Light at the end of the tunnel - Covid [vaccine news]

[AnnieK]

My Dad had no side effects and so now is paranoid that they haven't injected him with anything :laugh:

[Vanessa]

My Dad had no side effects and so now is paranoid that they haven't injected him with anything :laugh:

Some people have no side effects. The lucky ones :laugh:

[hijaxers]

Some people have no side effects. The lucky ones :laugh:

Yes absolutely Vanessa Grim didn't even feel his and no side effects at all. I got my letter yesterday and i'm booking 1st thing tomorrow.

[Zizu]

Some people have no side effects. The lucky ones :laugh:



Plus all the ones who haven’t actually had Covid previously ( apparently)


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[Vicky.]

My Dad had no side effects and so now is paranoid that they haven't injected him with anything :laugh:

:D

[Zizu]

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[arista]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EuONEpvVoAE1kPj?format=jpg&name=small

[arista]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EuONGKDUcAEUQ-3?format=jpg&name=small

[arista]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EuONHlIVkAM4DPP?format=jpg&name=small

[arista]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EuONHjwVcAEsbQV?format=jpg&name=small

[jet]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EuONHlIVkAM4DPP?format=jpg&name=small

Very impressive! :clap1:

[Nicky91]

this vaccine is too dangerous, i'm not taking it and neither is my mom

[AnnieK]

this vaccine is too dangerous, i'm not taking it and neither is my mom

Why do you think its dangerous Nicky?

Obviously its your body, your choice. I'm genuinely interested in your thoughts on it.

[Nicky91]

Why do you think its dangerous Nicky?

Obviously its your body, your choice. I'm genuinely interested in your thoughts on it.

i read a lot of people had died after receiving the vaccine, and also here in catharina hospital in my city eindhoven some got the virus again after 2 jabs


and side effects are quite horrible

[user104658]

Why do you think its dangerous Nicky?



Obviously its your body, your choice. I'm genuinely interested in your thoughts on it.Reading between the lines... his mum told him so.

[Ammi]

i read a lot of people had died after receiving the vaccine, and also here in catharina hospital in my city eindhoven some got the virus again after 2 jabs


and side effects are quite horrible

...the greater deaths and risks are through and from the virus is the thing, Nicky...and the ‘side effects’ are the restrictions that we’re all living in and can’t continue living in indefinitely so more and more risks and vulnerability through exposure will inevitably happen soon...

[arista]

Reading between the lines... his mum told him so.


Typical

[user104658]

i read a lot of people had died after receiving the vaccine

No. Well... Complicated. The issue is its being given to nearly-100-year-olds in care homes and therefore common side effects could end up killing them... Because they're so old. A big one is that it can cause diarrhea, which can cause dehydration, not a big deal for most people but potentially fatal for a 95 year old. So while it's technically accurate that the vaccine could hasten the death of already-dying elderly people, you shouldn't be more worried about it than a you would be about a take-away curry.

and also here in catharina hospital in my city eindhoven some got the virus again after 2 jabs

None of them have ever claimed 100% efficacy.





and side effects are quite horrible

They're the same as literally any other vaccine.

[Ammi]

Typical

...I don’t understand what that ‘typical’ is meant to mean, Arista...

[AnnieK]

i read a lot of people had died after receiving the vaccine, and also here in catharina hospital in my city eindhoven some got the virus again after 2 jabs


and side effects are quite horrible

It is your choice Nicky. Not everyone gets side effects and most people I know who have had the jab had only mild side effects for one day which they easily managed with a simple pain killer.

If you've weighed up the pros and cons and decided its not for you, that's fair enough but what if your country decides to put further restrictions on you if you decide not to take the vaccine? It may mean some holiday destinations are not available to you etc.....?

[Nicky91]

It is your choice Nicky. Not everyone gets side effects and most people I know who have had the jab had only mild side effects for one day which they easily managed with a simple pain killer.

If you've weighed up the pros and cons and decided its not for you, that's fair enough but what if your country decides to put further restrictions on you if you decide not to take the vaccine? It may mean some holiday destinations are not available to you etc.....?

i'm going on holiday, without the vaccine

[Vanessa]

I had the Oxford vaccine. I was fine afterwards, but the next day I felt extreme tiredness and a bit of a headache.
I was much better the next day.
All vaccines have side effects, but I think it's worth it to be protected.

[arista]

...I don’t understand what that ‘typical’ is meant to mean, Arista...



His Mother does not have all the information.

Many In the EU are scared of these Vaccines.


I have relatives in France
they are getting wrong data.

[joeysteele]

My Mum's ONLY side effect so far over a week into having the vaccine.
Was she was REALLY tired a few days after.
Other than that, really nothing.

So I'd say to anyone hesitant that to have it is wiser than not.

It doesn't stop those vaccinated still getting covid, nor does it stop them transmitting it to others.
What it does is reduce the risk of really serious illness and possibly death too.

Which is why it should be a concern in care homes or families, where some older individuals have been vaccinated and others not.
Because of the still probable transmission of the virus if caught to the others.

For a while anyhow, these vaccines are likely the best it can be once near all have been vaccinated.
I'd still say, once offered, have it.
No hesitation.

[Vanessa]

Older people are at risk if dying of the virus, so they should be vaccinated.
The older you are the more likely you are of dying of covid.

[Ammi]

His Mother does not have all the information.

Many In the EU are scared of these Vaccines.


I have relatives in France
they are getting wrong data.

...I have relatives in France as well and they appear to have much the same general ‘data’ as we do in the U.K., Arista...but none of us have all of the information and data that governments do, I would think...what is ‘typical’ and common is that Nicky does sometimes need guidance in his thought processes as well, that doesn’t apply so much to others and a parent would be an obvious trust person for that guidance...you don’t have all of the information and neither do I and ‘being scared’ either of the virus or the vaccine isn’t typical or exclusive to those living in Europe...I’m sure that there are many vaccine uncertain and wary people here in the U.K. as well...

[Nicky91]

it is just everyone reacts differently to vaccines


my mom is very much pro-corona measures, everytime wearing her mask (FFP2 sort only) when grocery shopping, that is the only place we go now too


and i don't go anywhere literally, and whenever i go on holiday in own country, i will of course wear a face mask, and we also clean the bungalow ourselves (we have been doing for well all the time we go on holiday here, but now even extra cleaning just to be thorough)

[Cherie]

An Israeli study of 523,000 people who received both doses of the Pfizer coronavirus vaccine has found there have been zero subsequent deaths, according to a report.

The study by Maccabi Healthcare Services, cited in The Times of Israel, also found only 544 vaccinated people went on to catch the virus, with just four severe cases.

The paper marked the news with a headline reading: “It works.”

And Dr Miri Mizrahi Reuveni was quoted as saying: “This data unequivocally proves that the vaccine is very effective and we have no doubt that it has saved the lives of many Israelis.”

they have also vaccinated 47% of their population :love:

https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/covid-in-israel-how-many-have-already-been-vaccinated-1.9527583

[Nicky91]

An Israeli study of 523,000 people who received both doses of the Pfizer coronavirus vaccine has found there have been zero subsequent deaths, according to a report.

The study by Maccabi Healthcare Services, cited in The Times of Israel, also found only 544 vaccinated people went on to catch the virus, with just four severe cases.

The paper marked the news with a headline reading: “It works.”

And Dr Miri Mizrahi Reuveni was quoted as saying: “This data unequivocally proves that the vaccine is very effective and we have no doubt that it has saved the lives of many Israelis.”

they have also vaccinated 47% of their population :love:

https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/covid-in-israel-how-many-have-already-been-vaccinated-1.9527583

only 544 of vaccinated went on to catch the virus, just 4 severe cases

well wouldn't want to be one of those then

[Cherie]

only 544 of vaccinated went on to catch the virus, just 4 severe cases

well wouldn't want to be one of those then


544 out of 3.5 million....so you would rather be one of the 3.5 million?

if so get vaccinated!

[Nicky91]

544 out of 3.5 million....so you would rather be one of the 3.5 million?

failing to get my point i guess

good on the majority who the vaccine has been effective on


but there is always a chance you are among the minority with either very nasty side effects, or getting the virus again and worse


Pfizer has 95% effectiveness, still if ur among 5% and there is a chance not huge but always a chance of that

and AZ/Oxford only got 55% effectiveness, so even more chance you are among those where it is not effective on

[user104658]

failing to get my point i guess

good on the majority who the vaccine has been effective on


but there is always a chance you are among the minority with either very nasty side effects, or getting the virus again and worse


...Nicky you do realise they didn't get the virus BECAUSE they got the vaccine, right? They would have got the virus either way... whether they got the vaccine or not. There's also no way to know how many more of those 544 people would have had severe symptoms if they hadn't got the vaccine, or how many would have died.

I've yet to see ANY reputable source showing severe (as in, life ending or altering) side effects so when you talk about "nasty side effects" do you just mean getting a bit ill for a couple of days? Because that's not unusual with vaccines and, frankly, "I don't want to feel unwell for a short time" isn't a very good reason to not get it. If you were saying that you've heard that people have had severe, life-threatening responses then that would be another matter.

[Zizu]

An Israeli study of 523,000 people who received both doses of the Pfizer coronavirus vaccine has found there have been zero subsequent deaths, according to a report.

The study by Maccabi Healthcare Services, cited in The Times of Israel, also found only 544 vaccinated people went on to catch the virus, with just four severe cases.

The paper marked the news with a headline reading: “It works.”

And Dr Miri Mizrahi Reuveni was quoted as saying: “This data unequivocally proves that the vaccine is very effective and we have no doubt that it has saved the lives of many Israelis.”

they have also vaccinated 47% of their population :love:

https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/covid-in-israel-how-many-have-already-been-vaccinated-1.9527583



Staying on the Israel Covid situation

They have been trialling a drug TREATMENT that is giving AMAZING results

Medics in Israel have been given the go-ahead for a third trial of a relatively new drug after successfully testing the treatment on a number of severely ill Covid-19 patients, of which 90 per cent fully recovered within a week, according to multiple media reports.

The drug, Allocetra, aims to slow or halt an extreme overreaction of the immune system, a so-called cytokine storm. It often follows a coronavirus infection and is believed to be responsible for many Covid-related deaths as it regularly leads to organ failure.


https://youtu.be/o_8x2VOV3hA

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[Nicky91]

...Nicky you do realise they didn't get the virus BECAUSE they got the vaccine, right? They would have got the virus either way... whether they got the vaccine or not. There's also no way to know how many more of those 544 people would have had severe symptoms if they hadn't got the vaccine, or how many would have died.

I've yet to see ANY reputable source showing severe (as in, life ending or altering) side effects so when you talk about "nasty side effects" do you just mean getting a bit ill for a couple of days? Because that's not unusual with vaccines and, frankly, "I don't want to feel unwell for a short time" isn't a very good reason to not get it. If you were saying that you've heard that people have had severe, life-threatening responses then that would be another matter.

no

but not everyone reacts well to vaccines, and i did read something about quite some people having died after they got the vaccine

[Cherie]

no

but not everyone reacts well to vaccines, and i did read something about quite some people having died after they got the vaccine

I expect they were elderly and might have died either way?

do you have some ages and numbers to compare

as just reading some people died is not good enough

some people die in car crashs every day, I expect you get in a car now and again?

also you will have had plenty vaccinations in your life, if you have survived them all the likelihood is you will survive this one!

[Cherie]

Staying on the Israel Covid situation

They have been trialling a drug TREATMENT that is giving AMAZING results

Medics in Israel have been given the go-ahead for a third trial of a relatively new drug after successfully testing the treatment on a number of severely ill Covid-19 patients, of which 90 per cent fully recovered within a week, according to multiple media reports.

The drug, Allocetra, aims to slow or halt an extreme overreaction of the immune system, a so-called cytokine storm. It often follows a coronavirus infection and is believed to be responsible for many Covid-related deaths as it regularly leads to organ failure.


https://youtu.be/o_8x2VOV3hA

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great news!

[Lewismacfarlane]

I'm going in 2 weeks for my vaccine I actually can't believe it

[Nicky91]

I expect they were elderly and might have died either way?

do you have some ages and numbers to compare

as just reading some people died is not good enough

some people die in car crashs every day, I expect you get in a car now and again?

also you will have had plenty vaccinations in your life, if you have survived them all the likelihood is you will survive this one!

umm you don't know they were all elderly?



and no i haven't had plenty vaccinations in my life

[Cherie]

umm you don't know they were all elderly?



and no i haven't had plenty vaccinations in my life

That is correct, which is why I asked you to provide some facts and figures

you are saying people died, we need links and evidence

You have had all your childhood vaccinations? that is at least 5!

[user104658]

great news!

If they really have developed a drug therapy that combats cytokine storm, and it really is as effective as this (90%+) then this is an absolutely massive medical breakthrough far beyond the scope of just Covid. Cytokine storm is the eventual cause of death in MANY illnesses.

[Nicky91]

That is correct, which is why I asked you to provide some facts and figures

you are saying people died, we need links and evidence

You have had all your childhood vaccinations? that is at least 5!

well funnily enough i can't find facts and figures, only reason i know this is bc i heard it from my mom


and yes true i had vaccinations in my childhood but no reason why i should vaccinate since i never go anywhere normally, and holidays i only go in own country anyway

[Nicky91]

ok mostly elderly are among those deaths yes


one doctor Bart van Tienen, he said we started to vaccinate the elderly too soon, without proper testing and not enough waiting how the test subjects reacted to the vaccine many days after

but yes most of those deaths are among 80, 90+ group, one lady who fell and she had morphine, one day later she had the Moderna vaccine, she had fever, tiredness afterwards and soon after died, they rule those as ''natural causes'' deaths due to the fever, but idk i think it could've been prevented if there was better and longer testing of the vaccines

[bots]

Not wishing to put a dampener on this new Israel treatment, but they are not noted for accurate drug trials. It would need to go through the standard trial process in individual countries and see if the data is the same. We have heard stories about miracle cures before

[user104658]

Not wishing to put a dampener on this new Israel treatment, but they are not noted for accurate drug trials. It would need to go through the standard trial process in individual countries and see if the data is the same. We have heard stories about miracle cures before

Is this an actual thing? Like... is Israel actually known for their poor quality drug trials? :think:

[bots]

Is this an actual thing? Like... is Israel actually known for their poor quality drug trials? :think:

there are a very small % of countries that do it properly. It's easy for data to become contaminated unless the test conditions are perfect. That aside, the results from one country are never taken as gospel. I'm sure it will be looked at with enthusiasm by the medical community, but we are a long way off confirming those reported results

[Vicky.]

The 'loads have died after being given the vaccine' is surely easily explained by...we started with the oldest most vulnerable people?

I thought this back when it was 'omg loads of 90+ year olds have died after catching covid!' tbh. The shock some seemed to have when it blazed through carehomes resulting in fatalities was..odd. Noro does the same?!

When you are dealing with people that old and fragile, even a cold can 'kill them off' so to speak. So yeah, the side effects might kill some, its unfortunate but expected. Meanwhle, they are much more likely to be finished off if they actually caught covid.

I mean, I think it was a bit of a waste, in all honesty, to vaccinate the very very vulnerable. For the simple fact that..even a 'covid light' version would likely still kill them. As a cold could! But..here we are. So yeah, vaccinating people like that will result in a quite high looking death rate (among that age group)

[Zizu]

The 'loads have died after being given the vaccine' is surely easily explained by...we started with the oldest most vulnerable people?

I thought this back when it was 'omg loads of 90+ year olds have died after catching covid!' tbh. The shock some seemed to have when it blazed through carehomes resulting in fatalities was..odd. Noro does the same?!

When you are dealing with people that old and fragile, even a cold can 'kill them off' so to speak. So yeah, the side effects might kill some, its unfortunate but expected. Meanwhle, they are much more likely to be finished off if they actually caught covid.

I mean, I think it was a bit of a waste, in all honesty, to vaccinate the very very vulnerable. For the simple fact that..even a 'covid light' version would likely still kill them. As a cold could! But..here we are. So yeah, vaccinating people like that will result in a quite high looking death rate (among that age group)



That’s an interesting take on things Vicky ... oddly I also wondered if we should have started with the 35yr olds and worked upwards ( I’m over 60 )

After all they are the future ( the younger ones aren’t badly effected- generally speaking)


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[AnnieK]

That’s an interesting take on things Vicky ... oddly I also wondered if we should have started with the 35yr olds and worked upwards ( I’m over 60 )

After all they are the future ( the younger ones aren’t badly effected- generally speaking)


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I thought the working populous was a better place to start too as then the economy would have restarted quicker but then we were leaving the old and vulnerable locked down, often alone for longer. Most younger age people did at least have some limited freedom last summer.

Plus the main worry has always been the NHS and so to relieve the strain they needed to vaccinate the groups who are most likely to end up hospitalised.

[Vicky.]

I think starting with older high risk people was the best way, along with teachers, care home staff, etc. However, vaccinating 80+ ill people? Seems..pointless. I know that sounds harsh, but..its how I honestly feel.

We would be onto a significant portion of the working community now, if we had...say..started the vaccinations at 70 or something like that, instead of much higher.

People who are older, could have the option...after the working population was done?
IDK as thats leaving carehomes 'to the wolves' but honestly..I do think the vaccinations side effects may potentially kill off as many as a potential covid spread in that carehome would anyway :S

[Vicky.]

Plus the main worry has always been the NHS and so to relieve the strain they needed to vaccinate the groups who are most likely to end up hospitalised.

Yes.

At a certain point though, as I said, surely 'covid lite' is just as dangerous as covid. These are people who can be killed easily with a bit of a bad stomach..

I get why they were done, as the government would look cold as **** to do it my way. And it doesnt sit right to just 'leave them as they might die either way' but..in terms of actually sorting the economy and stuff...and also thinking about how many are getting flu symptoms from the vaccine...seems...almost counterproductive to induce flu symptoms in the very old/vulnerable?! Those symptoms alone could easily kill/hospitalise that group..then we are back to square one/.

[user104658]

Yes.

At a certain point though, as I said, surely 'covid lite' is just as dangerous as covid. These are people who can be killed easily with a bit of a bad stomach..

I get why they were done, as the government would look cold as **** to do it my way. And it doesnt sit right to just 'leave them as they might die either way' but..in terms of actually sorting the economy and stuff...and also thinking about how many are getting flu symptoms from the vaccine...seems...almost counterproductive to induce flu symptoms in the very old/vulnerable?! Those symptoms alone could easily kill/hospitalise that group..then we are back to square one/.

There are actually a few "high profile doctors" who are questioning if enough testing was done with the "very elderly" (90+ with various conditions) to consider whether they'd statistically be safer with permanent enhanced shielding than with vaccine side effects. The stats aren't really broken down enough by age. Obviously they know that vaccinating 65+ will save countless lives, but there's a huge difference between a 65 - 80 year old (may still be very fit and active), and a 95 year old (HIGHLY likely to be frail).

[bots]

To not vaccinate a section of society because they are going to die anyway is discrimination. Plenty old folks recover from serious illness and continue to enjoy life, why shouldn't they get the vaccine first if they are considered the most vulnerable.

People who are seriously ill or are on certain medications won't get vaccinated, after that, it's personal choice if they want the jab.

The whole reason for vaccination is to reduce the pressure on the NHS, same as the flu jab. The side effect is that it saves lives too. Maybe thats a bit blunt, but its true. The reason for lockdown now is to stop younger folk spreading it to older generations, whether that be by meeting or living in a multi generational house. Once those older people have been vaccinated, they younger folks can get on with life, so I think its the right approach

[Vicky.]

There are actually a few "high profile doctors" who are questioning if enough testing was done with the "very elderly" (90+ with various conditions) to consider whether they'd statistically be safer with permanent enhanced shielding than with vaccine side effects. The stats aren't really broken down enough by age. Obviously they know that vaccinating 65+ will save countless lives, but there's a huge difference between a 65 - 80 year old, and a 95 year old.

Yes. Even moreso when you add in possible comorbid illnesses, with the sheer age.

I don't think permanent enhanced shielding is the answer either tbh. BUT I don't know if my 'solution' would be possible, given the law and such. My mother in law went into a carehome short term in July...and says, he two weeks she was there, there were 3 residents attempting suicide, and near all of them (residents, not the suicidal ones)mentioned they were depressed as **** with not being able to see people. Back then, I decided the 'close them off from the world for their own good' was...cruelty. And since then have thought there HAS to be a way where they could sign some disclaimer, removing wrongdoing from the home they are in, and see their families? I mean, a significant amount of those people who were in with my mother in law, are probably actually dead now, and were never allowed to see their families :S

[Vicky.]

To not vaccinate a section of society because they are going to die anyway is discrimination. Plenty old folks recover from serious illness and continue to enjoy life, why shouldn't they get the vaccine first if they are considered the most vulnerable.

People who are seriously ill or are on certain medications won't get vaccinated, after that, it's personal choice if they want the jab.

The whole reason for vaccination is to reduce the pressure on the NHS, same as the flu jab. The side effect is that it saves lives too. Maybe thats a bit blunt, but its true. The reason for lockdown now is to stop younger folk spreading it to older generations, whether that be by meeting or living in a multi generational house. Once those older people have been vaccinated, they younger folks can get on with life, so I think its the right approach

...seemingly not though?!

I mean, a huge proportion of those people are now vaccinated, yet still theres talk of bloody May? And the goalposts shift yet again to 'all over 18s in the country to be vaccinated'

[bots]

...seemingly not though?!

I mean, a huge proportion of those people are now vaccinated, yet still theres talk of bloody May? And the goalposts shift yet again to 'all over 18s in the country to be vaccinated'

first jab, they need to get 2 :)

[Vicky.]

first jab, they need to get 2 :)

IF it was as you say I would be behind it tbh. But thats what it appeared to be, then shifted to 'all over 18s' which seems, again quite pointless given stats of illness in younger people say...the VAST majority are not at risk. So...lessen the risk of those higher risk, and leave the rest to take chances, would be the ideal for me tbh :S

I am confused about the second jab thing, last I read, it seemed the longer gap between jabs, the more effective (we were amazing, for doing that by mistake..I read!!!)., But now its claimed, 6 weeks is the longest it should be between?

[Zizu]

Yes.

At a certain point though, as I said, surely 'covid lite' is just as dangerous as covid. These are people who can be killed easily with a bit of a bad stomach..

I get why they were done, as the government would look cold as **** to do it my way. And it doesnt sit right to just 'leave them as they might die either way' but..in terms of actually sorting the economy and stuff...and also thinking about how many are getting flu symptoms from the vaccine...seems...almost counterproductive to induce flu symptoms in the very old/vulnerable?! Those symptoms alone could easily kill/hospitalise that group..then we are back to square one/.



Plus the over 70’s have the choice of staying safe at home...whereas the younger ones have to go out in the community to earn a living..


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[user104658]

the younger ones have to go out in the community to earn a living

Tell that to my slowly-collapsing desk chair, I've been parked on this damn computer all day since last March :joker:.

... ... and then I clock off work and stay on it voluntarily playing games or posting on here... so I can't really complain too much I guess.

[Vicky.]

Plus the over 70’s have the choice of staying safe at home...whereas the younger ones have to go out in the community to earn a living..


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Many over 70s work

I have actually been trialling (in my head, no other way! haha)...doing it by profession,...via work basically. Then moving onto those out of work for whatever reason.

I am sure that would fall foul of some laws though. As does most..

[Zizu]

Tell that to my slowly-collapsing desk chair, I've been parked on this damn computer all day since last March :joker:.



... ... and then I clock off work and stay on it voluntarily playing games or posting on here... so I can't really complain too much I guess.



... generally speaking ..


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[Vicky.]

Sorry yeah, generally speaking of course. Feel a bit twatty for the 'over 70s work' when of course, everyone knows that. :bored:

[Zizu]

Many over 70s work



I have actually been trialling (in my head, no other way! haha)...doing it by profession,...via work basically. Then moving onto those out of work for whatever reason.



I am sure that would fall foul of some laws though. As does most..



Not too many %wise compared to the under 60’s I’d suggest


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[Vicky.]

Not too many %wise compared to the under 60’s I’d suggest


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Yeah I know. sorry was being a pedantic bitch there like, for no reason either as I seem to agree with you on most stuff tbh!:laugh:

[Zizu]

Yeah I know. sorry was being a pedantic bitch there like, for no reason either as I seem to agree with you on most stuff tbh!:laugh:



:)


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[Vanessa]

From what I've seen, the vaccine rollout has been very well organized.
I'm so impressed!

[Zizu]

From what I've seen, the vaccine rollout has been very well organized.

I'm so impressed!



Things MAY get slightly trickier soon though ... due to a combination of vaccine shortages / second doses having to be given / all the damn variants cropping up every week or so ..


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[Lewismacfarlane]

I can't believe I'm getting my vaccine so quickly

[GoldHeart]

Did anyone watch the panorama documentary highlighting all the misinformation and fear mongering , it was a good program calling out all the BS conspiracy claims.


I'm always glad and relieved to hear when people have taken the vaccine , especially the vulnerable people.

[Zizu]

Did anyone watch the panorama documentary highlighting all the misinformation and fear mongering , it was a good program calling out all the BS conspiracy claims.





I'm always glad and relieved to hear when people have taken the vaccine , especially the vulnerable people.



I vaguely recall in the first few days of the vaccinations that a couple of people had bad reactions to the jab but 15 million vaccinations later I’ve heard of no other severe reactions?!?

Seems kinda odd ??


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[GoldHeart]

I vaguely recall in the first few days of the vaccinations that a couple of people had bad reactions to the jab but 15 million vaccinations later I’ve heard of no other severe reactions?!?

Seems kinda odd ??


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What is a "bad reaction" ? , we all know it has side effects which is bound to happen but usually it goes away shortly :shrug: .

You've also got to be careful as people exaggerate and spread lies .

[Cherie]

What is a "bad reaction" ? , we all know it has side effects which is bound to happen but usually it goes away shortly :shrug: .

You've also got to be careful as people exaggerate and spread lies .

I think a handful of people who carry epipens for bad allergies had a reaction, hence why people have to sit for 15 minutes in the waiting area after the Pfizer vac, there is no requirement to do this after the AZ vaccine

[Vicky.]

I think a handful of people who carry epipens for bad allergies had a reaction, hence why people have to sit for 15 minutes in the waiting area after the Pfizer vac, there is no requirement to do this after the AZ vaccine

Interesting..my husbands cousin has an epipen and says his GP said its likely he will not get either of them, as all are potentially dangerous to him due to his severe allergic response to a few things..

Meanwhile, he wants to have it..I wonder if hes going to be able to sign something saying he understands its a risk, but still wants it. I cant see they would deny it alltogether, but also unsre if this would cover them if the worst did happen..

[Cherie]

Interesting..my husbands cousin has an epipen and says his GP said its likely he will not get either of them, as all are potentially dangerous to him due to his severe allergic response to a few things..

Meanwhile, he wants to have it..I wonder if hes going to be able to sign something saying he understands its a risk, but still wants it. I cant see they would deny it alltogether, but also unsre if this would cover them if the worst did happen..

That is correct the vaccines are not recommended for people who carry epipens

[Cherie]

I vaguely recall in the first few days of the vaccinations that a couple of people had bad reactions to the jab but 15 million vaccinations later I’ve heard of no other severe reactions?!?

Seems kinda odd ??


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They revised the guidance and epipens carriers can’t get any vaccine

[GoldHeart]

They revised the guidance and epipens carriers can’t get any vaccine

But they should still take it really

[Cherie]

But they should still take it really

They would be going against the advice so I wouldn’t if it were me, you don’t mess about with severe allergic reactions

[arista]

https://ichef.bbci.co.uk/news/976/cpsprodpb/17FAB/production/_116991289_the-times-nc.png

[user104658]

But they should still take it reallyIt's about balance of risks - the risk from allergic reaction will far outweigh the risks from catching Covid for anyone who suffers from severe allergies, especially if they're under 50 where the risk from Covid is minimal.

[Vicky.]

Just spoke to my dad, he is back to normal now, bar a bit of a sore arm. Seems to be dreading the second one though, as that appears to be where the worst symptoms come from from reading about. (hes still getting it though)

[Vicky.]

It's about balance of risks - the risk from allergic reaction will far outweigh the risks from catching Covid for anyone who suffers from severe allergies, especially if they're under 50 where the risk from Covid is minimal.

Yes.

There are a few people who cannot get it and shouldnt be pressured either as the risks far outweigh the benefits.

Am actually thinking cousin is being a bit silly, with his insistence that he gets it despite it being such a risk to him..even moreso as he has already had covid and it was VERY mild, like, he had a bit of a cough for a few days, nothing else...so it seems very unlikely if he got it again it would be serious. But..its his body I guess.

[arista]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EuVflUoWYAA0yCy?format=jpg&name=900x900

[arista]

https://ichef.bbci.co.uk/news/976/cpsprodpb/12584/production/_117004157_metro170221-nc.png

[arista]

Lower Part
of the FT No Jab, No Job.

https://ichef.bbci.co.uk/news/976/cpsprodpb/FE74/production/_117004156_ft170221-nc.png

[Cherie]

Just spoke to my dad, he is back to normal now, bar a bit of a sore arm. Seems to be dreading the second one though, as that appears to be where the worst symptoms come from from reading about. (hes still getting it though)

aw that's good to hear, I don't know anyone who has had the second one yet so cant comment :worry:

[AnnieK]

They have just said on the news that they are hoping that all adults will have been offered 2 jabs by August / September. That is quite an impressive roll out if it happens. Obviously, its dependant on supply but quite an achievement if they do it.

[Vicky.]

My mother in law got it early this morning, and apparently now has explosive diarrhea, which was lovely of her to share. She said though, given what shes heard shes happy to have a side effect, as she would be worried (a bit like annies dad!) that it hadnt worked or shed been given a placebo or something if she wasnt a bit ill :laugh:

[Cherie]

My mother in law got it early this morning, and apparently now has explosive diarrhea, which was lovely of her to share. She said though, given what shes heard shes happy to have a side effect, as she would be worried (a bit like annies dad!) that it hadnt worked or shed been given a placebo or something if she wasnt a bit ill :laugh:

jesus everything happens to her :laugh:

[Vicky.]

They have just said on the news that they are hoping that all adults will have been offered 2 jabs by August / September. That is quite an impressive roll out if it happens. Obviously, its dependant on supply but quite an achievement if they do it.

Then they can get on with modifying it, so the vulnerable can get their next dose before xmas, along with the flu jab. I expect.

The 'normal cover' should be enough for 'normal' people, but I really think those higher risk will need a yearly (or more than that) jab, to try and counter the different mutations that arise.

I have to say, the vaccination program speed has impressed me, its been the only thing in a year that they have managed to do right, so credit where its due I guess :laugh:

[Vicky.]

jesus everything happens to her :laugh:

I swear to god, even before covid..I have no idea how she is still alive. she gets pneumonia yearly, is in hospital maybe every 2 months, catches chest infections constantly..thats why it was SO odd that when she had covid it presented as just a cough. Shes so so frail, and we were sure she would be very ill with it. As it happened, me and gav were laid up for 2 days, and she thought she had a minor chest infection...

Ontop of her serious chest issues, she has some condition which means her spine is slowly crumbling..oesteoartritus, blood disorder..pretty much anything that can be wrong, is wrong. I swear shes getting a touch of dementia recently too D:

[Vanessa]

Side effects after the vaccine are normal. I only got it for one day, I was so much better the next day.
This is why I get the vaccine on Tuesday, so I have time to recover :laugh:

[bots]

i think we are over worrying about variants, at least for the moment. These vaccines are stopping all but a tiny number of serious illnesses and that puts us in a different league to no vaccine at all

on the diarrhea front, that may have been a stress/anxiety reaction rather than the vaccine :laugh:

[Vicky.]

i think we are over worrying about variants, at least for the moment. These vaccines are stopping all but a tiny number of serious illnesses and that puts us in a different league to no vaccine at all

on the diarrhea front, that may have been a stress/anxiety reaction rather than the vaccine :laugh:

I will leave her to think its a side effect tbh, else she might start badgering the doctors to do it again as it hasnt worked :laugh: Apparently the lot of them (like a coven of witches I swear) are all on at the two people in her street that got no side effects, telling them it obviously didn't work. Its like..10 of them who say they got side effects...and while I know they are common, I find it hard to believe all of them got fluey type symptoms after it. So I think some are fibbing, but then trying to stress others about it...dicks.

[arista]

https://ichef.bbci.co.uk/news/976/cpsprodpb/397E/production/_117081741_mail-nc.png

[arista]

https://ichef.bbci.co.uk/news/976/cpsprodpb/17014/production/_117082249_thesunfrontpage19.02.2021-nc.png

[arista]

https://ichef.bbci.co.uk/news/976/cpsprodpb/879E/production/_117081743_tele1001ic-dtndt-1-190221-a001c-dt-nc.png

[Nicky91]

https://twitter.com/EU_Commission/status/1363111164163608576

[arista]

[People vaccinated up to and including 19 February 2021
First dose: 17,247,442

Second dose: 604,885]
https://coronavirus.data.gov.uk/details/vaccinations

https://i.dailymail.co.uk/1s/2021/02/20/14/39498664-9281433-image-a-19_1613832215167.jpg

[Kate!]

Got my appointment confirmed yesterday for my Covid Jab. I would like the Pfizer one mostly but you get what you're given I know.

Bit nervous but I really want to have it.

It's next Thursday at 2pm.

[smudgie]

Job well done.
Our surgery are organised so brilliantly, they have a large marquee outside for the 15 minute wait, nurse keeping an eye on it whilst checking people into the surgery at the door.

[arista]

Got my appointment confirmed yesterday for my Covid Jab. I would like the Pfizer one mostly but you get what you're given I know.

Bit nervous but I really want to have it.

It's next Thursday at 2pm.


Great news.

[Vanessa]

Got my appointment confirmed yesterday for my Covid Jab. I would like the Pfizer one mostly but you get what you're given I know.

Bit nervous but I really want to have it.

It's next Thursday at 2pm.

That's brilliant news :love:

[AnnieK]

Got my appointment confirmed yesterday for my Covid Jab. I would like the Pfizer one mostly but you get what you're given I know.

Bit nervous but I really want to have it.

It's next Thursday at 2pm.

Great news Kate.....are you in the higher groups or have they just got round to your age group already? (If you don't mind me asking)

[smudgie]

Got my appointment confirmed yesterday for my Covid Jab. I would like the Pfizer one mostly but you get what you're given I know.

Bit nervous but I really want to have it.

It's next Thursday at 2pm.

Brilliant Kate.
Nothing to be nervous about, honest.
The jabs are already ready for you, I suppose it depends on what stock they have.

[Kate!]

Great news Kate.....are you in the higher groups or have they just got round to your age group already? (If you don't mind me asking)

I'm 52 Annie. They've got round to me a lot quicker than I expected. Xx

[Cherie]

Brilliant news Smudgie and Kate

[arista]

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[arista]

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[arista]

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[arista]

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[arista]

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[Cherie]

UK preparing for Covid-19 revaccination programme this year

Britain is preparing for a revaccination programme against Covid-19, likely to run later this year and consist of a single booster dose, the government said in its road map to end coronavirus restrictions.

"The government is planning for a revaccination campaign, which is likely to run later this year in autumn or winter," the document said.

"Any revaccination is likely to consist of a single 'booster' dose of a Covid-19 vaccine: the ideal booster may be a new vaccine specifically designed against a variant form of the virus."

[Braden]

Getting my first vaccination on Wednesday :love:

[Cherie]

Getting my first vaccination on Wednesday :love:

whoop whoop

[Zizu]

Getting my first vaccination on Wednesday :love:



Yeah I get my Pfizer jab tomorrow providing they don’t cancel again ( it was scheduled for last Tuesday) ..

Just dreading having a reaction .. a couple of people have apparently had shingles after the jab and I was in hospital for 5 days a few years ago with shingles after an allergic reaction and it was absolutely dreadful.


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[Braden]

Yeah I get my Pfizer jab tomorrow providing they don’t cancel again ( it was scheduled for last Tuesday) ..

Just dreading having a reaction .. a couple of people have apparently had shingles after the jab and I was in hospital for 5 days a few years ago with shingles after an allergic reaction and it was absolutely dreadful.


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Well, I certainly hope it goes well for your, Zizu. I'm a bit nervous cause it's been a while since I had a vaccine, but I'm sure I’ll be fine.

Let us know how it goes :)

[AnnieK]

Yeah I get my Pfizer jab tomorrow providing they don’t cancel again ( it was scheduled for last Tuesday) ..

Just dreading having a reaction .. a couple of people have apparently had shingles after the jab and I was in hospital for 5 days a few years ago with shingles after an allergic reaction and it was absolutely dreadful.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

You will hopefully feel a little more reassured once you've had the jab. Let us know how you get on :love:

[Ammi]

..Vanessa, Braden, Zizu, Kate...all leading us all through the tunnel...:love:...I’m thrilled for you, guys...:hug:...

[Cherie]

What are the overall findings?

The Israeli study found an 85 per cent reduction in symptomatic Covid-19 within 15 to 28 days with an overall reduction of infections, including asymptomatic cases detected by testing, of 75 per cent.

One dose of vaccine against Covid-19 in Scotland has cut hospital admissions by more than 85 per cent, according to the first data published on the impact of the UK programme. By the fourth week after receiving the initial dose, the Pfizer and AstraZeneca vaccines had reduced risk of hospitalisation by up to 85 per cent and 94 per cent respectively.

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/heal...land-1.4492167

[Nicky91]

What are the overall findings?

The Israeli study found an 85 per cent reduction in symptomatic Covid-19 within 15 to 28 days with an overall reduction of infections, including asymptomatic cases detected by testing, of 75 per cent.

One dose of vaccine against Covid-19 in Scotland has cut hospital admissions by more than 85 per cent, according to the first data published on the impact of the UK programme. By the fourth week after receiving the initial dose, the Pfizer and AstraZeneca vaccines had reduced risk of hospitalisation by up to 85 per cent and 94 per cent respectively.

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/heal...land-1.4492167

no wait, is this based upon ICU numbers? or what is this based on anyway? because if it is then it doesn't say much since all vaccines are effective to lower chance of you ending on a ICU bed


how many of the vaccinated people had side effects, how many of those had mild side effects, and how many had severe side effects? that is just what i look more at

[Zizu]

..Vanessa, Braden, Zizu, Kate...all leading us all through the tunnel...:love:...I’m thrilled for you, guys...:hug:...


LIVE on Sky News this morning -


Matt Hancock was asked why there were only 116,000 vaccines administered yesterday when the average figure of late has been 600,000 !!

He said it’s going to be a ‘quieter’ week but we should have some ‘bumper’ figures in the coming weeks ..

It sounds like there is/was a shortage of vaccines as was muted in the media and would explain why my vaccine was cancelled last week and delayed until tonight ..


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[bots]

i think half the problem is that vaccine centres are not sticking with the plan and vaccinating the most vulnerable as a priority and have been vaccinating anyone to get their numbers up, hence there will be a shortage against the planned target

[Cherie]

LIVE on Sky News this morning -


Matt Hancock was asked why there were only 116,000 vaccines administered yesterday when the average figure of late has been 600,000 !!

He said it’s going to be a ‘quieter’ week but we should have some ‘bumper’ figures in the coming weeks ..

It sounds like there is/was a shortage of vaccines as was muted in the media and would explain why my vaccine was cancelled last week and delayed until tonight ..


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My son is due his on Friday, let's see what happens

[Cherie]

no wait, is this based upon ICU numbers? or what is this based on anyway? because if it is then it doesn't say much since all vaccines are effective to lower chance of you ending on a ICU bed


how many of the vaccinated people had side effects, how many of those had mild side effects, and how many had severe side effects? that is just what i look more at

its based on the over 80s who have had their first jab

[Ammi]

LIVE on Sky News this morning -


Matt Hancock was asked why there were only 116,000 vaccines administered yesterday when the average figure of late has been 600,000 !!

He said it’s going to be a ‘quieter’ week but we should have some ‘bumper’ figures in the coming weeks ..

It sounds like there is/was a shortage of vaccines as was muted in the media and would explain why my vaccine was cancelled last week and delayed until tonight ..


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...oh yeah, I don’t know which area you are, but they said that in our area as well, that there was a shortage ...but that was at a time when I knew lots of people having them within a few days of each other...so hmmmmm, maybe it was more that individual surgeries and centres may have been more the thing...and either doing them more quickly or even having a delayed supply for whatever reason...we just won’t know exactly, I guess...but I’m glad that you have yours scheduled now again, Zizu...such a relief, eh..:hug:..

[user104658]

LIVE on Sky News this morning -


Matt Hancock was asked why there were only 116,000 vaccines administered yesterday when the average figure of late has been 600,000 !!

He said it’s going to be a ‘quieter’ week but we should have some ‘bumper’ figures in the coming weeks ..

It sounds like there is/was a shortage of vaccines as was muted in the media and would explain why my vaccine was cancelled last week and delayed until tonight ..


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

We're starting to approach 12 weeks since the first doses started being given which means they now have to start the second dose rollout alongside first doses; a process which requires MUCH more administration and organisation. It's not just any old bum in seat, needle in arm, away you go... dates and times need to be checked, the right vaccine has to be sourced, for AZ the dosage has to be double checked (as some people will be getting half, some full) ... it's inevitable that orchestrating second doses will slow down the whole process and this was always a wall they were going to hit at the three-month mark.


In good news - my wife got her appointment through today for her 2nd Pfizer dose and will be fully-vaxxed at the start of April :hee:. I won't get a sniff at a FIRST dose for months yet :joker:. Maybe if I do my make-up really nicely and wear a wig... I can sneak in with her ID and steal her 2nd dose??

[arista]

[People vaccinated up to and including 22 February 2021

First dose: 17,916,181

Second dose: 642,788]


https://coronavirus.data.gov.uk/

[Vanessa]

Brilliant!

[Zizu]

We're starting to approach 12 weeks since the first doses started being given which means they now have to start the second dose rollout alongside first doses; a process which requires MUCH more administration and organisation. It's not just any old bum in seat, needle in arm, away you go... dates and times need to be checked, the right vaccine has to be sourced, for AZ the dosage has to be double checked (as some people will be getting half, some full) ... it's inevitable that orchestrating second doses will slow down the whole process and this was always a wall they were going to hit at the three-month mark.





In good news - my wife got her appointment through today for her 2nd Pfizer dose and will be fully-vaxxed at the start of April :hee:. I won't get a sniff at a FIRST dose for months yet :joker:. Maybe if I do my make-up really nicely and wear a wig... I can sneak in with her ID and steal her 2nd dose??



Take photos :)


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[Zizu]

Well I’m back from the hospital.. had my first Pfizer jab about three hours ago and no ill effects as yet ... initial stinging in my arm for a short while as I sat in the 15 minute waiting area .

I’ve got a bit of a dull headache but that could be down to tension.

I’ve had a stressful day then got increasingly anxious as the vaccine appointment got closer ... got stuck in a flaming traffic jam going there .. then the petrol warning light came on on the motorway.... they even queried why I had been offered it being healthy and under 65 so my wife had to explain the situation

Scary moment though as I thought they were gonna refuse me .. ( remember it had already been cancelled last week ) !

Oh well I should be fairly well protected in three weeks ... sadly the pupils ALL return in 12 days ...


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[Cherie]

Well I’m back from the hospital.. had my first Pfizer jab about three hours ago and no ill effects as yet ... initial stinging in my arm for a short while as I sat in the 15 minute waiting area .

I’ve got a but of a dull headache but that could be down to tension.

I’ve had a stressful day then got increasingly anxious as the vaccine appointment got closer ... got stuck in a flaming traffic jam going there .. then the petrol warning light came on on the motorway.... they even queried why I had been offered it being healthy and under 65 so my wife had to explain to situation

Scarf moment as I thought they were gonna refuse me .. ( it had already been cancelled last week ) !

Oh well I should be fairly well protected in three weeks ... sadly the pupils ALL return in 12 days ...


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Great news Zizu

[Zizu]

Great news Zizu



Thank you !!

I’m gonna immerse myself into researching just how soon the Pfizer vaccine actually kicks in .. the main nurse who was giving out all the key information and answering everyone’s questions said to be really careful for the next two to three weeks then I should be 70% protected ( I thought it was nearer to 85% but never mind) .

So If she’s suggesting 70% after TWO to three weeks I should hopefully have at least SOME cover by the 8th March ( in 12 days ) when 1300 pupils return to school :)



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[AnnieK]

Great news Zizu....hope you feel a little reassured now

[bots]

great news zizu, and if you are worried you could always take a few days sick till you get up to 3 weeks :smug: It may well be worth it for your mental health

[Zizu]

great news zizu, and if you are worried you could always take a few days sick till you get up to 3 weeks :smug: It may well be worth it for your mental health



I have been considering something along those lines ... the headmaster suggested I sign on the sick when we returned in January but I didn’t want to let anyone down ...


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[Zizu]

Great news Zizu....hope you feel a little reassured now



I do feel better , yes , thank you .


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[Cherie]

Thank you !!

I’m gonna immerse myself into researching just how soon the Pfizer vaccine actually kicks in .. the main nurse who was giving out all the key information and answering everyone’s questions said to be really careful for the next two to three weeks then I should be 70% protected ( I thought it was nearer to 85% but never mind) .

So If she’s suggesting 70% after TWO to three weeks I should hopefully have at least SOME cover by the 8th March ( in 12 days ) when 1300 pupils return to school :)



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Apparently it is 14 for younger people up to 21 as you progress in age I’m so glad you decided to take the vaccine Zizu x and good advice from Bots, just say you got pinged on the app and have to isolate for 10 days that should see you right :smug:

[Zizu]

Apparently it is 14 for younger people up to 21 as you progress in age I’m so glad you decided to take the vaccine Zizu x and good advice from Bots, just say you got pinged on the app and have to isolate for 10 days that should see you right :smug:



I was thinking there should be some cover from day one .. building gradually as the days go by ??




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[Cherie]

I was thinking there should be some cover from day one .. building gradually as the days go by ??




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

No apparently there is limited protection until at least day 14 but 21 in older adults, so act like you haven’t had it, and even after 3 weeks you should continue to follow social distancing guidelines

[Zizu]

No apparently there is limited protection until at least day 14 but 21 in older adults, so act like you haven’t had it, and even after 3 weeks you should continue to follow social distancing guidelines



Thank you !


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

[bots]

and forget this % effectiveness nonsense. All the data is showing that you would be extremely unlikely to get seriously ill from covid and any of its current variants in the UK after that 3 week period. It doesn't get much better than that.

[Zizu]

and forget this % effectiveness nonsense. All the data is showing that you would be extremely unlikely to get seriously ill from covid and any of its current variants in the UK after that 3 week period. It doesn't get much better than that.



Thank you !


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[arista]

https://ichef.bbci.co.uk/news/976/cpsprodpb/E265/production/_117175975_telegraph-nc.png

[user104658]

and forget this % effectiveness nonsense. All the data is showing that you would be extremely unlikely to get seriously ill from covid and any of its current variants in the UK after that 3 week period. It doesn't get much better than that.

On a macro scale this is misleading; it does get a LOT better than that. If the vaccines only provide individual protection from severe illness, and do not trigger herd immunity/reduced transmission, then the virus will continue to rapidly mutate until, further down the line, vaccine protection is completely circumvented and we need to redevelop and redeploy all over again.

It's good that it stops severe illness and should offer a lot of peace of mind to vaccinated people in the short term, but longer term, if the vaccines only stop severe illness it's frankly a disaster.

[Cherie]

On a macro scale this is misleading; it does get a LOT better than that. If the vaccines only provide individual protection from severe illness, and do not trigger herd immunity/reduced transmission, then the virus will continue to rapidly mutate until, further down the line, vaccine protection is completely circumvented and we need to redevelop and redeploy all over again.

It's good that it stops severe illness and should offer a lot of peace of mind to vaccinated people in the short term, but longer term, if the vaccines only stop severe illness it's frankly a disaster.

Isn't there already promising signs of reduced transmission Mr Doom and Gloom :laugh:

[user104658]

Isn't there already promising signs of reduced transmission Mr Doom and Gloom :laugh:

Yes but I was responding to;

forget this % effectiveness nonsense.

and

It doesn't get much better than that.

So I'm not saying that current signs aren't good, I'm just saying that it's a mistake to think that this aspect "isn't important" :hee:

[Alf]

If you have to have the vaccine to do things, such as travel and attend venues, does that mean the immune system stuff is all bollox and they need to stop with the keeping fit and healthy propaganda and start advertising things like cigs again?

[Braden]

All vaccine’d up...well partly, obviously :p

Feel fine and dandy right now.

[user104658]

If you have to have the vaccine to do things, such as travel and attend venues, does that mean the immune system stuff is all bollox and they need to stop with the keeping fit and healthy propaganda and start advertising things like cigs again?

Not Alf thinking that overweight people having heart attacks has anything at all to do with the immune system :worry:

[Cherie]

All vaccine’d up...well partly, obviously :p

Feel fine and dandy right now.

Great,which one did you get if you don't mind me asking?

[Zizu]

All vaccine’d up...well partly, obviously :p

Feel fine and dandy right now.



Good news !


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[Braden]

Great,which one did you get if you don't mind me asking?

Pfizer :)

[Cherie]

Pfizer :)

supplies still around then for first doses , good to know :thumbs:

[user104658]

supplies still around then for first doses , good to know :thumbs:

My wife has her booking through for her 2nd Pfizer dose so I *assume* they still have stock for that, if they're sending out the appointments :think:

[Vicky.]

On a macro scale this is misleading; it does get a LOT better than that. If the vaccines only provide individual protection from severe illness, and do not trigger herd immunity/reduced transmission, then the virus will continue to rapidly mutate until, further down the line, vaccine protection is completely circumvented and we need to redevelop and redeploy all over again.

It's good that it stops severe illness and should offer a lot of peace of mind to vaccinated people in the short term, but longer term, if the vaccines only stop severe illness it's frankly a disaster.

Yes I have been thinking this too tbh. There will eventually be a varient that is totally vaccine resistant. Isn't something like that how the likes of MRSA and such started..and why doctors are reluctant to prescribe antibitotics, as all that will happen with overuse, is that it will mutate to find ways around the medication?

We realy need a vaccine that stops you getting it fullstop.

That said, they are doing the best with what they can.

[Cherie]

My wife has her booking through for her 2nd Pfizer dose so I *assume* they still have stock for that, if they're sending out the appointments :think:

Well I guess they wouldn't be giving first doses of Pfizer if they were short which was why I asked

[Cherie]

Van Tam did coronavirus Q and A on Sky, he said the roll out should not be impacted by second doses and that the plan is realistic going forward but that there can be dips in supply

[Crimson Dynamo]

https://i.dailymail.co.uk/1s/2021/02/24/16/39708230-0-image-m-28_1614185072505.jpg

[Kate!]

I'm having my jab tomorrow afternoon. Hoping to get the pfizer variety.

[AnnieK]

Looks like Germany are back pedalling on the Oxford vaccine with Merkel now telling citizens to accept it.

[AnnieK]

I'm having my jab tomorrow afternoon. Hoping to get the pfizer variety.

Why do you want the pfizer?

[Cherie]

Looks like Germany are back pedalling on the Oxford vaccine with Merkel now telling citizens to accept it.

Macron should come out and apologise for his remarks and his disrespect to the scientists

[arista]

[People vaccinated up to and including 23 February 2021

First dose: 18,242,873

Second dose: 669,105]

https://coronavirus.data.gov.uk/

[Vanessa]

Amazing. We're finally getting somewhere!

[Kate!]

Why do you want the pfizer?

I think it sounds the most effective. What do you think Annie? Xx

[Vanessa]

I think it sounds the most effective. What do you think Annie? Xx

The Oxford vaccine is good as well.
Both give good protection

[Cherie]

I think it sounds the most effective. What do you think Annie? Xx

In the recent study out of Scotland Pfizer came out below AZ in effectiveness 90% compared to 95%

so either or

[AnnieK]

I think it sounds the most effective. What do you think Annie? Xx

Ah, I see. I would imagine they are both the same. I would not be bothered...they can give me what they want. I just want one hehe

[Zizu]

Van Tam did coronavirus Q and A on Sky, he said the roll out should not be impacted by second doses and that the plan is realistic going forward but that there can be dips in supply



I though he was very impressive this morning ... I wish him , Chris and Sir Patrick and a few others were in charge of the country !!

[Zizu]

I'm having my jab tomorrow afternoon. Hoping to get the pfizer variety.



Fingers crossed !


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[Nicky91]

Netherlands total of vaccinated people

(first dose) 795.326

(second dose) 218.713


most vaccinated are care workers and 80+ who don't live in care homes but by themselves

[Nicky91]

not much compared to UK of course but we're slowly getting there i guess

most of vaccinations were done with Pfizer and Moderna btw for more information

[Ammi]

All vaccine’d up...well partly, obviously :p

Feel fine and dandy right now.

...:lovedup:...amazing...I’ve just ticked your name off the list of people to worry about...:hug:...

[Zizu]

...:lovedup:...amazing...I’ve just ticked your name off the list of people to worry about...:hug:...



Oye.... I do all the worrying around here !

;)


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[Cherie]

Israel has now vaccinated 85% of its population

They set up vaccination centres in bars and clubs and offered younger vaccine hesitants a shot for a shot, what a great idea :laugh:

[Cherie]

I though he was very impressive this morning ... I wish him , Chris and Sir Patrick and a few others were in charge of the country !!

JVT is always reassuring as is Chris Whitty and Patrick Vallance tbf, they know their stuff

[Ammi]

Oye.... I do all the worrying around here !

;)


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...you so deserve a little break, Zizu...you haven’t been ticked off that list just quite yet...:laugh:..I’m so pleased that you’ve had your first vaccine, though...:hug:..at least you can tick that one thing off...go on, just do it, cross it off and take that one layer away so that you can make room for another to replace it...:laugh:..

[Nicky91]

Israel has now vaccinated 85% of its population

They set up vaccination centres in bars and clubs and offered younger vaccine hesitants a shot for a shot, what a great idea :laugh:

yes i saw that on tuesday evening in germany's talk show Markus Lanz on ZDF

some of Markus's guests that evening, one virologist (whom is a close friend of Dr Fauci) he said the nation should vaccinate as much people as we can with every pfizer dose we currently got, something they can do until CureVac hopefully soon receives the green light

+ all guests there confirmed that Germany must follow Israel's approach as for vaccination program


also was highlighted that with vaccination passport movie theatres would be able to reopen again, music festivals would be possible again, more or less normal life returning, the guests (and all of them either medical or scientific experts) also said it might be a passport but this one can be seen as your ticket to all your freedom and normal life which makes this a very valuable piece of paperwork

[Cherie]

yes i saw that on tuesday evening in germany's talk show Markus Lanz on ZDF

some of Markus's guests that evening, one virologist (whom is a close friend of Dr Fauci) he said the nation should vaccinate as much people as we can with every pfizer dose we currently got, something they can do until CureVac hopefully soon receives the green light

+ all guests there confirmed that Germany must follow Israel's approach as for vaccination program


also was highlighted that with vaccination passport movie theatres would be able to reopen again, music festivals would be possible again, more or less normal life returning, the guests (and all of them either medical or scientific experts) also said it might be a passport but this one can be seen as your ticket to all your freedom and normal life which makes this a very valuable piece of paperwork

I think vaccine hesitancy will go out the window as it will be required for normal life to resume, so even though the vaccine isn't mandatory it kind of is if you see what I mean

[AnnieK]

Its being reported in some papers today that both France and Germany are telling their citizens now that they should accept the Oxford vaccine to avoid a third wave.....Macron needs to admit to spreading misinformation if he wants to repair the damage he did to the takeup of Oxford

[Nicky91]

Its being reported in some papers today that both France and Germany are telling their citizens now that they should accept the Oxford vaccine to avoid a third wave.....Macron needs to admit to spreading misinformation if he wants to repair the damage he did to the takeup of Oxford

Germany now got more information on Oxford/AZ thx to the scottish research, just what they wanted since there were some uncertainties at first

so now they got AZ, Pfizer and soon CureVac i think so thats 3


France idk, maybe they heard this news too via EU :think:

[AnnieK]

Germany now got more information on Oxford/AZ thx to the scottish research, just what they wanted since there were some uncertainties at first

so now they got AZ, Pfizer and soon CureVac i think so thats 3


France idk, maybe they heard this news too via EU :think:

Well, fingers crossed the damage is not irreparable and they start ramping up their vaccinations now. :fc:

[Cherie]

35.5% adults had first dose now

1.1% second dose

Wheres Kate :worry:

[user104658]

Yes I have been thinking this too tbh. There will eventually be a varient that is totally vaccine resistant. Isn't something like that how the likes of MRSA and such started..and why doctors are reluctant to prescribe antibitotics, as all that will happen with overuse, is that it will mutate to find ways around the medication?

We realy need a vaccine that stops you getting it fullstop.

That said, they are doing the best with what they can.It's not exactly the same really, antibiotics attack bacterial infections directly whereas a vaccine "teaches" the immune system how to fight a virus itself. I think theoretically, it will always be possible to vaccinate against any viral strain, the problem is more that constantly researching and updating vaccines to roll out year after year is really not ideal. Think of what's gone into orchestrating it just once.

[Vanessa]

Its being reported in some papers today that both France and Germany are telling their citizens now that they should accept the Oxford vaccine to avoid a third wave.....Macron needs to admit to spreading misinformation if he wants to repair the damage he did to the takeup of Oxford

If they want to avoid a third wave they need to get vaccinating people. The EU is way behind.

[Samm]

I need the EU to hurry their arse up! I wanna go visit paris this summer

[Zizu]

I need the EU to hurry their arse up! I wanna go visit paris this summer



Sadly we will never get to see our beautiful boy getting married ... ( his wedding was in Florida 2 weeks ago ) ... and we haven’t even met his wife or her family ..

Crazy times :(


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[Cherie]

Sadly we will never get to see our beautiful boy getting married ... ( his wedding was in Florida 2 weeks ago ) ... and we haven’t even met his wife or her family ..

Crazy times :(


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

oh how sad :sad:

[Cherie]

Macron has just been on TV saying he would take the AZ vaccine

1,000,000 doses of AZ unused in Germany, ship them elsewhere?

Huge Belgian vaccination centre that can vaccinate 5,000 a day empty as they are waiting on vaccine, won't use AZ

[Vanessa]

Macron has just been on TV saying he would take the AZ vaccine

1,000,000 doses of AZ unused in Germany, ship them elsewhere?

Huge Belgian vaccination centre that can vaccinate 5,000 a day empty as they are waiting on vaccine, won't use AZ

If they have a third wave they only have themselves to blame.

[Cherie]

Angela Merkel, the German chancellor has said she will not take the Oxford-AstraZeneca vaccine because at 66 she is older than the upper age limit for it.

The German authorities have not approved the vaccine for people over 65.

Thomas Mertens, head of STIKO, Germany’s standing commission on vaccines, said the country had hoarded 1.4 million vaccine doses because of its reluctance to take jab. He also said that Germany’s refusal to approve the AstraZeneca vaccine for people over 65 was “partially to blame”.

Last month President Macron, the French leader, compounded the reputational damage to AstraZeneca’s vaccine by saying it seemed “quasi-ineffective” for older people.

Only 200 people out of 3,800 turned up for appointments for the AstraZeneca vaccine

[Nicky91]

Macron has just been on TV saying he would take the AZ vaccine

1,000,000 doses of AZ unused in Germany, ship them elsewhere?

Huge Belgian vaccination centre that can vaccinate 5,000 a day empty as they are waiting on vaccine, won't use AZ

no because Germany intends to use them

[Cherie]

no because Germany intends to use them

when though? why not ship them to countries where they will be taken up now?

or turn the vaccination programme round and start with the younger people maybe

[Nicky91]

when though? why not ship them to countries where they will be taken up now?

because they paid for those doses

they are still thinking which age group to give them to, doing more research

[Cherie]

because they paid for those doses

they are still thinking which age group to give them to, doing more research

aren't they approved for up to age 65 in Germany?

[Vanessa]

They just realised that they need the vaccine to get out of this.
After they said that it wasn't safe :facepalm:

[arista]

[People in their 40s first for phase two
of vaccine rollout - no priority
for teachers and police
The government says the next phase
of the vaccine rollout will focus on age groups
rather than occupations.]


https://news.sky.com/story/covid-19-no-priority-for-teachers-and-police-in-next-vaccine-phase-as-it-could-slow-rollout-12229420

[arista]

People vaccinated up to and including 25 February 2021

First dose: 19,177,555

Second dose: 736,037

https://coronavirus.data.gov.uk/

[Cherie]

Do not wreck this now, JVTs stark message

It’s too early to relax even if vaccinated

[Vicky.]

Gavins booked in for next friday now

Not had mine, but am probably about as low risk as they come..despite my experience with covid having me laid up for 2 days, and with an ongoing cough too :laugh:

[Nicky91]

Netherlands: no new vaccinations done today

[Vanessa]

People vaccinated up to and including 25 February 2021

First dose: 19,177,555

Second dose: 736,037

https://coronavirus.data.gov.uk/

Wow, that's amazing! :cheer2:

[Crimson Dynamo]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EvKs9APXIAIAk2T?format=jpg&name=medium

[Zizu]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EvKs9APXIAIAk2T?format=jpg&name=medium



That’s expected anyways though when they’re all staying safe at home and not even getting visitors ?!


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[Vicky.]

That’s expected anyways though when they’re all staying safe at home and not even getting visitors ?!


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...but they have been doing that for months now...if it was that, rather than the vaccine, it wouldn't have taken til now to show

[Vanessa]

...but they have been doing that for months now...if it was that, rather than the vaccine, it wouldn't have taken til now to show

I think it's the vaccine. We have been in lockdown for months and numbers were never this low before.
They only started to come down like this since the vaccine rollout.

[Zizu]

That’s expected anyways though when they’re all staying safe at home and not even getting visitors ?!


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I can kinda see this guy’s point though ..

:)


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[Zizu]

...but they have been doing that for months now...if it was that, rather than the vaccine, it wouldn't have taken til now to show



True


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[Zizu]

I think it's the vaccine. We have been in lockdown for months and numbers were never this low before.

They only started to come down like this since the vaccine rollout.



True


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[Cherie]

Youngest son had his yesterday, no issues apart from sore arm, so another one checked off the list :love:

[AnnieK]

Youngest sin had his yesterday, no issues apart from sore arm, so another one checked off the list :love:

Good to hear Cherie :love:

[Ammi]

...:love:..we know they’re being done very quickly etc and it’s all encouraging news...but especially lovely of when we hear of someone beginning that first stage of stepping toward ‘freedom’...

[arista]

[People vaccinated up to and including 27 February 2021

First dose: 20,089,551

Second dose: 796,132]

https://coronavirus.data.gov.uk/

[Vanessa]

We're getting there.
Can't wait for summer now. I want to go to the seaside :dance:

[arista]

https://ichef.bbci.co.uk/news/976/cpsprodpb/162E5/production/_117335809_metro-nc.png

[arista]

We're getting there.
Can't wait for summer now. I want to go to the seaside :dance:


All seasides will get busy
I would keep a good mask on outside

[Vanessa]

All seasides will get busy
I would keep a good mask on outside

Yes definitely. I'll bring it with me. :hee:

[Vicky.]

https://ichef.bbci.co.uk/news/976/cpsprodpb/162E5/production/_117335809_metro-nc.png

If they arent using it, just bloody give it to the poorer countries. Like, we are going t have to pool together and help them anyway really..no point letting it go to waste as there are sudden concerns, saying it might not be the best idea to give vaccines that seem rather likely to give side effects to a few people, to 95 year old cancer patients as the side effects could be more deadly than covid potentially (probably unlikely, on reflection but..my mother in law didnt even know she had covid, then got ill from the vacine fr a short time so definitely possible). I am not sure why thats news, like..it was not a good idea..and is almost impossble to monitor too including such high age groups, who could have died of a few things, could be the side effects, could not..like with that age group, I am sorry but its so up in the air for most, with any illness or potential treatment/meds/whatever, we need to admit that really. It seems to be much shouting about 'the over 60s' but the vast majority of over 60s will be fine, even if they DO get fluey symptoms for a day or two which seems about the worst of it?!

Like yeah, basically your average 100 year old might not handle a day or 2 of diarrhea well, shock horror. But, your average 60 year old potentially induces 2 days of bad stomach every weekend when allowed to by drinking or..other things! :joker:

Mixing in 'the over 60s' with the most in danger people on the planet really, at any stage, covid or no covid..is quite daft but seems to be happening a lot, totally illogical groupings for stuff? This appears to be behind a lot of the antivaxxing sentiment actually...this purposeful fudging between the extremely very very vulnerable very elderly or very ill population, with 'the over 60s' as if they are the same. They aren't..while the latter group includes the former, thats not to say the risks are anywhere near the bloody same. Yet on and on the media go...reminds me a bit of when they appeared to be trying to scare younger people into complying with restrictions actually..so it took quite some time for readily available figures on the acual demographic thats in danger here, to come out in the mainstream. Instead it was a barrage of 'X died from covid, only 20 and FIT!!!!' and stuff. I half blame the media reaction and OTT catastrophizing for many of the covid conspiracy crap really. I can sort f (if I squint hard enough and have a whiskey first) see why some assume its all a lie, based on the obvious manipulation that can often be proven easily, by a few secnds online. I find 'its fake' to be an extreme reaction to media manipulation though, I have to say. Much more likely to have a 'media is doing what media does, irresponsibly IMO during the pandemic, but never the less, doing whats expected and will see their copies sold...but they are constantly being total dementors right now, so I will look at actual stats/hospital records, etc, instead of taking the media as gospel.' reaction though myself, seems more logical than assuming its all just made up, for seemingly no reason. Plausible? :p

A family member of a friend is actually thinking of taking action against their local rag (luckily it did not hit any of the bigger papers..that would be a hell of a fight in court eh..) I think it was, as they used their young teens death to be a 'stay at home' thing, when he actually killed himself because of the restrictions (obviously not just because of that as suicide is never really about one thing and its quite irresponsible to make out it is according to the samaritans, but that seemed the 'trigger' as it were, there were issues before). It was worded vaguely, really, but most would read it as died OF covid, commentors were saying that off the back of it, on the whole. She says its the purposeful angling of it she dislikes most..and also fears making them retract could inspire suicides. Long story short, despite this being a life story seemingly..was her that got me so interested in samaritans guidelines about suicide, and basically, even reporting on a suicide in the area, can inspire more, its often almost social contagion they say, hence all the hell on about 13 reasons why 'suicide baiting'. Apparently pretty much any mention of suicide, especially around vulnerable people (or giving specific details, like the reasons given, or method and such), is like a rag to a bull :S

The above para was not me trying to minimise the risks or anything. I do know it seems luck of the draw and some people, some very young and fit, have died, seemingly randomly at times. I can acknowledge the risk, while also thinking the media have behaved more twatty than usual and have fueled a LOT of the panic aroud this topic, the panic buying for sure, the hugely irrational fear so many friends seem t have, about being about t drop dead the second they leave their house, despite being like..mid twenties, fit as a fiddle, and so on...potentially the panic over vaccines too. Though interestingly, that seems to have, among those I know, came from the LACK of media reporting about the actual likely side effects/how many are actually getting them, along with the claim..and not sure if this is true but seen it said,,that theres been no publicising death rates from the vaccine either. I cannot believe we finally have a vaccine that won't kill anyone, and I have sympathy with the press there as they cannot d right for ding wrong really. Admit some are dying (mainly VERY old and frail though, which does matter with the topic really. And face cries of 'you are scaring people away from it' 'antivaxxer!!!' or, dont report and look bad. Rock and hard place with some stuff, but the mainstream reporting has been dire, and almost even the total opposite at times to what the actual numbers were saying :S

So to me, common sense approach. Which would definitely mean get on with using the vaccines you have, or risk just chucking them when thats so bad for everyone really. IF you are worried about it, give it to others who will put it to good use, no need in wasting, especially now!

TLDR as this has gone on a bit...give them out or give them away. And press, reign it in ffs. I swear the only fitting word for so many of them through this is...dementors.

Yes definitely. I'll bring it with me. :hee:

If it makes you feel safer then no reason not to. I can see loads keeping on with the mask thing even when its not needed. Makes a lot of sense really, if..for example..you have to go to work with a cold or something..stop spreading it about. I think if you are wearing it for your own peace of mind though, its worth getting a proper one rather than a cloth one? Will touch on this later but it seems the cloth ones offer minimal (if any) protection for the wearer, and apparently some things, like snoods I think it was, could potentially make you MORE at risk not less. Am personally not convinced masks are the magic bullet that some seem to think, and evidence is sketchy (and yes, there seems to be some 'both sides' and not even sure whats fake or biased or whatever either) but in short..I cannot see them making things worse aslong as the wearer is not being a dick and expecting a cloth mask to give them protection to lean in someone elses space and cough, or something...assming a basic level of sense when I say that, that seems lacking in a few of the public from what I have seen tbf. And they can potentially make things better though we cannot really prove it (I wouldnt necessarily say masks/distancing/measures basically eradictating flu is a good thing either, though I can see why some would think that, especially given the death numbers this year generally speaking...if we had had a 'normal' flu season ontop it would have been horrendous) I think if its worked that well on flu, its chance to have worked quite well on covid also (though apparently they spread VERY differently. But logic does kind of say, given theres been so little (other) illness this year, chances are the measures have also impacted covid fairly heavily :p Bloody hell, proofreading that before posting even though will have errors anyway, and my god, that was a longwinded way of saying, get a mask that actually protects you as am not too convinced on most masks ability to keep YOU safe, rather than 'just' those around you.

Read some huge paper thing that said with flu you can expect every person to infect 2 more or something, and thats what the modelling early in the pandemic was based on. Said thats why they were so off..basically. As apparently SARS spreads in...clusters rather than every person infecting a few others? So covid spread has been basically a huge, international superspreader event..with loads spreading at the same time. Memory says 1/10 people are expected to infect like..near all the others who are infected too. Came across like..if you have 10 people with flu, the average will spread it to 2 people and it will be about even spread, as such, spread could be tracked with test and trace. Apparently test and trace fell at the first hurdle as...10 people with covid, 9 will probably not pass it to anyone. 1 will infect 20 people (numbers off and made up), the theory was that test and trace as we were ding it was backwards, as you dont want to forward contact trace, what you need to do is look for cluster outbreaks, and find out where they came from, then quarantine that person who started the cluster by quarantining every person who was there at the time of the cluster...made so much sense (and was backed up with much SARS related studies and such too) but I may be explaining wrong. I can try and find the paper thing if anyones interested and am not just waffling into nothing for arista to say 'thank you wise vicky' or something, then ignored :D I remember it made so much make sense to me. Even the likes of how some countries/areas were hit much harder, seemingly randomly, and how some countries who got a quick lid on it managed to stay that way (backwards tracing)



IF we could feasibly 'get rid of noro' I would literally pay any amount, I would save for life to be able to never see that thing again believe me, unfortunately, while its been good having no illnesses all year...I see a disaster waiting to happen really once things 'open' properly and theres proper mixing outside of hospitals/work..as an aside, covid secure is such bollocks. Some places you can make it 'safer', or a few inches more spread out which will technically help I guess, but the things being classed as 'secure' have been quite pitiful from the start. Some bars I saw did REALLY good mind, and went above and beyond the usual guidelines and I did feel much 'safer' there, though 'safety' I think is...silly to ask when you are going to the pub for a drink really. Seems a bit daft to me, to expect the staff to baby you in such a way, when you are knowingly taking a risk? Might be in the minority there though. Seems too much mucking on, for the sake of a few centimeters in asome cases. Which theoretically will help with distancing, but not really. Our local chippy declared itself totally covid secure, IIRC actually went to the point of saying that noone will ever catch covid here (which seemed a nightmare waiting to happen but its a little town, they may have got away with it!) and all they had done, was put some tape on the floor, showing the way to go in..god knows why they switched the usual entrance and exit at the same time, so you can imagine how well that went. I have yet to see anyone be told to stay to the lines or go the right way either, so yeah, thats covid secure apparently :laugh:

Until we have a universal vaccine for all nasty bugs which am almost sure will never happen, I do think we should expect a LOT of illnesses this coming year mind. I mean, even after 6 weeks off school...my kids almost always catch at least 3 bugs in their first month or so back, once mixing with other kids again..I think a lot of people underestimate how gross so many kids actually are. As a way t try and explain this, at this point I will let the forum know that only 2 weeks back, I had to tell my son to stop licking the inside of his sisters nose man...and she was giggling away letting him too. And this is while they also are aware to be more hygienic than usual!

Basically this is...a years worth of carefulness and extra cleaning...and it probably (most likely tbh) doesnt work this way, but I kind of picture a dam about to break, with illnesses (not covid, dont worry!) behind it, ready to sweep the country. This is along with my doomsday prediction of some alcohol/sanitizer/soap resistant superbug appearing in the near future..which I REALLY hope I am wrong about but my NHS mother put it in my head months back and I have been worried since really. Bundle of joy this morning eh... :joker:

I am genuinely wondering if noro does go round as I am dreading. Question I am wondering is while death numbers are being kept in the press, will noro death rates be mentioned? Or will it remain covid only.. I am not meaning that from a 'covid is not that bad' kind of view, though I know its usually said that way, my reason for asking is basically..the carehome besides my dad had an outbrea of noro a few years back, and staff said 8 of the residents actually died. There was 'reportedly' a huge outbreak on the maternity ward in our local round about the time I was due to have skye, I only remember it as it scared the crap out of me and everyone kept saying 'its ONLY noro...its fine!' which really put me in a rage..when I went in that outbreak was gone like, but the nurses kept going on about sme young mother who had died because of it, and another who was in intensive care...lack of fluids apparently, which culd happen anyway if severe, but was likely linked to blood loss/exhaustion too I think coz it sounded like she had such a rough ride in general (was told that bit by other women on ward, not staff..when I was whinging about 30 hour labour, being denied drugs/admission despite obvious progress and stuff, being cut without them actually asking, and stitches resulting from that, they told me a REAL horror story to shut me up I think!) So...even illnesses that are just kinda annoying to most (horror to me, with emetphbia though, literally my worst nighmare and maybe why am focussing on it so much now) are deadly as **** to carehomes, and some areas in hospitals it seems. The year my gran died (so like 4 years back maybe) flu finished off 3 of the residents over winter :( I used to get a bit depressed when the staff would tell us stuff like that...they are so so frail, its terrifying really.

Anecdotally, a friend who works in the NHS(admin, not frontline) has been suffering with a mask for a while and now has a sicknote basically stating its a reasonable adjustment to give her own office, or allow no mask in some other way, or allow her to work from home (they had her homeworking for the first month or so, but now its 'not possible' which she finds odd as apparently they all got a lot of praise for how well it was going and were tld productivity was UP..where I would have thought the opposite would happen really, like, so many I knew 'worked from home' but spent the days in the garden drinking and sunbathing, while answering the occasional call, actually started assuming that was the norm, but of course people/sectors will be different)...and since that, in 2 months not sure if its bad timing or anything (think I may be suffering confirmation bias, and looking too much into this though, as I remain convinced this year wil be a very ill one for a lot), but shes had 2 colds, and a sickness bug :S You wouldnt think masks make that much difference, especially to the wearer (been touted for ages you wear a mask to protect others..incase anyone starts (exception n95 I think? Which protect wearer and others), as have had this SO many times on facebook.) but...from my huge data pile of...1...I have decided I am indeed right and we will have a constant runny nose and bad tummy, prob from about may onwards! If it doesnt happen, its a bonus at this stage, I have worked myself up so much..


Lowkey expecting TS to pick me up on where am remembering the SARS/flu spreading stuff wrong though, as he seems tibbs resident scientist recently, on covid stuff anyways :laugh:

TLDR; like most? Get a mask that protects you if it makes you feel better, dont rely on cloth ones if you are worried about being next to people outdoors, random illness filled year doomsday rant and probably broken/misremembered science and waffle. No point as such, besides hoping vanessa enjoys her day at the beach! :D

[Vicky.]

****s sake, the size of that post...have been trying to do it for over an hour now and...what a wall of text :umm2:

[smudgie]

****s sake, the size of that post...have been trying to do it for over an hour now and...what a wall of text :umm2:

Well worth it Vicky.
A bloody good read.

[Vicky.]

Well worth it Vicky.
A bloody good read.

Haha glad someone did, thanks..

I ate when I get all soapboxy and put walls and walls and always kind of stress that noone at all will answer :laugh: Not that it matters, but the small things seem to..very odd on here :p

[smudgie]

I can totally understand your worry about going into hospital to have Skye.
Docs wanted me in about 15 months ago after 4 months of antibiotics failed to sort my leg out.
Anyhow I refused, and they continued with more antibiotics, we manage to dress the leg ourselves so no need for hospital, and it cleared up not long after.

[Ammi]

...I’ve just read you post, Vicky..(...because you incredibly took that time to make it with stuff going around in your thoughts...:love:..)...I’ll need to absorb it a bit more and maybe re-read, which it deserves...but as great as your thoughts always are, I really wish I could see you sleep more and your head to have a little rest...

...anyway...

...just going back to one bit and the suicide of a family friend’s child...I’m so very, very sorry...:hug:...I’ve always felt and said and experienced myself that not everyone has lived the same COVID and lockdown etc...one particular thing that happened on a family/pupil video call in the first lockdown, is something that will be there forever with me...the mental stress/anxiety for some has been horrific and I think, very long lasting into futures and I fear, will ‘mould’ some lives in terms of future mental health, also....and my big fear also, is that funding won’t allow for enough health care for the ‘mental fallout’ of these times we’re experiences and what some families have gone through...all too, too sad...


...(...please try to rest your thoughts a little, though and get more sleep...)...

[bots]

i do agree with Vicky. Misinformation ferments distrust. and we have had misinformation from scientists, the government and the media. The media have an awful lot to answer for and when the inquiry finally happens, i hope their role in it all is highlighted too. I have always had a certain contempt for the media, but they have been several levels worse during this pandemic

[user104658]

The absolute worst of the media in terms of the pandemic has been flipping from "Reeeee the virus! Stupid government saying go out when people are getting sick!" straight to "Reeeee the lockdown! Stupid government telling us to stay home when mental health is suffering" as soon as one or the other is in effect.

I'm no fan of the govt response in general and it's a nuanced topic and a balancing act between physical and mental health effects, yes, but where is that nuanced discussion in the press? They just flop from one extreme to the other... It's almost like gaslighting.

[arista]

****s sake, the size of that post...have been trying to do it for over an hour now and...what a wall of text :umm2:


Nice of you to bless us,
with that.

[Cherie]

I haven't had the opportunity to read war and peace yet, but I will :laugh:

The situation with the vaccines in the EU needs addressing swiftly though, it was only three weeks ago Bojo was being urged to stop vaccinating once the over 50s were complete and hand over surplus to poorer countries

[Vanessa]

I haven't had the opportunity to read war and peace yet, but I will :laugh:

The situation with the vaccines in the EU needs addressing swiftly though, it was only three weeks ago Bojo was being urged to stop vaccinating once the over 50s were complete and hand over surplus to poorer countries

Some of them don't want the vaccine.
I think they should donate it to those countries who can't afford it.

[Cherie]

Some of them don't want the vaccine.
I think they should donate it to those countries who can't afford it.

yeah I mean I get it given what has been said by Macron etc, though he seems at odds with the EMA over that, but they need to ship them on, it's unlikely the public will change their mind I think

[bots]

there is a huge logistical challenge getting pizer and moderna vaccines to remote locations with the temperature requirements. Astra Zenica is already manufacturing the oxford vaccine world wide so, the whole thing will look completely different come the summer when production is scaled up properly

[Vicky.]

The absolute worst of the media in terms of the pandemic has been flipping from "Reeeee the virus! Stupid government saying go out when people are getting sick!" straight to "Reeeee the lockdown! Stupid government telling us to stay home when mental health is suffering" as soon as one or the other is in effect.

I'm no fan of the govt response in general and it's a nuanced topic and a balancing act between physical and mental health effects, yes, but where is that nuanced discussion in the press? They just flop from one extreme to the other... It's almost like gaslighting.

Almost?! Its the very definition of gaslighting really to me. They have behaved atrociously. I mean, anger and fear sells papers so I 'get it' but there has not been an ounce of..well sense in all of the bloody wailing about the end being nigh if things close. Then claiming the end was not nigh, but it is if we lockdown. Then going on about some mutant strain thats s serious and deadly and new, yet the tracking sites had it....7 months back? Bugger off! Just a bit of balance was sorely needed, from even one of the major publications, but nope.

I have a friend who is about as low risk as they come, and is totally convinced she will drop dead from stepping out of her door. Shes had all her 'news' from the mainstream press..mainly bbc news apparently, and daily star/mirror (have told her thats not a good...spread before. She seems to think thats a right wing and a left wing source and will not be told otherwise :eek: ) She showed no signs of mental issues before this, like, ever. I know it can seem to come from nowhere...but I really do think her current anxiety disorder is 100% caused by believing scaremongering nonsense basically. Like, to show how odd this is...shes 21, very social media obsessed...she cut off her internet like 5 months back as she read that people were trying to pretend covid was not dangerous online?! Thats just bizarre behaviour to me. Even if some were saying that, cutting off your net about it is..not rational at all in response surely?! Am genuinely so so worried about her, and last I heard, her mam tried to go round to check and was basically refused in, and refused being spoken to as shes been written off as a 'covid denier'...because...she has not turned total hermit for an illness with a low mortality rate, and also while she actively is still working anyway! The daughters 'logic' right now is her mum is in massive danger and is making it worse, by conitnuing going to work, instead of quitting her job to hide. Its like..some alternate reality is going on with some people, it really is. Such whims are not possible for most adults. And I am really starting t think its not the doctors she needs, its sectioned for a bit. Might sound harsh, but I really think shes a risk to herself, not others but herself with HOW panicky shes getting over such tiny things that are almost insignificant to many?!

[Vicky.]

i do agree with Vicky. Misinformation ferments distrust. and we have had misinformation from scientists, the government and the media. The media have an awful lot to answer for and when the inquiry finally happens, i hope their role in it all is highlighted too. I have always had a certain contempt for the media, but they have been several levels worse during this pandemic

So much rationale from those who seem to believe the (obvious nonsense really) conspiracy theories about it all being fake and that...I really can see how they got to the point of not trusting anything they read/heard. There has been a steady stream of misinformation for like a year now, just tapping away. Its easy to see why people turn to 'alternate sources' really.

Other conspiracy theories often shoved into the same bracket, STILL include anyone saying they think theres even a tiny possibility, that it could have been a lab leak. I guess thats maybe 'the opposite end' of the problem in a way, as..not sure if its me spending too long online thinking but..that one genuinely seems so plausible to me. Infact, it seems more likely that other explanations I have heard, about cross species, perfect storm, etc. I think being labelled a 'covid denier' forviews such as the above is kind of counterprductive? Hell, I was called a denier for questioning if it was time to end lockdown. Thats not a bloody denier to me?! Militant, battlegrunds drawn stuff like that just pushes people further to the extremes really. Accuse people of being a denier, chances are they might look up the arguments, and honestly, a few I have seen are semi believable if you were already kind of in the mindset for a huge scandal, if that makes sense. A lot of conformation bias searching would probably happen. But..its easy to see why the extreme factions appear to be growing really :S

My dad said a while back, it will be 50 years before 'the truth' is all there really. So it seems, I shall pass on the baton to Skye/James, as I plan to be LONG gone by then thanks!

[Zizu]

I must say all this news of the Brazilian variant being ‘somewhere’ in the uk very unsettling ... it apparently spreads like wildfire and there’s thousands of people in Brazil who got the Brazilian one AFTER they’d already suffered with the original Covid months previously .

That basically suggests that everyone can potentially get the Brazilian one now ( apart from MAYBE the folk who’ve had a vaccine-as they’re HOPING the vaccines will give some protection)




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[Cherie]

I must say all this news of the Brazilian variant being ‘somewhere’ in the uk very unsettling ... it apparently spreads like wildfire and there’s thousands of people in Brazil who got the Brazilian one AFTER they’d already suffered with the original Covid months previously .

That basically suggests that everyone can potentially get the Brazilian one now ( apart from MAYBE the folk who’ve had a vaccine-as they’re HOPING the vaccines will give some protection)




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so was news of the SA variant tbf and that has died off now

[Vicky.]

I must say all this news of the Brazilian variant being ‘somewhere’ in the uk very unsettling ... it apparently spreads like wildfire and there’s thousands of people in Brazil who got the Brazilian one AFTER they’d already suffered with the original Covid months previously .

That basically suggests that everyone can potentially get the Brazilian one now ( apart from MAYBE the folk who’ve had a vaccine-as they’re HOPING the vaccines will give some protection)



This is going to sound a bit odd, but news of more contagious strains actually makes me a bit hopeful. Viruses tend to mutate to be more spreadable but less dangerous, apparently this is basically down to their sole purpose in life is to spread to as many hosts as possible. Assuming covid behaves as other viruses do..that would kind of be a great thing. I was challenged on this, IIRC last time I said it and told it takes hundreds of years for this to happen or something, but..that stuck in my head and I asked a qualified mate (who told me all the mutation crap in the first place, while I sat fascinated for hours) who reckons these changes CAN be quite quick. Says it wont 'turn into something like seasonal flu' as such quickly, but its entirely normal for viruses to mutate quickly to be easily spread but less dangerous. Reckons if a strain takes prominence, and is more contagious but safer, its better all round, and on balance that sounds about right really. (Also does not believe Boris claiming the xmas strain was 20% more deadly aswell as more easily spread, and thinks that was boris covering his own arse for his ****show of rules changing and free for all on xmas day, again, seems plausible really :laugh: )

I really do feel, and will stay this way until they tell me otherwise, that this 'new mutation' stuff is..scaremongering. It was VERY noticeable to me, the way mutations were barely even mentioned until the vaccine was done. Then suddenly, mutations everywhere, omg they might make the vaccine pointless! When, mutations have been all over from the start realistically. I might be wrong, but it really does come across as a kind of..project fear thing (haha, I didnt believe that was a thing, when it was around..I get it now!), a backup plan even, for if they do feel the need to put lockdown back/halt opening.

I think part of my mistrust comes from months of actual clear and obvious scaremongering though. Even 'the scientists' have done it, though obviously not as often as the media, or the government. I especially hate the 'new way' of floating controversial ideas in the press then deciding on them based on reaction. Like, thats a horrific way to run a country. They might nt be doing that, being very generous, but it really really looks like they are and its happened too many times for me to write off as coincidence now

You really would think there would be at least some..not conclusive..but some data on if the vaccines reduce transmission though. A few of the 'mutations' have been claimed to be possibly resistant...weeks back some, yet still nothing? Even basically very rough data, is better than this bloody limbo situation. Vaccines have been going for months. I assume, they found it reduces transmission to some degree, but they don't know how much. Even saying just that, is better than the silence. IF it doesnt reduce transmission (I remain cautiously optomistic on that one really...not sure) they also need to be bloody honest and just say it doesn't look hopeful.

[Zizu]

so was news of the SA variant tbf and that has died off now



I don’t recall any suggestions that the SA variant was effecting thousands of people who’d already had the original Covid ...


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[user104658]

Current daily infections graphs suggest that there's a very strong probability that vaccination is driving down infection rates but it's too early to say that conclusively, since it's not really possible to identify exactly who someone has caught a virus from (so you can't say for sure, "oh he got it from Bob but Bob is vaccinated").

They'd have to do broad-scale follow up random testing on asymptomatic vaccinated people, to see if any actually have undetected Covid, and then test to see if those people have a high enough viral load to actually be contagious (since its not as simple as saying "if you have it you can spread it" either)

[Cherie]

I don’t recall any suggestions that the SA variant was effecting thousands of people who’d already had the original Covid ...


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Tbh I have stopped following it all closely so I don’t know, is this in Brazil?

[Zizu]

This is going to sound a bit odd, but news of more contagious strains actually makes me a bit hopeful. Viruses tend to mutate to be more spreadable but less dangerous, apparently this is basically down to their sole purpose in life is to spread to as many hosts as possible. Assuming covid behaves as other viruses do..that would kind of be a great thing. I was challenged on this, IIRC last time I said it and told it takes hundreds of years for this to happen or something, but..that stuck in my head and I asked a qualified mate (who told me all the mutation crap in the first place, while I sat fascinated for hours) who reckons these changes CAN be quite quick. Says it wont 'turn into something like seasonal flu' as such quickly, but its entirely normal for viruses to mutate quickly to be easily spread but less dangerous. Reckons if a strain takes prominence, and is more contagious but safer, its better all round, and on balance that sounds about right really. (Also does not believe Boris claiming the xmas strain was 20% more deadly aswell as more easily spread, and thinks that was boris covering his own arse for his ****show of rules changing and free for all on xmas day, again, seems plausible really :laugh: )

I really do feel, and will stay this way until they tell me otherwise, that this 'new mutation' stuff is..scaremongering. It was VERY noticeable to me, the way mutations were barely even mentioned until the vaccine was done. Then suddenly, mutations everywhere, omg they might make the vaccine pointless! When, mutations have been all over from the start realistically. I might be wrong, but it really does come across as a kind of..project fear thing (haha, I didnt believe that was a thing, when it was around..I get it now!), a backup plan even, for if they do feel the need to put lockdown back/halt opening.

I think part of my mistrust comes from months of actual clear and obvious scaremongering though. Even 'the scientists' have done it, though obviously not as often as the media, or the government. I especially hate the 'new way' of floating controversial ideas in the press then deciding on them based on reaction. Like, thats a horrific way to run a country. They might nt be doing that, being very generous, but it really really looks like they are and its happened too many times for me to write off as coincidence now

You really would think there would be at least some..not conclusive..but some data on if the vaccines reduce transmission though. A few of the 'mutations' have been claimed to be possibly resistant...weeks back some, yet still nothing? Even basically very rough data, is better than this bloody limbo situation. Vaccines have been going for months. I assume, they found it reduces transmission to some degree, but they don't know how much. Even saying just that, is better than the silence. IF it doesnt reduce transmission (I remain cautiously optomistic on that one really...not sure) they also need to be bloody honest and just say it doesn't look hopeful.



I can understand where you’re coming from and hopefully you’re correct about it being possibly less dangerous whilst being maybe more contagious.


Sadly I was listening to the radio at the time and they reported that Public Health England where supposedly very concerned and suggested it could easily effect the ‘road map’ plans ...

Then Sky News was live at a major vaccine centre where they were reporting that the centre was only working at 20% due to a shortage of the vaccines... then added that next week the original people would be turning up to have their second dose .

I just worry


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[Zizu]

Tbh I have stopped following it all closely so I don’t know, is this in Brazil?



Sorry yes ... as reported by Sky this morning


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[Vicky.]

Current daily infections graphs suggest that there's a very strong probability that vaccination is driving down infection rates but it's too early to say that conclusively, since it's not really possible to identify exactly who someone has caught a virus from (so you can't say for sure, "oh he got it from Bob but Bob is vaccinated").

They'd have to do broad-scale follow up random testing on asymptomatic vaccinated people, to see if any actually have undetected Covid, and then test to see if those people have a high enough viral load to actually be contagious (since its not as simple as saying "if you have it you can spread it" either)
Well tbh it seemed to make sense it would affect transmission to some degree. Especially if it lowers severe risk by lowering viral load in some way? Kind of assumed it worked that way given the emphasis on viral loads throughout all this. Seems pretty unanimous that viral load influences how ill you are..

Your post makes it seem very much like more data is out too on the asymptomatic spreader thing? Like, I genuinely hope so as the way teachers are being treat is nothing short of criminal, BUT if the data basically says people who dont get symptoms are not (generally, I know they cannot say for sure) dangerous, then the decision to brand schools as 'safe' again makes a little sense at least.

I can understand where you’re coming from and hopefully you’re correct about it being possibly less dangerous whilst being maybe more contagious.


Sadly I was listening to the radio at the time and they reported that Public Health England where supposedly very concerned and suggested it could easily effect the ‘road map’ plans ...

Then Sky News was live at a major vaccine centre where they were reporting that the centre was only working at 20% due to a shortage of the vaccines... then added that next week the original people would be turning up to have their second dose .

I just worry


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My cousins wife just got her vaccine cancelled due to 'lack of appointments'. A few in the area are, but that reason is kind of nonsense to me, as they HAD appointments that were then cancelled? If there were no appintments, they wouldn't have got one? A vaccine shortage makes more sense really..and would also make sense why its hushed up if its that so as not to panic the masses, so even if thats rumour, thanks, settled something in my head at least!

[Vicky.]

http://medanthroquarterly.org/2020/06/05/the-unknown-known-the-sars-past-of-covid-19/

Oh, found the link about the Sars V flu spread thing. Source may be dodgy. Unknown. Checked a few of the studies though when they were mentioned and seems quite sound. Did not check all though. But yeah, this kind of explained a lot of questions for me. Might not be right. But, makes sense!

[user104658]

Well tbh it seemed to make sense it would affect transmission to some degree. Especially if it lowers severe risk by lowering viral load in some way? Kind of assumed it worked that way given the emphasis on viral loads throughout all this. Seems pretty unanimous that viral load influences how ill you are..

Your post makes it seem very much like more data is out too on the asymptomatic spreader thing? Like, I genuinely hope so as the way teachers are being treat is nothing short of criminal, BUT if the data basically says people who dont get symptoms are not (generally, I know they cannot say for sure) dangerous, then the decision to brand schools as 'safe' again makes a little sense at least.


My cousins wife just got her vaccine cancelled due to 'lack of appointments'. A few in the area are, but that reason is kind of nonsense to me, as they HAD appointments that were then cancelled? If there were no appintments, they wouldn't have got one? A vaccine shortage makes more sense really..and would also make sense why its hushed up if its that so as not to panic the masses, so even if thats rumour, thanks, settled something in my head at least!

Being asymptomatic would automatically reduce spread anyway as while you CAN get it from surface contact etc. and it is partially just "in breath", the #1 biggest "spreading risk" is when a contagious person coughs or sneezes and generates droplets. A contagious asymptomatic person won't be coughing or sneezing (as then they wouldn't be asymptomatic...) and so it's far less likely to catch anything from them "in passing". They'd still be a large infection risk for people in long term contact though (people they live with).

[Zizu]

Being asymptomatic would automatically reduce spread anyway as while you CAN get it from surface contact etc. and it is partially just "in breath", the #1 biggest "spreading risk" is when a contagious person coughs or sneezes and generates droplets. A contagious asymptomatic person won't be coughing or sneezing (as then they wouldn't be asymptomatic...) and so it's far less likely to catch anything from them "in passing". They'd still be a large infection risk for people in long term contact though (people they live with).



Interesting .. . Thank you


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[Vicky.]

Being asymptomatic would automatically reduce spread anyway as while you CAN get it from surface contact etc. and it is partially just "in breath", the #1 biggest "spreading risk" is when a contagious person coughs or sneezes and generates droplets. A contagious asymptomatic person won't be coughing or sneezing (as then they wouldn't be asymptomatic...) and so it's far less likely to catch anything from them "in passing". They'd still be a large infection risk for people in long term contact though (people they live with).

Well yeah I logic-ed my way into that early on but didn't realise that there was 'proof' now, unless you are basically saying as its common sense? (which makes the entire question look silly really..as why need proof for something so obvious ffs)

Everyone pretended they had no idea what I meant when I tried to bloody explain my thoughts too. Bastards.

[Cherie]

Vaccinations levels could double towards the end of March as more vaccine comes on stream

BBC

[Cherie]

Hospital admissions in the over 80s have gone down by 80% after one shot of Pfizer or AZ.

[arista]

Vaccinations levels could double towards the end of March as more vaccine comes on stream

BBC



BBC London Local News reported
there is still a high number
from BAME community
not going
to their vaccine appointments

[Crimson Dynamo]

hopefully, we will see this again soon

sQQFjfbWF6M

[arista]

https://ichef.bbci.co.uk/news/976/cpsprodpb/211A/production/_117347480_i-nc.png

[arista]

https://ichef.bbci.co.uk/news/976/cpsprodpb/15F12/production/_117347898_express-nc.png