933 7 Nov. 1990: Corbyn signs motion condemning the rise of antisemitism
EDM634, 11 Apr. 2000: Jeremy Corbyn signs motion condemning David Irving for being a Holocaust Denier
EDM1124, 6 Nov. 2000: Jeremy Corbyn praised the ‘British Schindler’, Bill Barazetti, for his WW2 kindertransport
EDM742, 28 Jan. 2002: Jeremy Corbyn signs motion praising football clubs for commemorating Holocaust Day
EDM1233 30 Apr. 2002: Corbyn was a primary sponsor on a motion condemning antisemitism
11 May 2002: Jeremy led a clean up of Finsbury Park Synagogue after an anti-Semitic attack
EDM1691, 23 July 2002: Corbyn condemned attacks on a synagogue in Swansea
EDM123 26 Nov. 2003: Corbyn officially condemns attacks on 2 Istanbul synagogues
EDM298, 16 Dec. 2003: Jeremy Corbyn signs motion commemorating International Holocaust Day
2004: Jeremy condemned news that anti-Semitic hate crimes had risen for yet another year
EDM461, 21 Jan. 2004: Jeremy Corbyn condemned the French government’s moves to ban the Jewish Kippa in French Schools
EDM717, 26 Feb. 2004: Jeremy signed a motion praising Simon Wiesenthal for bringing Nazi perpetrators of the Holocaust to justice
EDM1613, 8 Sept. 2004: Corbyn co-sponsored a bill expressing fears for the future of the United Synagogue Pension Scheme
EDM1699, 11 Oct. 2004: Jeremy Corbyn condemned arbitrary attacks on civilians in Israel and Palestine
EDM482, 12 Jan. 2005: Jeremy Corbyn signs a motion commemorating International Holocaust Day
EDM343, 16 June 2005: Jeremy condemned the desecration of a Jewish cemetery in east London
EDM1343, 11 Jan. 2006: Jeremy Corbyn signs a motion commemorating International Holocaust Day
EDM1774, 8 Mar. 2006: Jeremy Corbyn led condemnations of an Iranian Magazine soliciting cartoons about the Holocaust
EDM1267, 16 Apr. 2006: Jeremy Corbyn condemned Bryan Ferry for anti-Semitic remarks
EDM2414, 26 June 2006: Jeremy Corbyn praised British war veterans for their efforts to combat the Holocaust
EDM2705, 10 Oct. 2006: Jeremy signed a motion marking the 70th anniversary of Cable Street
EDM271, 14 Nov. 2007: Jeremy co-sponsored a motion lamenting the poverty and social exclusion East London Jews suffered
EDM153, 12 May 2008: Corbyn praised the efforts of the Jews in the Warsaw Ghetto during the uprising of 1944
EDM2350, 27 Oct 2008: Jeremy Corbyn signs a motion marking the 70th anniversary of the horrors of the holocaust
EDM173, 8 Dec. 2008: Jeremy condemned the Press Complaints Commission for refusing to sanction The Times for antisemitism
EDM461, 14 Jan. 2009: Jeremy Corbyn condemned a wave of recent anti-Semitic incidents targeted
EDM605, 27 Jan. 2009: Corbyn signed John Mann’s motion condemning antisemitism on university campuses
EDM917 26 Feb. 2009: Jeremy signs a motion condemning antisemitism on the internet
EDM1175 24 Mar. 2009: Corbyn signs a motion praising the heroism of British Jews during Holocaust
EDM337, 2 Dec. 2009: Jeremy Condemned Iran’s treatment of Jewish minorities in Iran
EDM850 9 Feb. 2010: Jeremy joins in calls for Facebook to do more to fight antisemitism
EDM891: 22 Feb 2010: Corbyn co-sponsors a motion calling for Yemen’s Jews to be given refugee status to the UK
EDM908 27 Oct. 2010: Corbyn praises work of late Israeli PM in his pursuit of a 2 state solution
EDM1360, 27 Jan. 2011: Corbyn co-sponsored a motion praising the ‘never again for anyone initiative’
EDM1527, 3 Mar. 2011: Corbyn backed Ian Paisley’s motion condemning the anti-Semitic remarks of Dior’s lead fashion designer
EDM2870, 14 Mar. 2012: Jeremy Corbyn condemned the sale of Nazi memorabilia at an auction in Bristol
EDM2866, 14 Mar 2012: Jeremy Corbyn co-sponsored a bill condemning the rise of antisemitism in Lithuania
EDM2899, 20 Mar. 2012, Jeremy Corbyn condemned a terrorist attack on a Jewish school in Toulouse
EDM168, 12 June 2012, Jeremy co-sponsored a motion condemning anti-Semitic attacks during EURO 2012 in Poland
EDM 195 13 June 2012: Jeremy attacks BBC for cutting Jewish programmes from Its schedule
EDM 1133 1 Mar 2013: Corbyn joins a chorus of calls condemning antisemitism In sport
1 Oct. 2013: Corbyn was one of the few MPs who defended Ralph Miliband from Daily Mail antisemitism
EDM 932 9 Jan 2014: Jeremy praises Holocaust Memorial’s work on antisemitism education
EDM 165 22 June 2015: Jeremy condemns a Neo-Nazi rally planned for a Jewish area of London
Sat 4 July 2015: Jeremy co-planned a counter-fascist demo in defence of Jewish residents at Golders Green. The march was re-routed
18 Nov. 2015, Corbyn used one of his first PMQs to challenge Cameron to do more on antisemiUsm
9 Oct 2016: Corbyn, close to tears, leads commemoration of the Battle of Cable Street
3 Dec. 2016: Corbyn visits Terezin Concentration Camp to commemorate Holocaust victims
In 2017-19 Jeremy introduced 20 new measures to combat antisemitism in the Labour Party
Corbyn has already received extensive support from Orthodox Jewish leaders. Thirty-four leading rabbis signed a letter praising Labour’s “respected leader” and describing attacks on him as “irresponsible”. The letter was attacked as a fake by Corbyn’s critics, who were later forced to withdraw the claim when evidence was revealed by the SKWAWKBOX that they were aware of its authenticity.

A letter by Jewish citizens published by the Sunday Times was similarly attacked.



Pretty clear that if you're always standing up for the oppressed, eventually you'll make enemies on all sides.

[Twosugars]

A good post, TSR. agree fully.

[arista]

1192484563764695041

[smudgie]

1192484563764695041

Seriously hoping she loses her job.

[arista]

Seriously hoping she loses her job.


She could
be gone as a MP


She is Leader
of Change UK Indie Group
only 3 of or less MP's in that failed group

[Twosugars]

Seriously hoping she keeps her job. Or remains a prominent voice in different capacity. A courageous and thoughtful politician

[The Slim Reaper]

1192401582421413893

[The Slim Reaper]

https://www.thelondoneconomic.com/opinion/who-is-afraid-of-jeremy-corbyn/07/11/

[arista]

Seriously hoping she keeps her job. Or remains a prominent voice in different capacity. A courageous and thoughtful politician


Sure
but she is on the wrong side of the Referendum Vote
so has every chance of going , sadly.

[Twosugars]

Sure
but she is on the wrong side of the Referendum Vote
so has every chance of going , sadly.

Wrong side? Then half the country should go too?

So cocky bc of 1.9% majority. Won't do you any good

[arista]

John Woodcock MP and Ian Austin MP
former Labour MP's say they both will be voting for
Boris Johnson.

Ch4HD news reported

So 2 Ex Labour MP's
are voting Conservative.

Ian is on Ch4HD news

[Kizzy]

Not dismiss them but I think it's fair to point out that they are a minority. Anti-Semitism rarely manifests itself in explicit anti-Jewish quotes but Corbyns associations and his world view have undoubtedly made it more mainstream in today's Labour party imo. Things like laying wreaths at the graves of Palestinian terrorists, sharing platforms with Hamas, expressing outrage at a clearly anti-Semitic mural being removed, the decrying of 'Zionist' influence in British politics - it all contributes to many Jewish people feeling uncomfortable and feeling under threat. Some of the testimonies from Jewish Labour members about the bullying they are now subject to within the party speaks volumes

I appreciate that anti-Semitism and anti-Israel are not the same thing but a lot of anti-Semitism now is coded in language against 'Zionism' and the 'Israel lobby'. I posted an example last night ranting about the influence of the Israel lobby which harks back to the classic anti-Semitic stereotype of Jews having too much money and too much power in the world

I'd say you've contradicted yourself here, initially you state there is rarely direct quotes that represent an antisemetismic view, and then you speak of classic tropes of the Jewish having too much money and power.

What is wrong with talking... Is diplomacy a dying art in favor of shoot someone in the back and ask questions later?
I WANT a leader of a free world to speak to all people's, acknowledge all grieviences and respect all people equally. To negotiate peace and not engage in a wholly reactionary manner.

As said the voices of Jewish Labour campaigners who support corbyn as well as respected Jewish academics who speak out regularly in his defence are being ignored and sidelined, to me THAT smacks of antisemitism. Why are they being marginalised due to not adhering to the anti Corbyn rally cry?

[Kizzy]

1192401582421413893

:clap1: :clap1: :clap1:

[arista]

Hartlepool has Richard Tice of the Brexit Party
running for it.
70% want Brexit , there.


Ch4HD news interview

[Kizzy]

I wasn't romanticising the palestinians; I was just highlighting the conditions they are forced to endure, and showing that the other side of the discussion is or should actually be about freedom and rights, because they are an indisputably occupied country. I'd rather everyone be able to reach an agreement through dialogue, but I can't honestly say how the people of this country would react if, say, Germany invaded and occupied us tomorrow.

I'm not romanticising my compatriots by saying we'd be well within our rights to form a militia to fight against them, but to the Germans we'd also be terrorists. Those are the distinctions between an occupier and the occupied.

England is one of the countries that should be able to have an honest discussion about such issues because of our past of just carving up and redrawing maps has contributed to so many deaths/wars over the years, that we still see to this day.

There are no peoples that are inherently "better or worse" than another set of people, yet the distinction with this whole discussion seems to rest on which country currently holds all the power.

https://www.jewishvoiceforlabour.org.uk/article/fifty-times-jeremy-corbyn-stood-with-jewish-people/

It reads:

Corbyn organised the Apr. 1977 defence of Jewish populated Wood Green from a Neo-Nazi march
EDM3933 7 Nov. 1990: Corbyn signs motion condemning the rise of antisemitism
EDM634, 11 Apr. 2000: Jeremy Corbyn signs motion condemning David Irving for being a Holocaust Denier
EDM1124, 6 Nov. 2000: Jeremy Corbyn praised the ‘British Schindler’, Bill Barazetti, for his WW2 kindertransport
EDM742, 28 Jan. 2002: Jeremy Corbyn signs motion praising football clubs for commemorating Holocaust Day
EDM1233 30 Apr. 2002: Corbyn was a primary sponsor on a motion condemning antisemitism
11 May 2002: Jeremy led a clean up of Finsbury Park Synagogue after an anti-Semitic attack
EDM1691, 23 July 2002: Corbyn condemned attacks on a synagogue in Swansea
EDM123 26 Nov. 2003: Corbyn officially condemns attacks on 2 Istanbul synagogues
EDM298, 16 Dec. 2003: Jeremy Corbyn signs motion commemorating International Holocaust Day
2004: Jeremy condemned news that anti-Semitic hate crimes had risen for yet another year
EDM461, 21 Jan. 2004: Jeremy Corbyn condemned the French government’s moves to ban the Jewish Kippa in French Schools
EDM717, 26 Feb. 2004: Jeremy signed a motion praising Simon Wiesenthal for bringing Nazi perpetrators of the Holocaust to justice
EDM1613, 8 Sept. 2004: Corbyn co-sponsored a bill expressing fears for the future of the United Synagogue Pension Scheme
EDM1699, 11 Oct. 2004: Jeremy Corbyn condemned arbitrary attacks on civilians in Israel and Palestine
EDM482, 12 Jan. 2005: Jeremy Corbyn signs a motion commemorating International Holocaust Day
EDM343, 16 June 2005: Jeremy condemned the desecration of a Jewish cemetery in east London
EDM1343, 11 Jan. 2006: Jeremy Corbyn signs a motion commemorating International Holocaust Day
EDM1774, 8 Mar. 2006: Jeremy Corbyn led condemnations of an Iranian Magazine soliciting cartoons about the Holocaust
EDM1267, 16 Apr. 2006: Jeremy Corbyn condemned Bryan Ferry for anti-Semitic remarks
EDM2414, 26 June 2006: Jeremy Corbyn praised British war veterans for their efforts to combat the Holocaust
EDM2705, 10 Oct. 2006: Jeremy signed a motion marking the 70th anniversary of Cable Street
EDM271, 14 Nov. 2007: Jeremy co-sponsored a motion lamenting the poverty and social exclusion East London Jews suffered
EDM153, 12 May 2008: Corbyn praised the efforts of the Jews in the Warsaw Ghetto during the uprising of 1944
EDM2350, 27 Oct 2008: Jeremy Corbyn signs a motion marking the 70th anniversary of the horrors of the holocaust
EDM173, 8 Dec. 2008: Jeremy condemned the Press Complaints Commission for refusing to sanction The Times for antisemitism
EDM461, 14 Jan. 2009: Jeremy Corbyn condemned a wave of recent anti-Semitic incidents targeted
EDM605, 27 Jan. 2009: Corbyn signed John Mann’s motion condemning antisemitism on university campuses
EDM917 26 Feb. 2009: Jeremy signs a motion condemning antisemitism on the internet
EDM1175 24 Mar. 2009: Corbyn signs a motion praising the heroism of British Jews during Holocaust
EDM337, 2 Dec. 2009: Jeremy Condemned Iran’s treatment of Jewish minorities in Iran
EDM850 9 Feb. 2010: Jeremy joins in calls for Facebook to do more to fight antisemitism
EDM891: 22 Feb 2010: Corbyn co-sponsors a motion calling for Yemen’s Jews to be given refugee status to the UK
EDM908 27 Oct. 2010: Corbyn praises work of late Israeli PM in his pursuit of a 2 state solution
EDM1360, 27 Jan. 2011: Corbyn co-sponsored a motion praising the ‘never again for anyone initiative’
EDM1527, 3 Mar. 2011: Corbyn backed Ian Paisley’s motion condemning the anti-Semitic remarks of Dior’s lead fashion designer
EDM2870, 14 Mar. 2012: Jeremy Corbyn condemned the sale of Nazi memorabilia at an auction in Bristol
EDM2866, 14 Mar 2012: Jeremy Corbyn co-sponsored a bill condemning the rise of antisemitism in Lithuania
EDM2899, 20 Mar. 2012, Jeremy Corbyn condemned a terrorist attack on a Jewish school in Toulouse
EDM168, 12 June 2012, Jeremy co-sponsored a motion condemning anti-Semitic attacks during EURO 2012 in Poland
EDM 195 13 June 2012: Jeremy attacks BBC for cutting Jewish programmes from Its schedule
EDM 1133 1 Mar 2013: Corbyn joins a chorus of calls condemning antisemitism In sport
1 Oct. 2013: Corbyn was one of the few MPs who defended Ralph Miliband from Daily Mail antisemitism
EDM 932 9 Jan 2014: Jeremy praises Holocaust Memorial’s work on antisemitism education
EDM 165 22 June 2015: Jeremy condemns a Neo-Nazi rally planned for a Jewish area of London
Sat 4 July 2015: Jeremy co-planned a counter-fascist demo in defence of Jewish residents at Golders Green. The march was re-routed
18 Nov. 2015, Corbyn used one of his first PMQs to challenge Cameron to do more on antisemiUsm
9 Oct 2016: Corbyn, close to tears, leads commemoration of the Battle of Cable Street
3 Dec. 2016: Corbyn visits Terezin Concentration Camp to commemorate Holocaust victims
In 2017-19 Jeremy introduced 20 new measures to combat antisemitism in the Labour Party
Corbyn has already received extensive support from Orthodox Jewish leaders. Thirty-four leading rabbis signed a letter praising Labour’s “respected leader” and describing attacks on him as “irresponsible”. The letter was attacked as a fake by Corbyn’s critics, who were later forced to withdraw the claim when evidence was revealed by the SKWAWKBOX that they were aware of its authenticity.

A letter by Jewish citizens published by the Sunday Times was similarly attacked.



Pretty clear that if you're always standing up for the oppressed, eventually you'll make enemies on all sides.

Excellent post thank you so much, I intend to screenshot this for future reference.

[The Slim Reaper]

Excellent post thank you so much, I intend to screenshot this for future reference.

See the dates on those, then lets have a little peak at what Boris was up to in 2008

https://www.standard.co.uk/news/mayor/boris-says-sorry-over-blacks-have-lower-iqs-article-in-the-spectator-6630340.html

Boris Johnson apologised again over race issues today after he was accused of condoning an article that claimed black people have a lower IQ.

The Tory mayoral candidate came under fire from Ken Livingstone and a leading black lawyer over pieces published in the Spectator magazine when he was editor.

In one, columnist Taki wrote that "Orientals ... have larger brains and higher IQ scores. Blacks are at the other pole." In another, he described black American bastketball players as having "arms hanging below their knees and tongues sticking out".

When asked today if he had condoned the articles, unearthed by black newspaper-New Nation, Mr Johnson told the Standard: "I am sorry for what was previously written as it does not reflect what is in my heart.

Still, I fear what will happen if I have to live under a Corbyn government.

IFGKWK6rmyc

[Kizzy]

Don't worry it'll be great :D

[Beso]

I pity the party that wins...**** DAT for a laugh.

[Twosugars]

See the dates on those, then lets have a little peak at what Boris was up to in 2008

https://www.standard.co.uk/news/mayor/boris-says-sorry-over-blacks-have-lower-iqs-article-in-the-spectator-6630340.html



Still, I fear what will happen if I have to live under a Corbyn government.

IFGKWK6rmyc

Jesus wept :facepalm:

[Cherie]

The only good thing about this election is that it gives us a breather from Brexit newswise

shower of useless numpties, the lot of them

[Beso]

The only good thing about this election is that it gives us a breather from Brexit newswise

shower of useless numpties, the lot of them

:joker:


If only the country would unite and refuse to vote...That's the only way to show these creepy ****ers.

[MTVN]

I'd say you've contradicted yourself here, initially you state there is rarely direct quotes that represent an antisemetismic view, and then you speak of classic tropes of the Jewish having too much money and power.

What is wrong with talking... Is diplomacy a dying art in favor of shoot someone in the back and ask questions later?
I WANT a leader of a free world to speak to all people's, acknowledge all grieviences and respect all people equally. To negotiate peace and not engage in a wholly reactionary manner.

As said the voices of Jewish Labour campaigners who support corbyn as well as respected Jewish academics who speak out regularly in his defence are being ignored and sidelined, to me THAT smacks of antisemitism. Why are they being marginalised due to not adhering to the anti Corbyn rally cry?

Yes but those classic tropes are coded in different language is my point. Also Jezza doesn't speak to all peoples - he's only ever been interested in associating with one side

[MTVN]

I wasn't romanticising the palestinians; I was just highlighting the conditions they are forced to endure, and showing that the other side of the discussion is or should actually be about freedom and rights, because they are an indisputably occupied country. I'd rather everyone be able to reach an agreement through dialogue, but I can't honestly say how the people of this country would react if, say, Germany invaded and occupied us tomorrow.

I'm not romanticising my compatriots by saying we'd be well within our rights to form a militia to fight against them, but to the Germans we'd also be terrorists. Those are the distinctions between an occupier and the occupied.

England is one of the countries that should be able to have an honest discussion about such issues because of our past of just carving up and redrawing maps has contributed to so many deaths/wars over the years, that we still see to this day.

There are no peoples that are inherently "better or worse" than another set of people, yet the distinction with this whole discussion seems to rest on which country currently holds all the power.

https://www.jewishvoiceforlabour.org.uk/article/fifty-times-jeremy-corbyn-stood-with-jewish-people/

It reads:

Corbyn organised the Apr. 1977 defence of Jewish populated Wood Green from a Neo-Nazi march
EDM3933 7 Nov. 1990: Corbyn signs motion condemning the rise of antisemitism
EDM634, 11 Apr. 2000: Jeremy Corbyn signs motion condemning David Irving for being a Holocaust Denier
EDM1124, 6 Nov. 2000: Jeremy Corbyn praised the ‘British Schindler’, Bill Barazetti, for his WW2 kindertransport
EDM742, 28 Jan. 2002: Jeremy Corbyn signs motion praising football clubs for commemorating Holocaust Day
EDM1233 30 Apr. 2002: Corbyn was a primary sponsor on a motion condemning antisemitism
11 May 2002: Jeremy led a clean up of Finsbury Park Synagogue after an anti-Semitic attack
EDM1691, 23 July 2002: Corbyn condemned attacks on a synagogue in Swansea
EDM123 26 Nov. 2003: Corbyn officially condemns attacks on 2 Istanbul synagogues
EDM298, 16 Dec. 2003: Jeremy Corbyn signs motion commemorating International Holocaust Day
2004: Jeremy condemned news that anti-Semitic hate crimes had risen for yet another year
EDM461, 21 Jan. 2004: Jeremy Corbyn condemned the French government’s moves to ban the Jewish Kippa in French Schools
EDM717, 26 Feb. 2004: Jeremy signed a motion praising Simon Wiesenthal for bringing Nazi perpetrators of the Holocaust to justice
EDM1613, 8 Sept. 2004: Corbyn co-sponsored a bill expressing fears for the future of the United Synagogue Pension Scheme
EDM1699, 11 Oct. 2004: Jeremy Corbyn condemned arbitrary attacks on civilians in Israel and Palestine
EDM482, 12 Jan. 2005: Jeremy Corbyn signs a motion commemorating International Holocaust Day
EDM343, 16 June 2005: Jeremy condemned the desecration of a Jewish cemetery in east London
EDM1343, 11 Jan. 2006: Jeremy Corbyn signs a motion commemorating International Holocaust Day
EDM1774, 8 Mar. 2006: Jeremy Corbyn led condemnations of an Iranian Magazine soliciting cartoons about the Holocaust
EDM1267, 16 Apr. 2006: Jeremy Corbyn condemned Bryan Ferry for anti-Semitic remarks
EDM2414, 26 June 2006: Jeremy Corbyn praised British war veterans for their efforts to combat the Holocaust
EDM2705, 10 Oct. 2006: Jeremy signed a motion marking the 70th anniversary of Cable Street
EDM271, 14 Nov. 2007: Jeremy co-sponsored a motion lamenting the poverty and social exclusion East London Jews suffered
EDM153, 12 May 2008: Corbyn praised the efforts of the Jews in the Warsaw Ghetto during the uprising of 1944
EDM2350, 27 Oct 2008: Jeremy Corbyn signs a motion marking the 70th anniversary of the horrors of the holocaust
EDM173, 8 Dec. 2008: Jeremy condemned the Press Complaints Commission for refusing to sanction The Times for antisemitism
EDM461, 14 Jan. 2009: Jeremy Corbyn condemned a wave of recent anti-Semitic incidents targeted
EDM605, 27 Jan. 2009: Corbyn signed John Mann’s motion condemning antisemitism on university campuses
EDM917 26 Feb. 2009: Jeremy signs a motion condemning antisemitism on the internet
EDM1175 24 Mar. 2009: Corbyn signs a motion praising the heroism of British Jews during Holocaust
EDM337, 2 Dec. 2009: Jeremy Condemned Iran’s treatment of Jewish minorities in Iran
EDM850 9 Feb. 2010: Jeremy joins in calls for Facebook to do more to fight antisemitism
EDM891: 22 Feb 2010: Corbyn co-sponsors a motion calling for Yemen’s Jews to be given refugee status to the UK
EDM908 27 Oct. 2010: Corbyn praises work of late Israeli PM in his pursuit of a 2 state solution
EDM1360, 27 Jan. 2011: Corbyn co-sponsored a motion praising the ‘never again for anyone initiative’
EDM1527, 3 Mar. 2011: Corbyn backed Ian Paisley’s motion condemning the anti-Semitic remarks of Dior’s lead fashion designer
EDM2870, 14 Mar. 2012: Jeremy Corbyn condemned the sale of Nazi memorabilia at an auction in Bristol
EDM2866, 14 Mar 2012: Jeremy Corbyn co-sponsored a bill condemning the rise of antisemitism in Lithuania
EDM2899, 20 Mar. 2012, Jeremy Corbyn condemned a terrorist attack on a Jewish school in Toulouse
EDM168, 12 June 2012, Jeremy co-sponsored a motion condemning anti-Semitic attacks during EURO 2012 in Poland
EDM 195 13 June 2012: Jeremy attacks BBC for cutting Jewish programmes from Its schedule
EDM 1133 1 Mar 2013: Corbyn joins a chorus of calls condemning antisemitism In sport
1 Oct. 2013: Corbyn was one of the few MPs who defended Ralph Miliband from Daily Mail antisemitism
EDM 932 9 Jan 2014: Jeremy praises Holocaust Memorial’s work on antisemitism education
EDM 165 22 June 2015: Jeremy condemns a Neo-Nazi rally planned for a Jewish area of London
Sat 4 July 2015: Jeremy co-planned a counter-fascist demo in defence of Jewish residents at Golders Green. The march was re-routed
18 Nov. 2015, Corbyn used one of his first PMQs to challenge Cameron to do more on antisemiUsm
9 Oct 2016: Corbyn, close to tears, leads commemoration of the Battle of Cable Street
3 Dec. 2016: Corbyn visits Terezin Concentration Camp to commemorate Holocaust victims
In 2017-19 Jeremy introduced 20 new measures to combat antisemitism in the Labour Party
Corbyn has already received extensive support from Orthodox Jewish leaders. Thirty-four leading rabbis signed a letter praising Labour’s “respected leader” and describing attacks on him as “irresponsible”. The letter was attacked as a fake by Corbyn’s critics, who were later forced to withdraw the claim when evidence was revealed by the SKWAWKBOX that they were aware of its authenticity.

A letter by Jewish citizens published by the Sunday Times was similarly attacked.



Pretty clear that if you're always standing up for the oppressed, eventually you'll make enemies on all sides.

Fair enough but fwiw I'm pretty sceptical of JVL and that list and I don't think it would go very far in assuaging the concerns of many British Jews

[Twosugars]

Yes but those classic tropes are coded in different language is my point. Also Jezza doesn't speak to all peoples - he's only ever been interested in associating with one side
Could you elaborate?
You mean he supports Palestinians not israeli occupation?

[The Slim Reaper]

1192512875832729600

[Kizzy]

Yes but those classic tropes are coded in different language is my point. Also Jezza doesn't speak to all peoples - he's only ever been interested in associating with one side

That's just not true it's a widely known antisemitic trope that the Jewish control the banks those types of comments are not coded in any way :/
I'm sorry I don't agree that he only talks to one side that's nonsense what would be the point of that? Objecting to an MP that is able to perform as a facilitator or mediator is for me doing his job well.
Otherwise what's the solution?.. these groups carry on indefinately with no compromise, just mindless violence and heavy handed recourse.

[MTVN]

Could you elaborate?
You mean he supports Palestinians not israeli occupation?

If you 'talk to all sides' then you surely should engage with the Israeli side as well but he doesn't. Just as he always associated with hardline Republicans in Ireland but wouldn't be seen dead with Unionists

That's just not true it's a widely known antisemitic trope that the Jewish control the banks those types of comments are not coded in any way :/
I'm sorry I don't agree that he only talks to one side that's nonsense what would be the point of that? Objecting to an MP that is able to perform as a facilitator or mediator is for me doing his job well.
Otherwise what's the solution?.. these groups carry on indefinately with no compromise, just mindless violence and heavy handed recourse.

You missed my point - I was saying that no one on the left actually says that but they instead talk about the 'Israel/Jewish lobby' or 'Zionist influence' to push that well known trope in a way that doesn't sound anti-Semitic

The less subtle ones do just flat out rant about the Rothschilds tbf which is slightly less coded

Or, y'know, put up murals like this - which Corbyn was outraged was removed

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/3/39/Mear_One_-_Freedom_for_Humanity_%28mural%29.jpg

[Twosugars]

If you 'talk to all sides' then you surely should engage with the Israeli side as well but he doesn't. Just as he always associated with hardline Republicans in Ireland but wouldn't be seen dead with unionists.

He seems to be in touch with jewish labour members.

How do you know he never talks to Israelis?
Any proof of that or you just assume?

[Oliver_W]

It's easy to focus on whispers about an enemy then confronting an issue in your backyard. There was a quote that Reaper posted recently from a Rabbi which basically said that focusing on the left allows far right extremism, that can and has affected jews, to thrive.

If there is actual evidence of Corbyn being anti-semitic then crucify him for it but at the moment, it just seems like it's the machine in action, the same machine that convinced people to vote against their own interests, that's slowly making out that the NHS is a failing industry in order to sow seeds for privatisation etc.

The fact that 87% consider him an anti-semite is proof of the value of marketing. Are we then to dismiss Jews that actually support Corbyn and also the Jews that are running in the election for the labour party? Are they not real Jews?

Has anyone got actual quotes from Corbyn that prove him to be anti semitic, or is it just whispers? I could find multiple quotes from Johnson that reveal his actual racism. I agree wholeheartedly that Corbyn didn't deal with the issues in the labour party particularly well, but they are at least addressing them, which is more than you can say for the party leading in the polls, that those same 87% will have no trouble voting for.

No one is blameless, but it's intellectually dishonest to pretend that only labour have their issues.

The accusations all come from within the Labour party, not the right wing press or the Tories :joker:

[Kizzy]

If you 'talk to all sides' then you surely should engage with the Israeli side as well but he doesn't. Just as he always associated with hardline Republicans in Ireland but wouldn't be seen dead with Unionists



You missed my point - I was saying that no one on the left actually says that but they instead talk about the 'Israel/Jewish lobby' or 'Zionist influence' to push that well known trope in a way that doesn't sound anti-Semitic

The less subtle ones do just flat out rant about the Rothschilds tbf which is slightly less coded

Or, y'know, put up murals like this - which Corbyn was outraged was removed

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/3/39/Mear_One_-_Freedom_for_Humanity_%28mural%29.jpg
The Israel/Jewish lobby comment was covered very well by 2s, and as has been well documented by Jewish academics the reason discussions on Israel don't sound antisemitic is because they're not.
Unless you have evidence to the contrary? That mural was commissioned, signed off and worked on for weeks then removed, corbyn explained he had only seen a Facebook pic of the mural. That was unfortunate and a gaffe for which he apologised...

[Twosugars]

A former Labour MP has confirmed he will run as an independent in the general election after the party withdrew its support for him after he backed protesters in an LGBT teaching row.
The Guardian

[Oliver_W]

A former Labour MP has confirmed he will run as an independent in the general election after the party withdrew its support for him after he backed protesters in an LGBT teaching row.
The Guardian

He backed the protestors? **** him.

[arista]

https://storify.com/services/proxy/2/urkNEZ2vCXY87557kyybtw/https/media.fyre.co/0JyHcopqSHGfHIQ26FFb_0811%20Mail.JPG

[Cherie]

https://storify.com/services/proxy/2/urkNEZ2vCXY87557kyybtw/https/media.fyre.co/0JyHcopqSHGfHIQ26FFb_0811%20Mail.JPG

that's got to be a first in a GE?

[bots]

if Boris ends up with a landslide we are all ****ed

[The Slim Reaper]

1192407675952345095

[The Slim Reaper]

1192713815466676224

A man that doesn't understand his own deal. Let's imagine this was a speech by corbyn, how do you think the press would react to this absolute nonsense?

[arista]

that's got to be a first in a GE?


Yes could well be.

[Kazanne]

that's got to be a first in a GE?

Best thing to happen for Labour is to get rid of Corbyn,he has made them unelectable by many,but he may just scrape through. It comes to something when members of your own party tell people to vote for the opposition,If he cared about the country and the party he'de step down.

[Liam-]

If former Labour members are actively campaigning for Tory votes, then sorry, but they were never Labour minded, Ian Austin being the perfect example, he’s had several racism issues himself while he was a Labour member, he was an embarrassment to the party and people are acting like it’s a shock that he’s now backing the Tories? Nah, he seems right at home, plus, doesn’t he work for them now anyway? Hardly surprising

[Kazanne]

1192713815466676224

A man that doesn't understand his own deal. Let's imagine this was a speech by corbyn, how do you think the press would react to this absolute nonsense?

I get all this , but really you are going by what people say who have the similar views as you ,and will never talk about him favourably , the same vise versa that is why I don't take much notice of tweets etc, they all put their own interpretations on things, there is so much negativity about any party if you search for it, not all of it accurate, so for me its all about likability,intent and body language and of course live footage.

[The Slim Reaper]

I get all this , but really you are going by what people say who have the similar views as you ,and will never talk about him favourably , the same vise versa that is why I don't take much notice of tweets etc, they all put their own interpretations on things, there is so much negativity about any party if you search for it, not all of it accurate, so for me its all about likability,intent and body language and of course live footage.

He's speaking for himself, Kaz. If you watch this and think he's likable with good body language, then it's good that he's met your voting requirements. What he's saying is not true, but he has good intent, I guess? :shrug:

[Kazanne]

He's speaking for himself, Kaz. If you watch this and think he's likable with good body language, then it's good that he's met your voting requirements. What he's saying is not true, but he has good intent, I guess? :shrug:

I will watch it, I admit I skipped it as I thought it was just another tweeter bashing him, I was just really talking about all the tweets etc out there ,that people think will persuade others to their way of thinking , tbh the main thing that puts me right off Labour is an intense dislike for Corbyn.

[The Slim Reaper]

I will watch it, I admit I skipped it as I thought it was just another tweeter bashing him, I was just really talking about all the tweets etc out there ,that people think will persuade others to their way of thinking , tbh the main thing that puts me right off Labour is an intense dislike for Corbyn.

We all have our reasons for liking/disliking anyone and everyone - and we also have our own irrational likes and dislikes for certain people. For me it's a snooker player called Shaun Murphy.

http://wikinetworth.com/uploads/shaun-murphy.jpg

I know hardly anything about him and I've never met him. I'm not really an aggressive person but there's just something about his smug fcuking face that makes me want to punch it. So I get it. Fortunately for me, taking an irrational dislike to this dude won't have any negative repercussions on the lives of the people I love.

[Cherie]

1192713815466676224

A man that doesn't understand his own deal. Let's imagine this was a speech by corbyn, how do you think the press would react to this absolute nonsense?

:joker: He has basically said that free movement and the single market is a great deal.....but only for NI it seems

[arista]

For Slim

1192760682154020864

[The Slim Reaper]

For Slim

1192760682154020864

You believe a man that has a one way relationship with the truth?

[arista]

How Nice Liz
a Fresh bakery

1192765878737215489

[The Slim Reaper]

Trump has said "everything will be on the table" if we want a deal. At that point we'll be the only major country without a trade deal with it's nearest trading partners. He'll be absolutely desperate to present something to the people.

[arista]

You believe a man that has a one way relationship with the truth?

He has stated it Publicly
what more can you have?

[arista]

Trump has said "everything will be on the table" if we want a deal. At that point we'll be the only major country without a trade deal with it's nearest trading partners. He'll be absolutely desperate to present something to the people.



No Slim
he has back tracked from that OLD statement..................
its not on any table NOW


Get Up to Date!

[The Slim Reaper]

He has stated it Publicly
what more can you have?

All of his other lies have been stated publicly. He lied to the queen recently, he lied about rather dying in a ditch recently, he lied about refusing to ask for an extension recently, he's lying to today in Scotland about Corbyn, he lied in that clip I posted a couple of posts above. All in public, all brazen, all ignored by folks like your good self.

[Twosugars]

He has stated it Publicly
what more can you have?

And you believe him why?

He also said we'd leave on 31 of October do or die

[The Slim Reaper]

No Slim
he has back tracked from that OLD statement..................
its not on any table NOW


Get Up to Date!

Come off it Arista, trump is killing his own economy to fight unnecessary trade wars, and you think he's going to give us what we want? You're not stupid.

[arista]

And you believe him why?

He also said we'd leave on 31 of October do or die


Sure
but everyone knows
the other sides of Parliament is stopping him

[arista]

Come off it Arista, trump is killing his own economy to fight unnecessary trade wars, and you think he's going to give us what we want? You're not stupid.



That's another Thread
China is trying to make a deal with him.

Will he be in Power?
when the UK leaves?

[The Slim Reaper]

Sure
but everyone knows
the other sides of Parliament is stopping him from hurting the country because only the most cultish of brexiteers believe a no-deal brexit will be good for anyone apart from hedge funds

Fixed.

[The Slim Reaper]

That's another Thread
China is trying to make a deal with him.

Will he be in Power?
when the UK leaves?

Your side better hope he is, because Pelosi has already said that anything that harms Ireland would prevent us from getting a trade deal with them.

[Kazanne]

We all have our reasons for liking/disliking anyone and everyone - and we also have our own irrational likes and dislikes for certain people. For me it's a snooker player called Shaun Murphy.

http://wikinetworth.com/uploads/shaun-murphy.jpg

I know hardly anything about him and I've never met him. I'm not really an aggressive person but there's just something about his smug fcuking face that makes me want to punch it. So I get it. Fortunately for me, taking an irrational dislike to this dude won't have any negative repercussions on the lives of the people I love.

:joker::joker:

[The Slim Reaper]

1192748185783062528

[arista]

1192748185783062528


Higher or Lower?


I will answer that Slim
"Lower"

[Twosugars]

A Labour parliamentary candidate has withdrawn from standing in the general election following accusations that he used the insulting term “Shylock” at a meeting where a Jewish councillor was present.

Gideon Bull, a councillor from the London borough of Haringey, was supposed to be the party’s parliamentary candidate in the Essex seaside town of Clacton in December.

He has withdrawn from standing for the seat after referring to the villainous Shakespearean Jewish moneylender at a meeting in July that included a Jewish Labour councillor. He denies any intention to insult but has apologised for making the remark.
The Guardian

[Tom4784]

A Labour parliamentary candidate has withdrawn from standing in the general election following accusations that he used the insulting term “Shylock” at a meeting where a Jewish councillor was present.

Gideon Bull, a councillor from the London borough of Haringey, was supposed to be the party’s parliamentary candidate in the Essex seaside town of Clacton in December.

He has withdrawn from standing for the seat after referring to the villainous Shakespearean Jewish moneylender at a meeting in July that included a Jewish Labour councillor. He denies any intention to insult but has apologised for making the remark.
The Guardian

Good, excise the rot from the labour party.

[Cherie]

Good, excise the rot from the labour party.

He withdrew himself after the incident was reported rather than was excised it seems

[arista]

https://e3.365dm.com/19/11/768x432/skynews-papers-paper-review_4829655.jpg?bypass-service-worker&20191107232056

[bots]

A video posted this week on Twitter and Facebook by the Conservative Party contains a misleading edit of a television interview with a senior Labour Party figure. The video had been altered to show the official failing to answer a question about Brexit, when, in fact, he responded quickly.

The chairman of the Conservative Party called the doctored video lighthearted satire, but it’s part of a serious problem confronting British voters, according to Will Moy, chief executive at Full Fact, an independent, London-based fact-checking organization.

“The biggest risk to people in the U.K. right now is being lied to by their own politicians,” said Moy, whose organization works with Facebook and others as a third-party fact checker, as does The Associated Press. He said laws written decades ago to cover political advertising for print, radio and television can’t be applied to the reach and speed of the internet.

https://apnews.com/03a97d44af714d3dba36b64cd5b5cc15

[arista]

1192822724504231937

Yes Geoff
Cock Womble

[arista]

A video posted this week on Twitter and Facebook by the Conservative Party contains a misleading edit of a television interview with a senior Labour Party figure. The video had been altered to show the official failing to answer a question about Brexit, when, in fact, he responded quickly.

The chairman of the Conservative Party called the doctored video lighthearted satire, but it’s part of a serious problem confronting British voters, according to Will Moy, chief executive at Full Fact, an independent, London-based fact-checking organization.

“The biggest risk to people in the U.K. right now is being lied to by their own politicians,” said Moy, whose organization works with Facebook and others as a third-party fact checker, as does The Associated Press. He said laws written decades ago to cover political advertising for print, radio and television can’t be applied to the reach and speed of the internet.

https://apnews.com/03a97d44af714d3dba36b64cd5b5cc15


Yes Slim will like this
backing his Views...............


It's teething trouble
Yes Early Satire Video
has not worked well.

[The Slim Reaper]

1192857884796870656

[Twosugars]

Labour has attacked the Conservative party over Russia and says it has taken nearly half a million pounds so far this year from just three wealthy individuals with close ties to Moscow.
Details here https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2019/nov/08/tories-have-ongoing-relationship-with-russian-money-says-labour

[arista]

1192857884796870656


Speculation Spinner Slim.


The Referendum was a Revolution

[Twosugars]

Russian revolution

[arista]

Russian revolution


Putin has Stopped any of that

[arista]

1192831365374521345

Yes Nick sort
that Cocky SNP Ponce out

[Twosugars]

Why would any government pursue a policy that damages the country?
Brexit

[Twosugars]

The number of NHS patients having surgery in private hospitals has nearly trebled since 2010, sparking accusations that for-profit companies are benefitting from an “enfeebled” health system under the Conservatives.

NHS figures obtained by the Guardian show that it paid for 214,967 people in England to have an operation in a private hospital in 2009-10, Labour’s last year in power. The figure soared to 613,833 last year, a 185% rise in nine years.

The figures come as NHS trusts are increasingly forced to send patients to for private surgery because they are too busy and understaffed to do the operations themselves. The sharp rise in outsourcing has coincided with the waiting-list for non-urgent operations ballooning to 4.6m, the highest figure since records began in 2007.

The privatisation of healthcare has emerged as a key issue in the general election campaign. Labour allege that Boris Johnson will sell large parts of the NHS to private US health firms as part of a post-Brexit trade deal with Washington. The party also says the NHS’s annual drugs bill could soar from £18bn to £45bn if US pharmaceutical firms are given freer access to the British market.
The Guardian

[arista]

"Labour allege"


Of course they do.


You need to post FACTS

[arista]

Why would any government pursue a policy that damages the country?
Brexit


Because it was Voted in.

[Twosugars]

Because it was Voted in.

By an ADVISORY referendum.

[arista]

By an ADVISORY referendum.


Yes

[smudgie]

So, if the NHS didn’t outsource operations to the private sector I would have lost my sight.
Bring it on I say.

[Twosugars]

The point is they should not need to outsource but do it inhouse.

[user104658]

So, if the NHS didn’t outsource operations to the private sector I would have lost my sight.
Bring it on I say.

They outsource to private sector because the resources of the public NHS have been run into the ground. If the NHS was properly funded there would be no need to outsource.

[smudgie]

They outsource to private sector because the resources of the public NHS have been run into the ground. If the NHS was properly funded there would be no need to outsource.

Hopefully they can stop the vicious circle. Find more staff and get more money pumped in.
But until they do then there is a need for the outsourcing.
Some ops and treatment just can’t wait.

[arista]

https://pbs.twimg.com/card_img/1192827610058895361/yiMKn1_H?format=png&name=small

[arista]

https://storify.com/services/proxy/2/Fk4HLWUKt_YHfgzGYpx0uA/https/media.fyre.co/Xllm94VUS9aJy7ymbGgC_express.png

[arista]

https://storify.com/services/proxy/2/YutupSa7SIeoo2XmAkwZfg/https/media.fyre.co/UBKk8cimQQebGpTz5XBL_tele.png

[bots]

They outsource to private sector because the resources of the public NHS have been run into the ground. If the NHS was properly funded there would be no need to outsource.

outsourcing is not the same as privatisation though. With privatisation, one doesnt get treatment unless one pays the health insurance plan. With outsourcing, its managed under the NHS with no additional cost to the patient. There is nothing inherently wrong with outsourcing

[Ammi]

...there is a huge amount of information regarding outsourcing within the NHS...and the vulnerabilities it creates../...many, many sites on the topic...but I’ll just quote this one little bit...

The now liquidated Carillion holds several contracts with the NHS, mostly in catering, car-parking and estates. Following the company’s collapse, the precarious nature of outsourcing within our health service has been painfully exposed. Unlike publicly owned companies which do not serve to make profit, the risk-taking nature of big-business contractors like Carillion leaves them vulnerable to collapse. As a direct result, big hospital building projects such as the Midland Metropolitan Hospital in Birmingham and the Royal Liverpool University Hospital have been delayed. Unsurprisingly, the public, NHS staff and politicians have begun to wonder how many more weaknesses lie just beneath the surface.

https://www.politicshome.com/news/uk/health-and-care/nhs/opinion/dods-monitoring/92889/future-nhs-outsourcing

[arista]

LibDems are saying a baby from 9months
can get Child Care.

But of course LibDems can not take power
so she the leader can say anything..............................

[arista]

1193105461358280704
Taken from today's Ridge 9AM new Saturday show

Yes Layla YOU are totally Deluded

[Oliver_W]

1193105461358280704
Taken from today's Ridge 9AM new Saturday show

Yes Layla YOU are totally Deluded

Honestly I think it's possible but unlikely. Both major parties have problems with their leadership, and while I don't think it will happen, and I wouldn't be surprised if she did become PM.

[bots]

While its theoretically possible for the lib dems to be in government, the odds or completely stacked against them. If they became the opposition it would be a massive step up.

The best we can hope for now is that the tories don't get a massive majority. If they get a big majority, the country is stuffed

[Oliver_W]

While its theoretically possible for the lib dems to be in government, the odds or completely stacked against them. If they became the opposition it would be a massive step up.

The best we can hope for now is that the tories don't get a massive majority. If they get a big majority, the country is stuffed

I quite like the current iteration of the Lib Dems, but I'd like them more as an Opposition party against the Tories with a slight majority.

[arista]

https://pbs.twimg.com/card_img/1192458871069192193/P-z4za01?format=jpg&name=small


The LibDems can NOT
Delete Brexit


And
20 MP's is not enough to expand to 300.

[arista]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EI7gOzPXUAAfeGW?format=jpg&name=small

[Cherie]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EI7gOzPXUAAfeGW?format=jpg&name=small

:thumbs:

[Twosugars]

A Labour MP has denied altering the lyrics of the Beatles song Hey Jude to “Hey Jews” while a fellow politician is accused of repeatedly using the word “****” during a coach journey last year.

Daniel Carden, who as the shadow international development secretary, is accused by BuzzFeed of singing an adapted version of the song while on a trip from the Cheltenham festival to London.

Conor McGinn, a former Labour whip who is standing for re-election as MP for St Helens North, is reported by the website to have repeatedly called another colleague a “****” during the same journey on 15 March 2018
The Guardian

[Twosugars]

Sayeeda Warsi has denounced her Conservative party colleague Matt Hancock for “whitesplaining” Islamophobia to her after he suggested “there are others who take a more balanced approach” to the issue.

Lady Warsi responded furiously to Hancock, the health secretary, after his comments on BBC Radio 4’s Today programme while addressing the Conservative party’s decision not to hold an inquiry into Islamophobia.
The Guardian

[The Slim Reaper]

1193093095233138688

[arista]

1193179435203203080

[Twosugars]

For the cons it would be more than a dozen right?

[arista]

https://e3.365dm.com/19/11/768x432/skynews-newspaper-paper_4831823.jpg?bypass-service-worker&20191109220505

[arista]

https://storify.com/services/proxy/2/u_EOrMYvuv7OJQsqRfW_8Q/https/media.fyre.co/fnrSxWWCSPGmcmeeZtna_TheSundayTelegraph.JPG

[arista]

https://storify.com/services/proxy/2/U15My83gY9uLtYioNEDL0g/https/media.fyre.co/uTYUAObORSKRno9W1OQU_TheIndependent.JPG

[Oliver_W]

https://storify.com/services/proxy/2/U15My83gY9uLtYioNEDL0g/https/media.fyre.co/uTYUAObORSKRno9W1OQU_TheIndependent.JPG

:joker: :joker: Those featured articles :joker: :joker:
"Dress code sexism", like how a lot of workplaces require men to wear a shirt and tie even in hot weather, while women can dress for the weather? We do remember LGBT war heroes, along with the other war heroes.

[arista]

:joker: :joker: Those featured articles :joker: :joker:
"Dress code sexism", like how a lot of workplaces require men to wear a shirt and tie even in hot weather, while women can dress for the weather? We do remember LGBT war heroes, along with the other war heroes.



Yes maybe that should have been Half the Front page
with a Example Photo.


Meanwhile Corbyn Mentioned on the Doorstep
getting "He is too far left" on a SkyNewsHD
reporter following a struggling Labour Labour Lady.

[arista]

1192521415687364609

[arista]

1192916107075698688


His Wife is taking over

[Ammi]

The leaders of three main political parties will take a break from the election campaign trail as they join members of the Royal Family at the Cenotaph.

Boris Johnson said he will be "proud" to lay his first wreath at the war memorial as prime minister, and vowed to continue to "champion those who serve today with such bravery in our military".

He said: "On Remembrance Sunday this year I will be thinking of the men and women who, over the centuries, have given so much to protect our country.

"I will especially remember the men and women who gave the ultimate sacrifice in war, so that today we can live in peace."



Labour leader Jeremy Corbyn said: "We remember the many brave people from Britain and all across the world who put their lives on the line, making huge sacrifices in two world wars which cost the lives of millions, and in all the other conflicts since."


He added: "For so many of our armed forces, our veterans and their families who have given and still give so much to us, they are not getting the support they deserve."



Liberal Democrat leader Jo Swinson, who will be attending the service for the first time as Lib Dem leader, said: "Today we remember all those who gave their lives so that we can live in freedom.

"We also give our heartfelt thanks to those members of our armed forces, to veterans and their families, for all they do and the sacrifices they make to keep us safe."

[Ammi]

https://e3.365dm.com/19/11/2048x1152/skynews-ron-freer_4831925.jpg?bypass-service-worker&20191110014525

..104yr old Ron Freer is the oldest marcher at the Cenotaph today...he is ‘hugely honoured to tribute those who fell’....:lovedup:..

[arista]

1193220382846836737

[bots]

i will say it again, we should not have people above the normal retirement age serving in our parliament, whatever party they represent.

[arista]

i will say it again, we should not have people above the normal retirement age serving in our parliament, whatever party they represent.



Yes if only

[arista]

1193203555173380098

Adult Language Warning

Love his Attack on the LibDem Female leader

[arista]

1192498987166846976


Life for Some
in Scotland......................

[Kizzy]

i will say it again, we should not have people above the normal retirement age serving in our parliament, whatever party they represent.

Retirement age is a suggestion not a demand, to restrict competent people from employment would be ageist and is as wrong as sexism if used as a tool to prevent access to jobs.

[bots]

if you look at both the UK and the USA,many of the people up for the important jobs are south of 70 and they are just not mentally agile. It shows up in their debates and interviews all the time. These aren't the people we should have running our countries, and I say that as someone who is no spring chicken himself.

[Ammi]

...didn’t Winson Churchill become PM when he was retirement age...(..to name but one..)...behave yourself, bots...:laugh:..


...it’s surely about the PM who would be best for the country, not what age they are...

[Kizzy]

if you look at both the UK and the USA,many of the people up for the important jobs are south of 70 and they are just not mentally agile. It shows up in their debates and interviews all the time. These aren't the people we should have running our countries, and I say that as someone who is no spring chicken himself.

Lumping all older people together like this does nothing to prove your point, during an interview a pause for thought for you proves ineptitude?
I'd say the opposite, I prefer it when theres not an instantaneous trotting out of party lines or slogans that require no thought at all.
Unless you have specific evidence of older politicians becoming confused? If it's happening all the time that shouldn't be too difficult.

[arista]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EJAMjfqW4AAt9sO?format=png&name=small

[Kizzy]

Why is free movement an issue? We need people to come here and work that's well documented, the worry is that people will leave here due to brexit and the NHS and other sectors will struggle as a result... What's the alternative, unfree movement?
Employ people abroad to get around our wage laws and bring them here on temporary visas to work?

Will that impact us more positively?... not enough people are really thinking past the 'free movement' fear of johnny foreigner scaremongering we have in every election.

[arista]

Yes Professionals will come to work
in the New UK,
under proper controls.

[Kizzy]

Yes Professionals will come to work
in the New UK,
under proper controls.

On work visas yes, so how will that impact on secure employment in the UK. And what of unskilled workers?

[user104658]

i will say it again, we should not have people above the normal retirement age serving in our parliament, whatever party they represent.

Don't worry Bots, the Tories want to raise retirement age to 75 so it's all good.

[Ammi]

Don't worry Bots, the Tories want to raise retirement age to 75 so it's all good.

...never a problem...always a solution, baby...:laugh:...

[Oliver_W]

On work visas yes, so how will that impact on secure employment in the UK. And what of unskilled workers?

If they don't have skills, we don't need them to work, as someone else can do it.

[user104658]

If they don't have skills, we don't need them to work, as someone else can do it.

This attitude is devastating to productivity though. I think the confusion comes from the term "unskilled", which in fact more accurately means "without formal qualifications". You can't replace an experienced migrant worker with an unmotivated, slack-jawed local and expect them to work to the same standard. Yes there are plenty of unemployed people in the UK but the ugly elephant in the room that no one seems willing to address, is that many of them are simply unemployable in MANY "unskilled" roles.

[arista]

On work visas yes, so how will that impact on secure employment in the UK. And what of unskilled workers?


They will have to allow them for the Business
that needs them.

[Twosugars]

Arista this electioneering on the remembrance sunday is disgraceful. You could knock it off for one day

[Twosugars]

Besides cons dropped quietly their 100 thousand annual limit on immigration:laugh:
So much for brexit meaning lower immigration.
One big con

[Kizzy]

If they don't have skills, we don't need them to work, as someone else can do it.

Can you explain why farmers were complaining about the lack off workers to pick fruit?

[bots]

A Conservative election candidate has stepped down over historic social media posts about a Labour MP and Colonel Gaddafi.

Antony Calvert, who was standing to be MP for Wakefield, also made comments about food poverty, as reported by the Sunday Times.

The 41-year-old said the Facebook posts were more than 10 years old.

Mr Calvert said his comments were "certainly not intended to cause any offence".

In one post, Mr Calvert is said to have written that if former Libyan dictator Gaddaffi wanted to walk the streets unrecognised "he should surely have fled to Bradford".

He is also accused of criticising the appearance of Mary Creagh - who has been Wakefield's MP since 2005.

In a statement, Mr Calvert said: "Over the last 24 hours a number of very historic posts from my personal Facebook timeline have featured in the news media.

"While I would prefer to stand and fight the assertions, these comments represent neither my views nor those of the Conservative Party."

Mr Calvert's decision to stand down came days after Tory candidate Nick Conrad stood down for historic comments in which he said women should "keep their knickers on" in a conversation about rape.

And Labour candidate Gideon Bull resigned in Clacton, Essex, after it emerged he had used the word "Shylock" during a private meeting.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/election-2019-50365354

------

I wonder how many others are frantically deleting social media posts

[Kizzy]

Lots... I'm glad that there is a fire against fire approach to this campaign, the mud slinging is in full swing. The only worry is it keeps the real mud off the front pages, Russian influence in the last election, giving public funds to busty blondes and whatever else has been shelved until after the election.

[Liam-]

1193306500191653889

Despicable, but completely predictable

[arista]

"Despicable, but completely predictable"


Of Course its the General Election
that's has Everything on hold.
I mean it's just not on
Everything is now bloody "Oven Ready"

[arista]

Arista this electioneering on the remembrance sunday is disgraceful. You could knock it off for one day


Bollocks
The General Election is on..............................
24/7 Every Day

[arista]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EJAEf_vXUAAKtmK?format=jpg&name=small

[arista]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EI_38rvWoAAo9bg?format=jpg&name=small

Yes the Labour Party Claim
no more living on street..................................

[The Slim Reaper]

1193461874890878976

[Twosugars]

Your cons should be ashamed of themselves Arista, if they were capable of human emotions

[arista]

1193459421038497792

Yes Pippa of the Daily Mirror
there is no time for your Anti Brexit Chart.


Its a General Election
Thursday 12th December

[arista]

Your cons should be ashamed of themselves Arista, if they were capable of human emotions


Yes and Labour Candidates
attacking Jews.

[arista]

1193461874890878976


Yes Sophie Lay into them.

[The Slim Reaper]

1193459421038497792

Yes Pippa of the Daily Mirror
there is no time for your Anti Brexit Chart.


Its a General Election
Thursday 12th December

The conservatives are relying on it being a brexit election though. Can't have your cake and eat it.

[The Slim Reaper]

Yes and Labour Candidates
attacking Jews.

No they aren't. Don't be ridiculous. Less than 1% of labour members have been reported for antisemitism. Remind me again how the tories are addressing their islamophobia issues.

[Tom4784]

No they aren't. Don't be ridiculous. Less than 1% of labour members have been reported for antisemitism. Remind me again how the tories are addressing their islamophobia issues.

By screeching about Labour and hoping that the voting public has a short attention span.

[The Slim Reaper]

By screeching about Labour and hoping that the voting public has a short attention span.

If only there was a word that could describe the jewish people being used to whip up a political frenzy based generally on lies and smears.

[user104658]

No they aren't. Don't be ridiculous. Less than 1% of labour members have been reported for antisemitism. Remind me again how the tories are addressing their islamophobia issues.

They don't have to address those issues. It's quite telling in itself really; the Tories are tearing into Labour over anti-semitism because they know the accusations will push voters away from Labour. There is no point at all in negative campaigning against the Tories using their Islamophobia, because Tory voters could not give fewer fuques that the Tories are Islamophobic. In fact, pointing it out would probably win them more votes.

[arista]

1193581624493039616

[bots]

the brexit party will be lucky if they get 1 seat :laugh:

[The Slim Reaper]

1193508640407334918

[Ammi]

1193508640407334918

...that’s what’s really sad though...if Boris can express all of those views, and he has...and he can be the dishonest person that he is...and still have the public not scrutinise him more, but many will vote for his party...?...then that shows a huge lacking in the Labour opposition, surely...

[The Slim Reaper]

...that’s what’s really sad though...if Boris can express all of those views, and he has...and he can be the dishonest person that he is...and still have the public not scrutinise him more, but many will vote for his party...?...then that shows a huge lacking in the Labour opposition, surely...

It shows a huge failure in the media. Take the Sunday times today; on the front page it was conservative estimate of £1 trillion for labours plans. Not independent, but even on stuff that won't be in the manifesto. Page 2 was the article about Johnsons and the tory party links to Russian funding. When you have the media constantly pushing this BS because they are owned by billionaires, then that's how marketing/propaganda works. Keep drilling the same things into peoples minds and you end with up figures like over 70% of sun readers voting for brexit.

[bots]

It shows a huge failure in the media. Take the Sunday times today; on the front page it was conservative estimate of £1 trillion for labours plans. Not independent, but even on stuff that won't be in the manifesto. Page 2 was the article about Johnsons and the tory party links to Russian funding. When you have the media constantly pushing this BS because they are owned by billionaires, then that's how marketing/propaganda works. Keep drilling the same things into peoples minds and you end with up figures like over 70% of sun readers voting for brexit.

i think you do voters a disservice. They are not unaware of the key issues that are important to them and they vote accordingly. The problem is that there are no good options, very similar to the last USA presidential election. That being the case, voters are more likely to either not vote at all or register some sort of ineffective protest vote.

The best outcome would be another hung parliament, lets see what happens

[Ammi]

It shows a huge failure in the media. Take the Sunday times today; on the front page it was conservative estimate of £1 trillion for labours plans. Not independent, but even on stuff that won't be in the manifesto. Page 2 was the article about Johnsons and the tory party links to Russian funding. When you have the media constantly pushing this BS because they are owned by billionaires, then that's how marketing/propaganda works. Keep drilling the same things into peoples minds and you end with up figures like over 70% of sun readers voting for brexit.

...I completely see what you’re saying, Slim...it’s everything that’s ever been mentioned by the Labour Party In any degree whatsoever...and to the media, it’s a plan that’s going to happen and the funding will be flying out of their windows..?..I still though think that this is exactly the type of thing that so doesn’t make sense..that if it is being believed..?...it’s because of a leaning to believe it...

[The Slim Reaper]

i think you do voters a disservice. They are not unaware of the key issues that are important to them and they vote accordingly. The problem is that there are no good options, very similar to the last USA presidential election. That being the case, voters are more likely to either not vote at all or register some sort of ineffective protest vote.

The best outcome would be another hung parliament, lets see what happens

If I do them a disservice, then why is propaganda even a thing? And why are (mainly tories) getting involved with Cambridge Analytica and other data mining companies that allow them to target adds and misinformation to the wrong people. I'm not having your false equivalency; there is a good option. One candidate has dedicated his life to fighting injustice and to work for a better society, this can be shown over decades, and you're equating a decent man who's rolled out loads of great policy aims and goal, with a russian funded liar, who's under 2 investigations, and another candidate that voted for all the worst tory policies inflicted on society.

Anyone can vote for anyone, but to say there isn't a good option is completely false. Corbyn isn't fighting to enrich his friends, and you're intelligent enough to know that BJ has ever only been an opportunist.

[The Slim Reaper]

...I completely see what you’re saying, Slim...it’s everything that’s ever been mentioned by the Labour Party In any degree whatsoever...and to the media, it’s a plan that’s going to happen and the funding will be flying out of their windows..?..I still though think that this is exactly the type of thing that so doesn’t make sense..that if it is being believed..?...it’s because of a leaning to believe it...

The government won't release costings on their own plans or the cost of brexit, yet what they have to say about labour costings is front page news in the times. This isn't some local village paper

[James]

What are the policies that are said to be costly? That way we can make up our own minds.

The Labour party didn't help themselves with some of the proposals that came out of their party conference. Some of the stuff wasn't credible... eg. 2030 net-zero carbon emissions target and scrapping private schooling.

But I don't know if those will be manifesto pledges?

[James]

Sunday Times only has a circulation of 700,000 btw, and you have to pay to read articles online. It's not that widely read.

[arista]

1193798790886629377

[Kazanne]

1193798790886629377

I saw this ,they really do skirt around the questions don't they ? :laugh:

[arista]

1193826273623191554

[arista]

I saw this ,they really do skirt around the questions don't they ? :laugh:

The Big Problem
for Labour
is Corbyn has said Publicly
he will NOT US Nukes.................

[Liam-]

You know the government is bad when people have to celebrate narrowly avoiding a recession :joker:

[arista]

You know the government is bad when people have to celebrate narrowly avoiding a recession :joker:


Sure Liam


1193825143073755137

[The Slim Reaper]

The Big Problem
for Labour
is Corbyn has said Publicly
he will NOT US Nukes.................

So it's now a problem that a potential leader of the country won't use nuclear weapons? Can you not see the madness in this? The whole world has tried to avoid using these weapons since the horror of Japan in 1945. A country using these weapons against another country could easily lead to the humanity being wiped off the planet.

This is just completely ****ing stupid.

[arista]

So it's now a problem that a potential leader of the country won't use nuclear weapons? Can you not see the madness in this? The whole world has tried to avoid using these weapons since the horror of Japan in 1945. A country using these weapons against another country could easily lad to the humanity being wiped off the planet.

This is just completely ****ing stupid.



Yes but as Corbyn has Stated he will not use them
that is Wrong
as the Leader must keep that secret.



If we get Nuked by a Nation
we must fire back
That is normal

[arista]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EJFiD4GXkAEwS8v?format=jpg&name=small

[The Slim Reaper]

Yes but as Corbyn has Stated he will not use them
that is Wrong
as the Leader must keep that secret.



If we get Nuked by a Nation
we must fire back
That is normal

But countries have signed up to pacts specifically not to use these weapons against each other. The premise of the question is absurd to begin with. Generations lived in fear of these weapons actually being used, but now not using them makes someone weak? It just highlights the anti-intellectual cesspit we've crawled down.

Give me a leader that says he/she won't use these weapons, over a tough talking idiot that says he/she will.

[The Slim Reaper]

Sunday Times only has a circulation of 700,000 btw, and you have to pay to read articles online. It's not that widely read.

The Sunday times isn't a major sunday broadsheet?

1193482171362824193

A pattern?

[arista]

But countries have signed up to pacts specifically not to use these weapons against each other. The premise of the question is absurd to begin with. Generations lived in fear of these weapons actually being used, but now not using them makes someone weak? It just highlights the anti-intellectual cesspit we've crawled down.

Give me a leader that says he/she won't use these weapons, over a tough talking idiot that says he/she will.

That means Nothing
like when Hitler Signed the British Peace Paper
for that terrible prime minister Neville Chamberlain,

Leaders can Change fast
in any nations.

[The Slim Reaper]

That means Nothing
like when Hitler Signed the British Peace Paper
for that terrible prime minister Neville Chamberlain,

Leaders can Change fast
in any nations.

1193498940857077760

If only life and politics was easy as talking tough. Give me fewer children in poverty over this stupidity.

Let's say Russia nukes us, then what? They have enough nukes to wipe the planet clean many times over, so you're the PM (lol - you couldn't even beat the SLF :smug: ) and you get the call, do you tell the generals to nuke them back?

C'mon, this should be an easy decision for you because using nukes is a black and white thing and acting tough is easy, right?

[bots]

Nuclear weapons are a deterrent. It's not hard to understand. I would much rather have a prime minister who is prepared to use them than one who would invite the invading enemy in for a coffee and a chat

[The Slim Reaper]

Nuclear weapons are a deterrent. It's not hard to understand. I would much rather have a prime minister who is prepared to use them than one who would invite the invading enemy in for a coffee and a chat

Ahhh yes, the two equal and opposing sides of the nuclear weapons debate is being "prepared to use them" versus "coffee and a chat."

[The Slim Reaper]

...I completely see what you’re saying, Slim...it’s everything that’s ever been mentioned by the Labour Party In any degree whatsoever...and to the media, it’s a plan that’s going to happen and the funding will be flying out of their windows..?..I still though think that this is exactly the type of thing that so doesn’t make sense..that if it is being believed..?...it’s because of a leaning to believe it...


Here's another example.

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EJBVaPwWwAAa9t6?format=jpg&name=medium
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EJBVaPwXkAIquGu?format=jpg&name=medium


1193850734518951936

[arista]

Farage was Live on both News Channels
he he taking his Fight
to Labour

[Oliver_W]

Here's another example.

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EJBVaPwWwAAa9t6?format=jpg&name=medium
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EJBVaPwXkAIquGu?format=jpg&name=medium


1193850734518951936

Isn't that something to do with how it would be implemented? Labour want to do it instantly while the Tories want to do it gradually?

[arista]

Nuclear weapons are a deterrent. It's not hard to understand. I would much rather have a prime minister who is prepared to use them than one who would invite the invading enemy in for a coffee and a chat


Of Course
But Corbyn is against any War.
That's the only solid issue.

[Cherie]

Farage is standing down his candidates

[The Slim Reaper]

Farage is standing down his candidates

Arise Lord Farage. Told you :smug:

[arista]

Farage is standing down his candidates


Yes in Conservative zones


But he will Fight Labour in some zones

[arista]

Arise Lord Farage. Told you :smug:


No one cares
about that
but you

[bots]

Farage is standing down his candidates

only the ones previously won by tories (cause he wouldnt win them). They are still fighting in the labour seats

[The Slim Reaper]

Of Course
But Corbyn is against any War.
That's the only solid issue.

You've gone from saying he must be prepared to use nukes, to him being against generic war, all in less than an hour. You're giving me whiplash.

[arista]

You've gone from saying he must be prepared to use nukes, to him being against generic war, all in less than an hour. You're giving me whiplash.


Of Course he must use them in Defense
IF he is our PM

Corbyn
will get stuck on the live TV Debates
first one on ITV1HD
next week (Tues 19th Nov)

[Livia]

So, Farage isn't going to split the Tory vote. Doesn't bode well for Labour. Unless the LibDems make a similar offer... which they won't.

[bots]

You've gone from saying he must be prepared to use nukes, to him being against generic war, all in less than an hour. You're giving me whiplash.

both do apply, that's why. He has stated on numerous occasions that he is a pacifist

[The Slim Reaper]

No one cares
about that
but you

Of course. Same reason you don't care about election law breaking, about Russian funding, about Johnsons racism, about his homophobia. I'm sure if it was Corbyn and Swinson doing this, you'd be telling me that no one cares.

[arista]

1193867753335197696

No Paul
we get Johnson PM.

[arista]

So, Farage isn't going to split the Tory vote. Doesn't bode well for Labour. Unless the LibDems make a similar offer... which they won't.


Yes and Farage will Fight Labour
in some zones

[arista]

[Nigel Farage has stood down more
than 300 Brexit Party candidates
in seats won by the Conservatives
in the 2017 election.
Mr Farage said his party had
made the decision based on polling
which indicated standing in
seats in London, the South and the South West
may split the vote of pro-Brexit candidates
and allow pro-Remain candidates to win.
Therefore the Brexit Party won't contest
any of the 317 seats won by
the Conservatives in the last general election.]

https://news.sky.com/story/general-election-nigel-farages-brexit-party-wont-contest-any-seats-won-by-tories-in-2017-11859370

[bots]

this actually isnt that good for the tories. The brexit party will be fighting the marginal seats lost by the tories at the last election and the tories need them to get a majority

[arista]

this actually isnt that good for the tories. The brexit party will be fighting the marginal seats lost by the tories at the last election and the tories need them to get a majority



317 seats Conservative
held are not having Brexit Party Contenders.


It is Good news



Bad News for Labour
as Farage is Going against them

[The Slim Reaper]

1193848009966202880

[arista]

1193870967933751297

[Kizzy]

Nuclear weapons are a deterrent. It's not hard to understand. I would much rather have a prime minister who is prepared to use them than one who would invite the invading enemy in for a coffee and a chat

We have them.. that is not the issue. We won't be getting rid if them that is not for any one leader to decide in a democracy.
Let me get this straight, in your hypothetical you would forgo diplomacy and go straight for the nukes, that is preferable to you, is that what you are telling me?
No negotiation, just kill 100s of thousands of innocent people. Can you see how irrational that looks and sounds?

[bots]

We have them.. that is not the issue. We won't be getting rid if them that is not for any one leader to decide in a democracy.
Let me get this straight, in your hypothetical you would forgo diplomacy and go straight for the nukes, that is preferable to you, is that what you are telling me?
No negotiation, just kill 100s of thousands of innocent people. Can you see how irrational that looks and sounds?

i really wish you would follow someone other than me around the forum

[Kizzy]

Here's another example.

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EJBVaPwWwAAa9t6?format=jpg&name=medium
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EJBVaPwXkAIquGu?format=jpg&name=medium


1193850734518951936

My guess is boris intends to follow the ' walmart principle' raise wages but remove all other contracted rights.

Corbyns proposal is not acceptable as it raises wages without any need for the contractual change that allows employers to exploit their workforce.

[Kizzy]

i really wish you would follow someone other than me around the forum

De ja vu!... I post all over and quote lots of people, you're not special bots. Theres no onus on you to reply if you don't wish to.

[Kizzy]

Yes in Conservative zones


But he will Fight Labour in some zones

So much for not working together, this is a calculated pincer movement. Is this constitutional I wonder?