Game of Thrones Thread

[arista]

Game Of Thrones jokes about Daenerys coffee cup error
https://e3.365dm.com/19/05/768x432/skynews-game-of-thrones-coffee-cup_4661422.jpg?bypass-service-worker&20190507095641

https://news.sky.com/story/game-of-thrones-jokes-about-daenerys-coffee-cup-error-11713594

[user104658]

If Jon doesn't die, I'd say him heading off to live with the free folk in the "true north" is all but a certainty.

I also disagree that it was a bad episode by he way; I think it had its issues in logic and once again timing. It used to take them WHOLE SEASONS to traverse Westeros, which is meant to be comparable in size to the whole of North America, and now they just hop around the map in the space of days! Also the military tactics used to be realistic and the idea that Dany's fleet was just sailing merrily along with no scout ships ahead to check for oh, I dunno, massive naval ambushes hiding around the corner for example... is insane. And Cersei killing Missandrei and then walking off when she had huge dragon-slaying crossbows and archers that could have wiped out Daenery and Drogon there and then, but instead she's like "Yeah I could end this now but nah lol I've decided instead to REALLY PISS OFF the dragon-riding lady and then just let her go on her way". :think:

HOWEVER... I thought it was overall a better episode than both ep1 & 2 :shrug:. I'm still giving it the benefit of the doubt. Though I was saying to th'wife today, I do think it has suffered from losing the guidance of the books. It's not even that it isn't still decent, even good TV... it's that it was something special / exceptional in the early seasons, and now it's JUST a good fantasy TV show.

[user104658]

I also think a lot of blame from book fans is being placed on the show writers not knowing how to wrap things up in a full / proper / satisfying way... When I think that's expecting a lot, consider g its pretty evident at this point that GRR Martin doesn't know how to do it either. He created an epic, sprawling, interwoven tale but with no real plan of how to bring those threads together in the end and that's why his writing has stalled, and why the show is struggling to do it in a complete way.

It's a very common theme in ongoing franchises to be honest. There aren't many that end in a truly satisfying way. Lord of the Rings is a rare example where it does but that's because the underpinning plot device is EXTREMELY simple from start to finish. The series starts with a powerful evil ring, very near the beginning of the story the plan is to destroy it, and at the end of the final book, it gets destroyed. Obviously an oversimplification of everything else that's going on but its still there; that clear, constant, vivid end point. GoT never had one and now that we're... Erm... In the endgame, it's starting to show.

[reece(:]

IfCuarZqJzM

[bots]

Game Of Thrones jokes about Daenerys coffee cup error
https://e3.365dm.com/19/05/768x432/skynews-game-of-thrones-coffee-cup_4661422.jpg?bypass-service-worker&20190507095641

https://news.sky.com/story/game-of-thrones-jokes-about-daenerys-coffee-cup-error-11713594

no one think that this was probably an expensive piece of product advertising? I don't believe for a moment that it wasn't intentional, and its gone viral

[user104658]

https://cdn.dopl3r.com/memes_files/me-sundae-btQzf.jpg

[Adamw92]

I’m so annoyed with where they’re taking Dany’s story arc but if this is what they’re doing then I’m lowkey down for her to just burn Kings Landing to the ground.

[Amy Jade]

If the leakes are real I will be very dissapoited.

[Adamw92]

If the leakes are real I will be very dissapoited.

Same :(

[Scarlett.]

no one think that this was probably an expensive piece of product advertising? I don't believe for a moment that it wasn't intentional, and its gone viral

Well, the cup wasnt from Starbucks, and there is noticeable branding, so, it'd be a pretty bad case of product advertising.

[BBDodge]

If the leakes are real I will be very dissapoited.

There are more "leaks" out now which contradict the earlier "leaks".

Wouldn't put it past HBO to release some fake ones to misdirect people.

Then viewers will be overjoyed that they turn out to be rubbish.

[user104658]

There are more "leaks" out now which contradict the earlier "leaks".

Wouldn't put it past HBO to release some fake ones to misdirect people.

Then viewers will be overjoyed that they turn out to be rubbish.

If you release leaks that an ending is going to be really crap, and then it's only a little bit disappointing, then people will think it was actually good. :think: it's genius.

[Amy Jade]

I hope that is so. I don't like the leaked ending one bit!

[bots]

There are multiple endings that were filmed, but only one will be the reality. It could easily come down to 1 or 2 scenes that were filmed with multiple outcomes, it doesnt need to have been multiple takes of the entire series

[Fetch The Bolt Cutters]

Can someone post the leaks please :cat:

[Niamh.]

Can someone post the leaks please :cat:

In spoilers :oh:

[Daniel.]

Am I the only one who thinks the last season has been great lol

[Niamh.]

Am I the only one who thinks the last season has been great lol

I'm enjoying it :love:

[user104658]

Am I the only one who thinks the last season has been great lol

I'm enjoying it :love:

I'm enjoying it a lot but for me it's like I said above; it's "lost" something that it used to have back in the early seasons. Now it's "just" a great fantasy TV show, whereas at one point it was something really exceptional.

[reece(:]

I'm enjoying it a lot but for me it's like I said above; it's "lost" something that it used to have back in the early seasons. Now it's "just" a great fantasy TV show, whereas at one point it was something really exceptional.

It feels a bit rushed for me, I liked the steadier pacing of the earlier seasons which seemed a bit more thought out.

[user104658]

It feels a bit rushed for me, I liked the steadier pacing of the earlier seasons which seemed a bit more thought out.

That's something I really don't understand as well; they decided to wrap it up because the story was coming to an end and they didn't want it to drag on, when it's one of the most successful TV shows of all time... and there has CLEARLY been enough material for a full two more seasons rather than these 6 longer episodes? They could have devoted an entire season to the battle against the white walkers, and then another entire season to the battle for the throne.

[Scarlett.]

I'm enjoying it a lot but for me it's like I said above; it's "lost" something that it used to have back in the early seasons. Now it's "just" a great fantasy TV show, whereas at one point it was something really exceptional.

Honestly, it just can't be as great as it was, the showrunners aren't GRRM, they never can be, they started GoT by adapting the books, and with the assurances from GRRM that Winds of Winter would be out by now, but instead they've had to write the rest of the story from George's footnotes - a story that GRRM himself may never finish writing.

[Daniel.]

I'm enjoying it a lot but for me it's like I said above; it's "lost" something that it used to have back in the early seasons. Now it's "just" a great fantasy TV show, whereas at one point it was something really exceptional.

I kinda agree it was better earlier but then 6 was probably my favourite season and ep 3 of s8 is my favourite ever

[reece(:]

That's something I really don't understand as well; they decided to wrap it up because the story was coming to an end and they didn't want it to drag on, when it's one of the most successful TV shows of all time... and there has CLEARLY been enough material for a full two more seasons rather than these 6 longer episodes? They could have devoted an entire season to the battle against the white walkers, and then another entire season to the battle for the throne.

I think if they make fewer (6) episodes which are longer it means they can pay actors less per episode and work with the bigger budget - or something along the lines of that.

I'd have liked to see this go to 10 seasons though :(

[Niamh.]

For me Arya killing the NK and turning Gendry down and going off with the hound is a perfect enough end without knowing what the actual end is

[Daniel.]

Also dany going mad hasn’t been confirmed yet so

[bots]

i thoroughly enjoyed the first 3 episodes, the 4th episode was fine in parts but other parts just had zero credibility based on the character development from the past 7 seasons. For the sea change that occurred, there would have to be something that backed it up, and there wasn't. Ok, it's fantasy and all that, but for it to be a powerful vehicle, it has to be believable and at least 25% of episode 4 was completely unbelievable. I want GoT to be good, my standards are high given previous series, and episode 4 fell quite a bit short for me.

[user104658]

i thoroughly enjoyed the first 3 episodes, the 4th episode was fine in parts but other parts just had zero credibility based on the character development from the past 7 seasons. For the sea change that occurred, there would have to be something that backed it up, and there wasn't. Ok, it's fantasy and all that, but for it to be a powerful vehicle, it has to be believable and at least 25% of episode 4 was completely unbelievable. I want GoT to be good, my standards are high given previous series, and episode 4 fell quite a bit short for me.

I think the fleet running into Euron with no prior warning was daft... and also, them stood at the gates of King's Landing and not being shot to pieces with arrows was also daft... and a few major gaffs like that can really damage immersion in a show I feel.

[bots]

I think the fleet running into Euron with no prior warning was daft... and also, them stood at the gates of King's Landing and not being shot to pieces with arrows was also daft... and a few major gaffs like that can really damage immersion in a show I feel.

yep, i also thought the convo between Tyrion and Varys was completely contrived. Ah Jon Snow ... lets now support him, having followed Dani round the globe for years .... it didnt make sense given she had just saved mankind from certain death

[Scarlett.]

I think the fleet running into Euron with no prior warning was daft... and also, them stood at the gates of King's Landing and not being shot to pieces with arrows was also daft... and a few major gaffs like that can really damage immersion in a show I feel.

Cersei didnt have them shoot because she wants to lure Dany into destroying the Red Keep, where all the commoners in King's Landing are holding out, so that she can play the hero, given that she hasn't been popular since the whole Sept destruction thing. Also, in the time it takes to kill Dany and her guards, the guards and dragon could have also taken out Cersei. It's the same reason Jon didn't kill Ramsey here

m28KKsXr6z8

[Adamw92]

The newest leaks for episode 5 sound SO much better and more detailed since it’s just all focused on that one episode rather than little bits from both of the last episodes. I really don’t know what to believe though, I hope they don’t give this a **** ending.

[Fetch The Bolt Cutters]

CAN YOU POST THE LEAKS IF YOURE GONNA MENTION THEN PLeASE

[Niamh.]

Guys can anyone discussing leaks, even without saying what they are, do it in spoilers because it can become kind of obvious what you're talking about?

[reece(:]

Guys can anyone discussing leaks, even without saying what they are, do it in spoilers because it can become kind of obvious what you're talking about?

Or a whole different thread

[Niamh.]

Or a whole different thread

or that

[bots]

i don't personally want to see any leaks on this thread, spoilered or not.

[Niamh.]

i don't personally want to see any leaks on this thread, spoilered or not.

Yeah I agree. Anyone who is interested in them, can you start a leaks thread? Pretty please

[The Slim Reaper]

Can't believe the NK is back next episode. really looking forward to see how they work his story

[MTVN]

Agree about the leaks, just seeing people's reaction to them kinda give away what might be involved in it so a separate thread would be better

yep, i also thought the convo between Tyrion and Varys was completely contrived. Ah Jon Snow ... lets now support him, having followed Dani round the globe for years .... it didnt make sense given she had just saved mankind from certain death

Yeah that was very unlike both of them. Pretty much the only reason they now seem to favour Jon over Dany is that he doesn't want the throne and she does

[MTVN]

Ah I see a separate thread has been made now thanks :hee:

[BBDodge]

Can't believe the NK is back next episode. really looking forward to see how they work his story

They won't. Must be silly season for "leaks" for someone to come up with that.

[The Slim Reaper]

They won't. Must be silly season for "leaks" for someone to come up with that.

I wasn't being serious.

[Brother Leon]

I don’t want to spoil myself, but part of me wants to read the leaks if they are as bad as being mentioned. At least that way I can expect the crap ending.

[bots]

I don’t want to spoil myself, but part of me wants to read the leaks if they are as bad as being mentioned. At least that way I can expect the crap ending.

i haven't seen the leaks and don't want to see them. At this point, everyone is very polarised having invested in 7+ series, so one persons crap ending could be anothers best ever .... we will see :worry:

[Strictly Jake]

As for if it will be a crap ending or not. I don't think any single person is going to be satisfied with the ending simply because of how invested we have been all of these years and it will feel a bit rubbish that it's finished so we will all think oh well that could have been better even though it's probably pretty good. Seems to happen with most programs that end. I also dont want to read any leaks

[Niamh.]

I would like Arya to survive (although I'm not sure if she will) I don't think I'd be that disappointed in any ending if that happens :hee:

[Amy Jade]

I would LOVE if Drogon had given birth and comes with her babies

[Niamh.]

If that's a leak, there's another thread for those now I think Amy

[The Slim Reaper]

I would LOVE if Drogon had given birth and comes with her babies

Dragons are born from eggs that require incubation, then they're useless for years until they grow. Although time is an irrelevance for the last 2 seasons so who knows.

[The Slim Reaper]

If that's a leak, there's another thread for those now I think Amy

It's not a leak, it's a wish, although it is based off some false leaks, so :shrug:

[The Slim Reaper]

https://i.imgur.com/6NDFmUC.jpg

[Mystic Mock]

yep, i also thought the convo between Tyrion and Varys was completely contrived. Ah Jon Snow ... lets now support him, having followed Dani round the globe for years .... it didnt make sense given she had just saved mankind from certain death

I'm a Tyrion fan and I'd have to agree with you on this, although without meaning to sound biased I do think that they've made it worse for Varys who's done a 180 degree turnaround overnight without having second thoughts.:umm2:

I know that as the show has gotten older that it excels more at battle episodes than actually telling a cohesive story, but the whole Varys and Tyrion being pro-Jon over Dany storyline is yet again more fan fiction for Jon Snow from the TV writers because he is clearly their favourite character and they're not hiding it very well.

[Scarlett.]

Varys has never been devoted to one ruler, he backs who he is best for the realm, it's always been his motive
GmVos4TDLSA

[Mystic Mock]

Varys has never been devoted to one ruler, he backs who he is best for the realm, it's always been his motive
GmVos4TDLSA

For me personally I'm complaining at the poor buildup and explaination as to why Varys has changed his mind, and I think that's why other people on Social Media and some people that I know IRL have been upset over that particular storyline, he doesn't even know Jon Snow that well.

[user104658]

I rewatched the first 2 episodes of Season 1 and it really was so much better written, and they failed to capitalise on so much that was set up in those early seasons in later seasons :worry:.

Oh plus I forgot that The Hound wasn't even ORDERED to kill Arya's friend he just decided to ride over him with his horse while he was running away and now I think he should go back on Arya's list.

[Niamh.]

I rewatched the first 2 episodes of Season 1 and it really was so much better written, and they failed to capitalise on so much that was set up in those early seasons in later seasons :worry:.

Oh plus I forgot that The Hound wasn't even ORDERED to kill Arya's friend he just decided to ride over him with his horse while he was running away and now I think he should go back on Arya's list.[emoji23]

[Ninastar]

I'm so ****ing mad

[Brother Leon]

Yeah. Sorry, that was ****e..


Smh.

[Brother Leon]

I'm so ****ing mad

Same. I’ve been mostly positive about the season despite other opinions, but...


What a terrible way they don’t Cersei and Jaime’s death... really? And Arya just magically has a horse appear from the ashes for her to ride out on smh... Even Clegene Bowl couldn’t save it.

[Glenn.]

That was all kinds of messy.

[Brother Leon]

Give Lena Headey all the awards though. Absolute Queen.

[arista]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/D6XuFzEX4AAZlEd.jpg

[Shaun]

I know a lot of fans will be "I told you so!" about the rapid deterioration of this show's writing since, perhaps, season 5 or 6... but that was something else. A ridiculous fireworks display of absolutely no character depth or subtlety.

So many brilliant characters snuffed out with a blink-and-you'll-miss-it. Varys? Gone immediately. Qyburn? Randomly smashed against a wall. The Hound/The Mountain was a brief distraction. Euron/Jamie? A mild fracas on the beach. Cersei, the baddest bitch of them all? Basement collapsed.

Entire new storylines are just thrown away at the drop of a hat. No more golden company, despite knowing nothing about them. Iron Fleet all disappear immediately, unable to do what they did in 5 seconds last week.

I found myself drawn to the mother/daughter that saved Arya but that was about it.. everything else just pissed me off and this show is as dead as every interesting character (bar Arya/Sansa/Tyrion (and obviously Brienne)).

[bots]

i really enjoyed that episode .... takes all types :laugh:

[BBDodge]

Well that's 9 years of my life wasted.

[bots]

For anyone that read "leaks" Did the leaks prove to be correct? I don't need to know details, a yes or no will do :hee:

[Shaun]

I saw a small chunk of the leaks and they were correct, yeah... Jamie/Cersei dying together, Varys being burned, Cleganebowl being a stalemate, etc.

Thankfully that's all I saw :worry: they were split into like 4 parts.

[Babayaro.]

I'm very 50/50 with that episode.

It was visually incredible and a real rollercoaster,but the more I think about it, the more I hate Jaime and Cersei's death. It felt like a total cop-out. And Euron basically getting a victory was ****e too. I've always disliked his character.

[Ammi]

...brutal episode...


...I guess I just don’t see what it would have added in any value to give Cersei an horrific death..an expected death really...she’s ended, she’s no more..for me the gravity of the moment was there ...

[Shaun]

Their death was one of the few moments in the episode I actually enjoyed; Cersei was always a brilliant character, acted brilliantly, and however she went would always be impactful. Being reduced to admitting she doesn't want to die was quite fitting and a good resolution...

...but I am frustrated with the writing of Jamie. One second he's raping her, next he loves her, then he's abandoning her and fighting with the Starks, falling for Brienne... and then he goes back to die by her side? It was all over the place and there was never any inner monologue to back it up.

The scene with him and Tyrion freeing him was very moving (even if it'll lead to Tyrion's death, IMO) but otherwise he's just been completely unreadable and that's only really a convenient plot device for the writers who've been making it up as they go along. "He's fallen for Brienne, he's a changed man!" Psyche.

Obviously the finale could wrap things up wonderfully but it's just been such a blistering pace and so many characters have been thrown to the scrapheap that you can't help but wonder what the point of it all was. And I know the Daenerys=Mad Queen angle feels new to some of her fans but was hinted at in drips and drabs in the past. It's just... everyone else bar the Starks and her is left up in the air and thrown around at random. Huge political masterminds like Varys and Littlefinger have been executed without fanfare in the past two seasons and at face value it's meant to mean "don't trust snakes" or whatever but... they've served through how many kings/queens exactly and not been stupid enough to start screaming "AEGON TARGARYEN!!!" from the rooftops? Just so frustrating.

Arya & The Hound managing to get into Kings Landing before Dany went all dracarys, as well :joker: geographically all over the place.

[The Slim Reaper]

What a ****ing ****show. They've destroyed this show in the last 2 seasons. If they wanted to do something else, they should of handed it off to someone else to finish it. There wouldn't have been any shortage of takers, and GRRM could have made the ultimate decision.

This is just trash now.

[Epic.]

Wtf WAS that?!?

I got up at 2am for this? The long winded and abysmal footage of Daenerys burning innocent lives for no reason overshadowed all the other disappointing things about the episode. None of the deaths were satisfying or well developed, the biggest example being Cersei. We've waited for her death since the FIRST season, and she was even built up as a bigger threat than the Night King. Jaime then gets stabbed several times, somehow manages to reach her, and then dies with her underneath bloody rocks. There's nothing to even enjoy about her death, she had the relief of her brother/lover dying with her so what satisfaction is there that's been anticipated since this season began? You would also think she'd have some plan for the clear disadvantage she had against Daenerys, but all she does is watch, hoping things turn out okay. And this could've been really hated on, but again, WHAT have they done to Daenerys???

In drama TV shows nowadays, there always seems to be a main character you follow their point of view from and how they go about doing terrible actions. And I feel like they were trying to do this with Daenerys. But the difference between her and the Tony Sopranos or Walter Whites is that there's absolutely no motivation why she decided to murder thousands of innocent lives. Her army already won! The bells rang! She's done plenty of spiteful things, but it was always against people who have actually wronged her in some way. There was no build up, no reasoning, just more sudden sure for the sake of it that keeps happening in this season.

[Amy Jade]

https://i.dailymail.co.uk/1s/2019/05/13/10/13433748-7022919-image-a-7_1557741129068.jpg

Jaime's hand grew back

[Tom4784]

I'm not as angry as I thought I'd be, I'm just mostly apathetic to it all and a little disappointed. I found it all very dull in all honesty.

Daenerys' character arc has been utterly destroyed, seven seasons of character development wiped out in two episodes. It's lazy writing, it's disregarding character development to force her into the final villain role and it doesn't fit who she is. They've tried the mad queen angle before with her and it didn't work then and it doesn't work now. Choosing to destroy King's Landing was just a matter of plot convenience and the plot should never lead the characters, the characters should lead the plot.

The writing was also poor, we've spent this season and last season with Dany's resources being depleted and all that didn't matter in the end since she still won with ease. It's bad writing and the fact that Cersei just stood watching as it all happened was dumb. She would have had another plan, she would have used the wildfire (I think the wildfire in this episode was just the vats left over by the Mad King's plan to destroy KL) or had something else planned.

I also hated the Jamie/Euron fight since it was pointless and didn't make sense. Why would Euron stay to pick a fight with Jamie? It served no purpose other than the plot.

As for the few things I did enjoy, I thought Cersei's final scene was great and along with Tyrion and Jamie's farewell, they were two of the only well written scenes in the past two episodes.

I just don't care about the final episode, I'll watch it just to complete the series but if I rewatch GOT in future, I'm just gonna pretend the series ended with the Battle of Winterfell which is ironic since for years I didn't want the White Walkers to be the endgame but the writing has just been beyond terrible since the NK died.

[bots]

i was quite surprised to see a rather sizeable dothraki army, i thought only a couple of them survived the NK :laugh:

[Scarlett.]

I feel like we needed more of a reason for Dany to just snap like that, I get it was because she'd lost everything, but they needed something in that moment for her to want to 'Burn them all'

[arista]

I feel like we needed more of a reason for Dany to just snap like that, I get it was because she'd lost everything, but they needed something in that moment for her to want to 'Burn them all'


Because they killed
her 2nd Dragon
https://pbs.twimg.com/card_img/1127853019469635584/OOnoKp9x?format=jpg&name=600x314

[reece(:]

Sooo much mess

- Dany going from freer of slaves to mad lady committing genocide on dragon
- Arya untouchable / Arya having a magic horse appear
- Jaime's whole storyline TBH...
- Jaimie mortally wounded and he's running around the dungeon with Cersei
- Qyburn death (LOL)
- Dothraki were claimed to be wiped out now they're back (???)
- Cersei the main villain suddenly becomes the rootable victim?! With the LAMEST death scene
- Yara MIA
- SAM lives

https://78.media.tumblr.com/4f9fb2add735e071bdd218180fa71612/tumblr_pa2v7ozhwq1xw7h9io1_250.gif

[arista]

Sooo much mess

- Dany going from freer of slaves to mad lady committing genocide on dragon
- Arya untouchable / Arya having a magic horse appear
- Jaime's whole storyline TBH...
- Jaimie mortally wounded and he's running around the dungeon with Cersei
- Qyburn death (LOL)
- Dothraki were claimed to be wiped out now they're back (???)
- Cersei the main villain suddenly becomes the rootable victim?! With the LAMEST death scene
- Yara MIA
- SAM lives

https://78.media.tumblr.com/4f9fb2add735e071bdd218180fa71612/tumblr_pa2v7ozhwq1xw7h9io1_250.gif




this was a great Episode
you could not write it reece..............................

Great Clouds
permitted her to fly in fast
Utter Bliss.

[Glenn.]

I think anyone with sense that was writing this episode would have stopped the attack at the bell ringing, then moved to the Red Keep to destroy Cersei.

There was NO need for what happened.

[bots]

I thought it was all appropriate .... she said root and stem a couple of episodes ago, and that's what we got

[Vicky.]

Yeah I remain dissapointed in this series.

No point in killing all the innocents, like., why not just fly over to where Cersei is and burn her.

Knew they were going to do mad queen Dany though, shes been building to this for quite some time with the arrogance and basically 'bend the knee or be burnt alive!' stuff.

Tyrion is so obviously dead next week :bored:

There is a HUGE difference between when the books were being followed somewhat and whats came afterwards. I hope if GRRM ever finishes the books, they are better than this..

[Tom4784]

Everything is just so dumb and inconsistent and there's no real thought to anything that's happened.

I can't get over how badly this show has caved in on itself in the space of two episodes. It's remarkable, really.

[arista]

Everything is just so dumb and inconsistent and there's no real thought to anything that's happened.

I can't get over how badly this show has caved in on itself in the space of two episodes. It's remarkable, really.


You are not the Writer.
Revenge is real
she loved Both Dragons
It was a War
Deadly..........................................

[Tom4784]

You are not the Writer.
Revenge is real
she loved Both Dragons
It was a War
Deadly..........................................

It was ****ing dumb and there's no excuse for bad and lazy writing.

[Babayaro.]

Qyburn's death made me scream, even though it was so so ridiculous to kill him off just like that

[arista]

It was ****ing dumb and there's no excuse for bad and lazy writing.



No its like the First World War
started from a Assassination
and bad slow communications,


You can not call the last episode Lazy Writing
No one expected such force
The writer is Clever.

[arista]

Qyburn's death made me scream, even though it was so so ridiculous to kill him off just like that




Yes a Shock
a Old man Adviser
no one expected that.
But the city was falling.........................


Clever writing.

[Babayaro.]

It wasn't clever writing

[Tom4784]

No its like the First World War
started from a Assassination
and bad slow communications,


You can not call the last episode Lazy Writing
No one expected such force
The writer is Clever.


Keep Writing Yourself
Dezzy.

There was nothing clever about this episode and it was certainly lazy. Spectacle doesn't make for a good episode especially when there's character assassination going on all around.

It's bad writing, nothing more and nothing less.

I'm also getting really sick of people using my writing as a means to insult me.

[Daniel.]

Idk how Danys character has been butchered , her diehard stans just cant see whenit’s been building for years

I liked it bar Cersei’s death.

Also no one is telling me this season is worse than 2 or 5

[Vicky.]

Idk how Danys character has been butchered , her diehard stans just cant see whenit’s been building for years

I liked it bar Cersei’s death.

Also no one is telling me this season is worse than 2 or 5

Yup. I got proper blasted elsewhere for saying this was the way it was going to go, apparently I just hate her so want her to be bad, but no, its obviously been coming for a long time now and surely everyone could see it..seems not though

[Amy Jade]

I've read Dezzy's 1st book and it's a great read, arista.

[Tom4784]

It's because Dany's descent into madness was dumb, rushed and made zero sense. Whenever they've tried to float the idea in the past seasons it's never panned out because she's never really seemed insane, it's always been a a potential plot strand that relied on the plot forcing the characters into roles that go against who they are.

Daenerys wouldn't flick a switch in her head that makes her believe it's fine to kill innocents and children. The only times she's killed before have been either for the sake of the people (the Slave cities) or she's killed enemies in the context of battle or for revenge (that witch in the first series who manipulated her into giving up her child's life). She's never killed innocents and this heel turn just goes against her established arc. It's cheap writing meant to illicit shocks and nothing more.

They should have just had her burn the Red Keep, that would have been a way to show her brutality without the wanton murder of innocents that goes against everything she is.

[bots]

I don't think it was particularly out of Dani's character either. She has never failed to deliver retribution before, and she lost her closest friend and a dragon just before the attack

[arista]

There was nothing clever about this episode and it was certainly lazy. Spectacle doesn't make for a good episode especially when there's character assassination going on all around.

It's bad writing, nothing more and nothing less.

I'm also getting really sick of people using my writing as a means to insult me.



No Insult was meant
at all.
Your Writing is Great.

[arista]

It wasn't clever writing


Clever in the way
no one knew the Episode would be so Deadly

[Vicky.]

Daenerys wouldn't flick a switch in her head that makes her believe it's fine to kill innocents and children. The only times she's killed before have been either for the sake of the people (the Slave cities) or she's killed enemies in the context of battle or for revenge (that witch in the first series who manipulated her into giving up her child's life). She's never killed innocents and this heel turn just goes against her established arc. It's cheap writing meant to illicit shocks and nothing more.


Umm..she roasted the Tarleys for no other reason than they refused to bow to her :laugh:

Also, its taken a trigger to make her go full mad. And whats shes had to deal with in the past few episodes would be more than enough to send someone into a rage.

[Scarlett.]

I think anyone with sense that was writing this episode would have stopped the attack at the bell ringing, then moved to the Red Keep to destroy Cersei.

There was NO need for what happened.

I thought she'd go straight for the Red Keep, not genocide the whole of King's Landing, before destroying the keep, I'm struggling to get why she killed the population on purpose, so people would fear her?

[Lostie!]

I've disliked Daenerys ever since she killed Mirri Maz Duur :idc:

I'm a few eps behind but cba staying spoiler free, and what a ****ty ending for Varys. Fair play to Conleth Hill openly saying the sidelining of his role in recent years frustrated him.

[Ramsay]

****ing loved that episode

[Scarlett.]

Dany should have stayed in Mereen, if she had been able to put her obsession with the Iron Throne behind her, she could have stayed so happy.

[Scarlett.]

If this season had have had more episodes, they could have built up to what happened in today's episode much more convincingly I think, it's seemed kind of rushed

[Ninastar]

Anyone know what song/music it was while everything was burning? I can’t find it

I remember listening and thinking it sounded kind of scary

[Scarlett.]

Anyone know what song/music it was while everything was burning? I can’t find it

I remember listening and thinking it sounded kind of scary

I heard several leitmotifs being used, most recognisable was 'Light of the Seven', the Targaeryen theme and 'Rain's of Castemere'
L9SIS6wBxpI
w9PXLTLuuSE
krSiWsT97fI

[Ninastar]

Thank you so much!!!

[Ninastar]

I love light of the seven, it’s not that one I’ll listen to the others now

[Babayaro.]

Clever in the way
no one knew the Episode would be so Deadly

But the way in which it was deadly was not clever. It was visually incredible, but like Dezzy said, it was as if the writer's were just trying to shock for the sake of it. It would have been okay had Daenerys' decent into madness been built up over an entire season, but it has not really and therefore, the whole thing, as impressive as it was, did not feel earned.

[Babayaro.]

How does everyone think the finale will go? It's bound to go down the Jon, Tyrion & Sansa vs Daenerys route, but surely it won't be as straightforward as that?

Those are the only characters with a purpose left, so the likes of Arya, Davos, Grey Worm, etc must be done.

I think both Dany and Tyrion will die and Sansa will become queen, with Jon as her hand. Although, that does sound too good to be true for GoT's standards.

[Strictly Jake]

Just watched. I wasn't ready for any of that....like what the hell!

[bots]

How does everyone think the finale will go? It's bound to go down the Jon, Tyrion & Sansa vs Daenerys route, but surely it won't be as straightforward as that?

Those are the only characters with a purpose left, so the likes of Arya, Davos, Grey Worm, etc must be done.

I think both Dany and Tyrion will die and Sansa will become queen, with Jon as her hand. Although, that does sound too good to be true for GoT's standards.

i think Arya will kill greyworm and Dani. Tyrion will probably cop it too at some point

[Ross.]

Cersei deserved better

[Mystic Mock]

Yeah I remain dissapointed in this series.

No point in killing all the innocents, like., why not just fly over to where Cersei is and burn her.

Knew they were going to do mad queen Dany though, shes been building to this for quite some time with the arrogance and basically 'bend the knee or be burnt alive!' stuff.

Tyrion is so obviously dead next week :bored:

There is a HUGE difference between when the books were being followed somewhat and whats came afterwards. I hope if GRRM ever finishes the books, they are better than this..

All of this.

Plus the Kings Landing Knights were absolutely unrealistic throughout the whole episode, how Kings Landing has managed to survive this long is shocking considering how weak the Guards seem to be for Kings Landing.

Also Dany's logic makes no sense to me, the writers need to do a better job there imo.

Episode 3 has been the only decent episode this season, the rest have been average to abysmal.

And some people thought that BSG and Dexter ended badly, I've never seen either show deliver episodes on this level of bad quality imo.

[Tom4784]

Umm..she roasted the Tarleys for no other reason than they refused to bow to her :laugh:

Also, its taken a trigger to make her go full mad. And whats shes had to deal with in the past few episodes would be more than enough to send someone into a rage.

The Tarlys were people who fought against her and refused to bend a knee, Most rulers in GOT are forced to kill people who don't bend a knee. She didn't just roast them either, she gave them both the same choice, she gave them an opportunity to live.

That's a world of difference from Dany suddenly deciding that she wants to burn innocent people and children. The whole character change was dumb and was devoid of sense and logic. Piss poor writing.

[Amy Jade]

Damn I was ready to come defend Dani but wow. Killing all the innocent people was shameful, why not just go destroy where Cersie was hiding?

The guard had surrendered there was no need to kill the city folk. They managed to make Cersie sympathetic and Dani evil in under an hour.

Not sure how I feel...

[Amy Jade]

That's a world of difference from Dany suddenly deciding that she wants to burn innocent people and children. The whole character change was dumb and was devoid of sense and logic. Piss poor writing.
I agree.

She's gone from wanting to free prisoners to killing innocent people.

I understand she is grieving over Missandei and Rhaegal but such a heel turn is pretty odd. Even if people suspected she was power mad she was never blood thirsty.

[Tom4784]

Cersei deserved better

I'm more annoyed by the fact the writers had her standing on a balcony for the entirety of it. I actually liked her death scene and it wasn't far off what I've imagined for years (She and Jamie would die together in an explosion of wildfire) but I hate how they made her look so incompetent.

This is a woman who was damn good at playing the game and would do anything to survive yet she didn't have an escape option? She didn't have a plan for what to do if the Scorpions didn't work? She killed a king when he no longer suited her designs, she blew up a sept and wiped out all of her enemies in one fell swoop when they thought they had her cornered and she managed to strip away Dany's resources over the course of Season 6 and weaken her substantially. She did all this yet she didn't think of a plan B in case the fleet and the Scorpions went down? Cersei WOULD NEVER!

Shoddy writing and a disservice to both the fans and Lena Headey who served excellent performances every time she was on screen.

[Tom4784]

I agree.

She's gone from wanting to free prisoners to killing innocent people.

I understand she is grieving over Missandei and Rhaegal but such a heel turn is pretty odd. Even if people suspected she was power mad she was never blood thirsty.

It would have made more sense if they killed Rhaegal in this episode instead of last week's. Have King's Landing surrender but Euron or a soldier under Cersei's command takes out Rhaegal as the bells are ringing, that would have made for a more logical trigger for her actions.

It would still be ****ty but it would have made more narrative sense.

[reece(:]

I'm more annoyed by the fact the writers had her standing on a balcony for the entirety of it. I actually liked her death scene and it wasn't far off what I've imagined for years (She and Jamie would die together in an explosion of wildfire) but I hate how they made her look so incompetent.

Poor Cersei being stuck in the Red Keep for all of her 10 mins screentime in season 8 :skull:

[Amy Jade]

It would have made more sense if they killed Rhaegal in this episode instead of last week's. Have King's Landing surrender but Euron or a soldier under Cersei's command takes out Rhaegal as the bells are ringing, that would have made for a more logical trigger for her actions.

It would still be ****ty but it would have made more narrative sense.
Great point, I think that would have been a well timed trigger.

[user104658]

I mean that was messy af and doesn't make a whole lot of sense but I'm willing to forgive literally all of it because of;

"Sir Gregor, stay with your queen!"
"Nah" *smoosh* *yeet!*
*Cersei tiptoes past without a word*

I screeched :joker:

And just the entire situation really.

"Oh hai I'm a massive zombie and literally my entire reason for existing for the past several years has been to defend the Queen which I have done up until this moment but tbh I really REALLY want to kill my little brother... So..."

[Ross.]

Justice for OUR queen

https://imagesvc.timeincapp.com/v3/fan/image?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwinteriscoming.net%2Ffiles %2F2018%2F09%2FCersei-Lannister.jpg&w=736&h=485&c=sc

[Babayaro.]

i think Arya will kill greyworm and Dani. Tyrion will probably cop it too at some point

Why would she kill Grey Worm?

[user104658]

Why would she kill Grey Worm?I think Grey Worm is pretty certain to get killed by someone trying to get to Dany. Most likely Jon will battle (and beat) Wormy.

Been reading that the Azor Ahai stuff is vague enough that it might not have been about the white walkers at all, and it might end up being Daenerys that is the "darkness" that needs to be destroyed...

[Babayaro.]

I think Grey Worm is pretty certain to get killed by someone trying to get to Dany. Most likely Jon will battle (and beat) Wormy.

Been reading that the Azor Ahai stuff is vague enough that it might not have been about the white walkers at all, and it might end up being Daenerys that is the "darkness" that needs to be destroyed...

Yeah I think this could be possible. It would be a terrible way for him to go, but I would not be surprised tbh.

[Babayaro.]

I mean, it would be an unreal fight between those two (possibly one of the best, most evenly-matched on paper) but turning good 'ol Grey Worm into a bad guy, of sorts, would be sad to see :(

[Scarlett.]

I forgot about this scene
XE2P_v7wxTQ

[Brother Leon]

I know a lot of fans will be "I told you so!" about the rapid deterioration of this show's writing since, perhaps, season 5 or 6... but that was something else. A ridiculous fireworks display of absolutely no character depth or subtlety.

So many brilliant characters snuffed out with a blink-and-you'll-miss-it. Varys? Gone immediately. Qyburn? Randomly smashed against a wall. The Hound/The Mountain was a brief distraction. Euron/Jamie? A mild fracas on the beach. Cersei, the baddest bitch of them all? Basement collapsed.

Entire new storylines are just thrown away at the drop of a hat. No more golden company, despite knowing nothing about them. Iron Fleet all disappear immediately, unable to do what they did in 5 seconds last week.

I found myself drawn to the mother/daughter that saved Arya but that was about it.. everything else just pissed me off and this show is as dead as every interesting character (bar Arya/Sansa/Tyrion (and obviously Brienne)).

I never bought into the decline of the show. I feel that was mostly book readers just being obnoxious once the show timeline went past it.

Season 6 had 3 episodes that easy could be considered the best of the series. This season has been so rushed though...

[Tom4784]

You could tell the writing took a hit as soon as they left the books behind but even at it's previous worst (The Dorne season tbh) it was still 'bad for GOT but great when compared to everything else' but these past two episodes have been straight up Riverdale quality writing. It's objectively bad to the point that I think it's ruined the whole show for me, it truly has. I don't think I can watch the older episodes and enjoy them knowing how the story will inevitably end because I can't see myself enjoying the last episode.

I'm not even the biggest Dany fan but what they did to her whole arc is a ****ing travesty. Possibly the biggest writing sin I've ever witnessed in my life. It's just disrespectful to everyone involved.

[Brother Leon]

I’m mad about Jaime’s arc more than anything.


Dany has always been abit of an entitled brat with goals of wanting to burn things down if she can’t get her way all the way as far back as season 2. She just had people like Jorah to level her out and quell the mad Targaryen in her.

The season has suffered from having less episodes, because it really should have stretched more longer to show her gradual decline mentally without him though, but at the end of the day I do agree with the endgame for her... just not the journey.


Oh, and how little Jon Snow has done this season has been a joke. I can accept Arya killing The Night King, but **** me All he’s done this season is say “She’s My Queen” a bunch of times tbh.

[user104658]

The idea that Jon would make a good ruler is also bizarre at this point; he's shown himself to be emotionally gullible and open to manipulation. If he was king someone would definitely come along and start whispering in his ear and get him all confused in no time!

Only person left in the show who would make a genuinely good monarch is Sansa :shrug:. She cares enough about doing broadly the right thing to be a fair ruler, but she's also hardened and clear in her vision of what's actually going on.

Although, presumably there IS no Iron Throne now and Dany intends to rule from Dragonstone?

[Nicky91]

I’m mad about Jaime’s arc more than anything.


Dany has always been abit of an entitled brat with goals of wanting to burn things down if she can’t get her way all the way as far back as season 2. She just had people like Jorah to level her out and quell the mad Targaryen in her.

The season has suffered from having less episodes, because it really should have stretched more longer to show her gradual decline mentally without him though, but at the end of the day I do agree with the endgame for her... just not the journey.


Oh, and how little Jon Snow has done this season has been a joke. I can accept Arya killing The Night King, but **** me All he’s done this season is say “She’s My Queen” a bunch of times tbh.

yup, the Spice King owning her in season 2 was great btw :D

[Nicky91]

Jaime :sad: but anyway good he was the one who killed the show's biggest twat Euron :laugh:

[bots]

Dani said that she was going to break the wheel, and its pretty clear she has done that now ..... and taken half the cart with it :laugh:


It really all depends on what Dani does next. If she sets things up to be fair and good, she will probably get away with her momentary slip, failing that, she will need to take out Jon Snow.

[Vicky.]

I never bought into the decline of the show. I feel that was mostly book readers just being obnoxious once the show timeline went past it.

Season 6 had 3 episodes that easy could be considered the best of the series. This season has been so rushed though...

I watched the show before the books...I think S6 was pretty decent but since then its been utter trash. The characters developed a ridiculous amount of plot armour where before..they could be killed regardless of how they seemed 'vital' to the story..just for one bad decision. It was unpredictable beforehand, and became extremely predictable in s7 to the point where..noone at all died besides littlefinger (and am not totally sure hes gone either..but thats my conspiracy) :laugh: Same seemed to be going on this season, whitewalker battle no real shocks or anything and hundreds of thousands dead but oddly enough the main characters all survived. And now this utter utter ****show of an episode with the likes of Cersei getting a terrible death when it finally came..
Through s8 the scriptwriting has been utterly horrendous, given what they had to work with. WAY too many plot holes (still cannot get over Cersei suddenly having honour and not just killing dany and her crew inc dragon..instead chosing to have a bit to and fro with tyrion then let everyone leave merrily...) and just basically, piss poor planning, despite having so long to get it right. The acting has been, as always amazing mind. Cannot fault it.

[Vicky.]

I’m mad about Jaime’s arc more than anything.



Also ****ing yes to this. Why?! Why on earth did they do that for ****s sake..

[Strictly Jake]

I'm also wondering why the long stories a bit bran being the three eyed raven and ayra being one of the faceless people for it not come in useful at any point of the final series

Also I thought cersei was supposed to have been killed by one of her brothers?

[Nicky91]

Dani said that she was going to break the wheel, and its pretty clear she has done that now ..... and taken half the cart with it :laugh:


It really all depends on what Dani does next. If she sets things up to be fair and good, she will probably get away with her momentary slip, failing that, she will need to take out Jon Snow.

not just break the wheel, but destroying entire kings landing :laugh2:

and the iron throne, well i'm not sure if that is still there :joker:

[Niamh.]

I’m mad about Jaime’s arc more than anything.


Dany has always been abit of an entitled brat with goals of wanting to burn things down if she can’t get her way all the way as far back as season 2. She just had people like Jorah to level her out and quell the mad Targaryen in her.

The season has suffered from having less episodes, because it really should have stretched more longer to show her gradual decline mentally without him though, but at the end of the day I do agree with the endgame for her... just not the journey.


Oh, and how little Jon Snow has done this season has been a joke. I can accept Arya killing The Night King, but **** me All he’s done this season is say “She’s My Queen” a bunch of times tbh.

They literally spent 7 seasons redeeming Jaimes character, only for him to go right back to Season 1 Jaime again, it was horrendous

Also agree with you about Jon, he's been totally pointless this season and are we really supposed to believe that Dany burned all those innocent people because Jon wouldn't shag her? That's disappointing

I'm also wondering why the long stories a bit bran being the three eyed raven and ayra being one of the faceless people for it not come in useful at any point of the final series

Also I thought cersei was supposed to have been killed by one of her brothers?

Yeah, her death was really disappointing, all the rest of the prophecy from that fortune teller came true, why not complete the circle?

[Niamh.]

Also, they spent alot of time on Arya this episode and her view of the carnage, I'm betting she's going to kill Dany next episode :think:

[Vicky.]

Maybe Arya kills Dany, but waring Jons face or something. Its the Cersei thing all over again but surely the faceless man stuff must have meant something more than her being able to kill off house Frey for ****s sake :laugh:

[Niamh.]

And the NK :oh:

[The Slim Reaper]

https://i.imgur.com/jSQTgNk.jpg?1

[Niamh.]

:laugh2:

[The Slim Reaper]

Maybe Arya kills Dany, but waring Jons face or something. Its the Cersei thing all over again but surely the faceless man stuff must have meant something more than her being able to kill off house Frey for ****s sake :laugh:

Think the faceless stuff was more about teaching her to become an assassin rather than specifically change her face - that's just an added bonus.

[The Slim Reaper]

:laugh2:

Comin' over ere' resizing my pictures! :fist:

[bots]

Jon has spent the last season and a bit saying you are my queen, even in the last episode where Varys pointed out what would happen, he said, she is my queen .... how is he now going to say ... oh ... you really are queen now .... YOUR NOT MY QUEEN :laugh:

[user104658]

littlefinger (and am not totally sure hes gone either..but thats my conspiracy) :laugh:

We literally saw him getting sliced open from ear to ear Vicky :joker:. The only explanation for him being alive would be if Arya was in on it and deliberately missed the arteries whilst "making it look good". But then, whoever got rid of the body would have to be in on it too.

(still cannot get over Cersei suddenly having honour and not just killing dany and her crew inc dragon..instead chosing to have a bit to and fro with tyrion then let everyone leave merrily...)

I had trouble with that at first but it does actually make more sense when you think of it as "mutually assured destruction". Cersei is stood right there and Drogon could torch that wall in seconds, you'd have to be pretty sure that the first shot would be a killing blow to risk it. Sure she could have easily taken out Dany there and then but there was too high a personal risk.

[Niamh.]

Maybe Arya kills Dany, but waring Jons face or something. Its the Cersei thing all over again but surely the faceless man stuff must have meant something more than her being able to kill off house Frey for ****s sake :laugh:

And the NK :oh:

Think the faceless stuff was more about teaching her to become an assassin rather than specifically change her face - that's just an added bonus.

Oh ok sorry, misunderstood you, you meant the actual face swapping :facepalm:

[user104658]

Jon has spent the last season and a bit saying you are my queen, even in the last episode where Varys pointed out what would happen, he said, she is my queen .... how is he now going to say ... oh ... you really are queen now .... YOUR NOT MY QUEEN :laugh:

To be fair he's been justifying all of her actions thus far (torching the Tarlys, etc.) as "hard acts of war" or even things like Varys as treason. There's no way to justify her actions at King's Landing as anything but a war crime. Even burning JUST the soldiers after they had thrown down their weapons would be a war crime... deliberately killing civilians - not even collateral damage, but deliberate massacre - is up there with (or BEYOND) the very worst warlords in real human history :umm2:.

[Niamh.]

Oh also my sister in law was in that episode last night running behind Arya and the Hound and probably ended up torched RIP :(

[The Slim Reaper]

Oh also my sister in law was in that episode last night running behind Arya and the Hound and probably ended up torched RIP :(

You're handling it pretty well. I take it you weren't that close.

[Niamh.]

I wonder if this is how GRRM had planned it for the book? :think: He could have made her progression into madness more believable I think, it was all too fast in the show, same with Jaimes turn back to the darkside

[Niamh.]

You're handling it pretty well. I take it you weren't that close.

It's kind of funny really because the shortened version of her name is Ash :fan:

[The Slim Reaper]

I wonder if this is how GRRM had planned it for the book? :think: He could have made her progression into madness more believable I think, it was all too fast in the show, same with Jaimes turn back to the darkside

Pretty sure you're correct

https://i.imgur.com/3j2m5Yw.jpg

It's kind of funny really because the shortened version of her name is Ash :fan:

Too soon.

[Niamh.]

Pretty sure you're correct

https://i.imgur.com/3j2m5Yw.jpg



Too soon.

I really really hope he finishes the books now, maybe the fact that the show has made such a hash of the ending, will motivate him to start writing again? :fc:

[The Slim Reaper]

I really really hope he finishes the books now, maybe the fact that the show has made such a hash of the ending, will motivate him to start writing again? :fc:

I read the other day that he's apparently finished both books already but he struck a deal with Dan and Dave not to release before the show finished. I don't believe it, but I'll grasp at any straw at this stage.

[bots]

i thought the latest episode was great, i wasn't disappointed by any of it, my disappointment was in the previous episode.

Dani has been a hairs breadth away from creating pure havoc numerous times before. She had close advisors previously that tempered her but now they are gone, and her trust is lost in Tyrion. What happened in Kings landing was inevitable. Let's also not forget that it has been driven home for seasons, that the common people shouldn't be harmed, so it was bound to happen.

I found it a very satisfying episode :shrug:

[Vicky.]

And the NK :oh:

I am still not sure she used a face of a whitewalker like you say or was just..quick and shocked them as they were concentrating on TNK trying to eye shag Bran :suspect:

Yes it made her a great assassin. But, the many faced god stuff seemed like it had to be like..really important. Could have just sent her to ninja school for training otherwise :idc:

[Vicky.]

We literally saw him getting sliced open from ear to ear Vicky :joker:. The only explanation for him being alive would be if Arya was in on it and deliberately missed the arteries whilst "making it look good". But then, whoever got rid of the body would have to be in on it too.



I am aware :suspect: However, we also had a totally random scene that kind of fit nothing at all and there was no reason for it, where littlefinger gave one of those bravosi coins to some random girl, right before he was killed. Which would also give reason for the constant many faced god stuff. If it was still down to GRRM, I would actually put money on it, but not sure HBO writers are quite up to that. Still a bit confusing as to why that scene was there though..unless it was a possible they had in mind

[Niamh.]

I read the other day that he's apparently finished both books already but he struck a deal with Dan and Dave not to release before the show finished. I don't believe it, but I'll grasp at any straw at this stage.

oh my god, I hope that's true. I mean it could be, he had a couple of chapters released of The Winds of Winter, would have been a bit odd that he'd start it and then just throw it in a drawer for a few years :think:

[user104658]

I am aware :suspect: However, we also had a totally random scene that kind of fit nothing at all and there was no reason for it, where littlefinger gave one of those bravosi coins to some random girl, right before he was killed. Which would also give reason for the constant many faced god stuff. If it was still down to GRRM, I would actually put money on it, but not sure HBO writers are quite up to that. Still a bit confusing as to why that scene was there though..unless it was a possible they had in mind

You're just making me remember that GoT (with good writing) had enough material for (and sort of NEEDED) at least two more seasons before the finale Vicky :fist:.

I've been watching the first season and there's SO MUCH dialogue and intrigue and all of it is so gripping... so many plot points and storylines have just fallen apart :worry:. The contrast with the last few episodes (seasons, tbh) is really quite... ... ... ... Stark :hehe: :hehe: :hehe:

[user104658]

oh my god, I hope that's true. I mean it could be, he had a couple of chapters released of The Winds of Winter, would have been a bit odd that he'd start it and then just throw it in a drawer for a few years :think:

Maybe he's a marketing genius? He's finished the books and they end totally differently and are amazing, and he's been feeding the show bogus information for their finale, and then as soon as it's over he'll be like "Now, here's the REAL ending you've all been waiting for" and it'll be the best-seller of all time :joker:. Would also ensure that his "masterwork" is the definitive version of the story, and he MUST have been worried that his own original work would end up being over-shadowed by the TV show...

[Niamh.]

Maybe he's a marketing genius? He's finished the books and they end totally differently and are amazing, and he's been feeding the show bogus information for their finale, and then as soon as it's over he'll be like "Now, here's the REAL ending you've all been waiting for" and it'll be the best-seller of all time :joker:. Would also ensure that his "masterwork" is the definitive version of the story, and he MUST have been worried that his own original work would end up being over-shadowed by the TV show...

Please, please, pleaaaase let this be true

[user104658]

My other explanation for Dany's horrific character development is that he has planned all along for Dany to become the mad queen but her madness builds in subtle-yet-clear ways throughout the books... but he didn't reveal the "ending" to the showrunners until they were about to write and film the final episodes of S8; so they didn't edge Dany's character in that direction and had to just have a sudden jarring shift in her character in order to have it end as specified.

[Vicky.]

You're just making me remember that GoT (with good writing) had enough material for (and sort of NEEDED) at least two more seasons before the finale Vicky :fist:.

I've been watching the first season and there's SO MUCH dialogue and intrigue and all of it is so gripping... so many plot points and storylines have just fallen apart :worry:. The contrast with the last few episodes (seasons, tbh) is really quite... ... ... ... Stark :hehe: :hehe: :hehe:
Yeah, its depressing what they could have done and haven't.

I get wanting to kill it while its still popular so it doesn't just drag on. But there was just so much character building and possibilities it did need at last 2 seasons to wrap it up properly. There was enough there for maybe 3 or 4 without it getting stale I think.

Really really hope he does bring the books out soon and the rumours are true that they are there, just waiting. However, that kind of makes me nervous that...the writers HAVE followed his story. But then I think nah, no way would the first have been so detailed, so thought through, so different, only for the last to be this ridiculous nonsense :laugh:

[user104658]

Please, please, pleaaaase lets this be true

Or what if he's finished them and was waiting for the fan reaction, and now that he's seen how the Mad Dany-"twist" has gone down, he's burning the second half of the final book and rewriting it as we speak? :joker:

[Niamh.]

Or what if he's finished them and was waiting for the fan reaction, and now that he's seen how the Mad Dany-"twist" has gone down, he's burning the second half of the final book and rewriting it as we speak? :joker:

:laugh2:

The Mad Queen angle would be fine if they had made her progression there more believable

[Vicky.]

I do think they have showed her gradually getting worse and worse in her want to rule. However, not quite to the stage where she burns thousands of innocents for literally no reason. Shes been clearly more and more focussed on the throne, clearly more and more arrogant, clearly more and more power hungry (and basically sometimes a bit delusional about how shes the worlds saviour and stuff and making out its for the people, rather than because she just wants it), and has had a few dodgy moments. I could well have bought (and thought this would happen and was screamed at by dany fans for saying this was possible :D) her maybe..killing Jon so that the throne was hers, or something like that. A small rampage to get rid of those who knew about Jons parentage, or to kill off a few advisors who had pissed her off. Or a couple more 'you WILL bow to me' murders. Something like that.

But this was not being power mad. It was being a total lunatic and just..killing (and killing people you reckon you should rule too..) for the sake of it, no reasoning at all behind it. As I mentioned the Tarleys were another decision I questioned, and all for more 'bend the knee', but this is obviously literally 1000x worse than that. Power mad, and blood thirsty are not the same thing. So while I do buy and think the developments been there for her to turn 'bad', certainly not for the level they went to.

[user104658]

I do think they have showed her gradually getting worse and worse in her want to rule. However, not quite to the stage where she burns thousands of innocents for literally no reason. Shes been clearly more and more focussed on the throne, clearly more and more arrogant, clearly more and more power hungry (and basically sometimes a bit delusional about how shes the worlds saviour and stuff and making out its for the people, rather than because she just wants it), and has had a few dodgy moments. I could well have bought (and thought this would happen and was screamed at by dany fans for saying this was possible :D) her maybe..killing Jon so that the throne was hers, or something like that. A small rampage to get rid of those who knew about Jons parentage, or to kill off a few advisors who had pissed her off. Or a couple more 'you WILL bow to me' murders. Something like that.

But this was not being power mad. It was being a total lunatic and just..killing (and killing people you reckon you should rule too..) for the sake of it, no reasoning at all behind it. As I mentioned the Tarleys were another decision I questioned, and all for more 'bend the knee', but this is obviously literally 1000x worse than that. Power mad, and blood thirsty are not the same thing. So while I do buy and think the developments been there for her to turn 'bad', certainly not for the level they went to.

I agree - doing something over the top and "power mad" (like burning the Red Keep after the bells had rung) wouldn't have been out of character. Turning on her friends and allies wouldn't have been out of character... but burning the innocent civilians, children and babies included, is SO out of character that it fails to make sense on any level. Her entire motivation for gaining power has been to protect the weak from the powerful. So while it might be supposed to be "irony", it just doesn't work, because it could only possibly mean that her supposed motives all along were lies (and they were clearly never made out to be lies).

[Ramsay]

GRRM already dismissed that rumour about the books being finished :(

https://www.digitalspy.com/tv/ustv/a27454564/game-of-thrones-george-rr-martin-finished-last-two-books/

[Niamh.]

Was reading some reviews of the episode and this line made me laugh the most :fan:

One consistent truth in Game of Thrones: Jon Snow still knows nothing.

https://ie.ign.com/articles/2019/05/14/game-of-thrones-s8-ep-5-review

[Niamh.]

GRRM already dismissed that rumour about the books being finished :(

https://www.digitalspy.com/tv/ustv/a27454564/game-of-thrones-george-rr-martin-finished-last-two-books/

waaa

[Vicky.]

I agree - doing something over the top and "power mad" (like burning the Red Keep after the bells had rung) wouldn't have been out of character.

That wouldn't have been power mad as such, that would have been the move that made sense I think. Even after the surrender.

Ugh I was actually shouting at the TV while she floated around on Drogon winding her way up all the streets leaving them in flames...like playing snake slowly on her way to Cersei while roasting kids. Like..just fly direct to her, blast her and be done with it. Easy enough to do, surely :laugh:

[Vicky.]

GRRM already dismissed that rumour about the books being finished :(

https://www.digitalspy.com/tv/ustv/a27454564/game-of-thrones-george-rr-martin-finished-last-two-books/

Well...he would say that.

Hes hardly going to admit to sitting on the finished books because of a contract (or other reason). There would be outrage!

[user104658]

GRRM already dismissed that rumour about the books being finished :(

https://www.digitalspy.com/tv/ustv/a27454564/game-of-thrones-george-rr-martin-finished-last-two-books/

Sounds like exactly what someone who had finished the books would say :suspect:

[user104658]

...like playing snake slowly on her way to Cersei while roasting kids.

:joker: I saw someone on Twitter describe it as "Firey Pacman" :hehe:

https://media3.giphy.com/media/cyMqOH8rjgDHG/giphy.gif

[Niamh.]

So, eventhough I did find the character progression a bit unbelievable, I have to say that I do also I agree with this reviewer (on the positives of the episode)

While "The Long Night" showed us an army that was outgunned and outnumbered, but one that had nevertheless chosen to fight, the true horror of "The Bells" was that these casualties were innocent civilians - people who have no role to play in the game of thrones, and probably don't give a damn who's wearing the crown as long as they can still feed their family and keep a roof over their heads. It's the most realistic depiction of war the show has ever given us, seeming to purposefully evoke some of the horrifying images we've seen in the Middle East and even closer to home in recent years - with bloodied civilians covered in ash, desperately searching for loved ones.

Whether you agree with some of the characters' choices or not, the destruction of King's Landing gets to the heart of what George R. R. Martin seemed to be exploring when he began writing A Song of Ice and Fire - that even if you win a war, you still lose, and that those who suffer most are usually the ones who have the least power. If Game of Thrones leaves us with that nihilistic (but ultimately honest) message in the finale, it won't have all been for naught, even if the events of this penultimate episode seem to guarantee that the final installment will be a divisive one.

https://ie.ign.com/articles/2019/05/14/game-of-thrones-s8-ep-5-review

[user104658]

So, eventhough I did find the character progression a bit unbelievable, I have to say that I do also I agree with this reviewer (on the positives of the episode)

While "The Long Night" showed us an army that was outgunned and outnumbered, but one that had nevertheless chosen to fight, the true horror of "The Bells" was that these casualties were innocent civilians - people who have no role to play in the game of thrones, and probably don't give a damn who's wearing the crown as long as they can still feed their family and keep a roof over their heads. It's the most realistic depiction of war the show has ever given us, seeming to purposefully evoke some of the horrifying images we've seen in the Middle East and even closer to home in recent years - with bloodied civilians covered in ash, desperately searching for loved ones.

Whether you agree with some of the characters' choices or not, the destruction of King's Landing gets to the heart of what George R. R. Martin seemed to be exploring when he began writing A Song of Ice and Fire - that even if you win a war, you still lose, and that those who suffer most are usually the ones who have the least power. If Game of Thrones leaves us with that nihilistic (but ultimately honest) message in the finale, it won't have all been for naught, even if the events of this penultimate episode seem to guarantee that the final installment will be a divisive one.

https://ie.ign.com/articles/2019/05/14/game-of-thrones-s8-ep-5-review

Well yes his message all along has essentially been about power always ultimately leading to corruption; or making those who don't want it miserable (Robert Baratheon by the time of the story, Tommen, Jon Snow...). Then you had the likes of Joffrey, Cersei, Ramsay Bolton... and Daenerys has always been on the path to having the most power, and being someone who wants it.

It makes narrative sense but only if it had been a several season progression. She's shown empathy for her friends and allies and the innocent FAR too recently for it to be believable that she's now torching cities. And again even compared to modern war... the issue is the insane intent of it. If they had made it clear that the King's Landing armies were simply "mixed in" with the civilians and she was just ignoring the presence of those people to burn the army out, with heaps of collateral damage due to her careless rage, that would be one thing... but she was going up and down the streets PURPOSEFULLY burning non-combatants and that's a whole other thing :think:. Even in the horrendous bombings in the Middle East etc. the images we see are of people who have tragically been caught in the crossfire of military targets. Dropping bombs on civilians on purpose would be an absolutely massive breach of international law. She's effectively a terrorist at this point.

[Niamh.]

Fair points :laugh: It is just such a u turn in such a short space of time, from breaker of chains to burner of brains

[Scarlett.]

Well yes his message all along has essentially been about power always ultimately leading to corruption; or making those who don't want it miserable (Robert Baratheon by the time of the story, Tommen, Jon Snow...). Then you had the likes of Joffrey, Cersei, Ramsay Bolton... and Daenerys has always been on the path to having the most power, and being someone who wants it.

It makes narrative sense but only if it had been a several season progression. She's shown empathy for her friends and allies and the innocent FAR too recently for it to be believable that she's now torching cities. And again even compared to modern war... the issue is the insane intent of it. If they had made it clear that the King's Landing armies were simply "mixed in" with the civilians and she was just ignoring the presence of those people to burn the army out, with heaps of collateral damage due to her careless rage, that would be one thing... but she was going up and down the streets PURPOSEFULLY burning non-combatants and that's a whole other thing :think:. Even in the horrendous bombings in the Middle East etc. the images we see are of people who have tragically been caught in the crossfire of military targets. Dropping bombs on civilians on purpose would be an absolutely massive breach of international law. She's effectively a terrorist at this point.

The best comparison is if America nuked a third city after Japan surrendered in WWII

[user104658]

The best comparison is if America nuked a third city after Japan surrendered in WWII

What makes it even more hard to believe though is that it's not even a snap decision like dropping a nuke. You could see a commander in a blind rage being like "**** it, drop the bomb!" and that's why Dany charging the Red Keep and destroying it in minutes after the surrender would have made SOME sense. It's a sort of "seeing red" blind rage that can and does happen in "normal psychology" - crimes of passion, etc... someone killing a loved one in a frenzy and then immediately thinking "oh **** what have I done" but the thing is, rage like that only lasts a few minutes, long enough for a few out-of-character destructive acts before snapping back to reality and being horrified. That would have worked.

But the burning of Kings Landing... it would take a lot longer than that! It's not realistic rage. To be realistic she would have burned the soldiers then a few streets of the civilian population before starting to come out of the haze and look around at the carnage and stop, and be horrified with what she had done, even if she then tried to justify it afterwards.

It's the systematic "up and down the streets for hours" that doesn't make sense as an act of rage. It's too... orderly... and determined.

[user104658]

So yeah I've decided that what would have made most sense would be her charging directly for the keep - maybe zig-zagging and burning the city at random along the way, destroying the keep and then flying away. You could still have had the carnage in the streets with the soldiers (lead by Grey Worm) due to the surrender being violated, and a lot more civilians killed as a result of that, without Drogon Pacman.

[bots]

i wanted to stop, but Drogon didn't let me

[Niamh.]

So is there going to be a throne to sit on by the end do we think? And if so who will sit there? Surely Sansa is the only decent option at this point.

[The Slim Reaper]

So is there going to be a throne to sit on by the end do we think? And if so who will sit there? Surely Sansa is the only decent option at this point.

Gendry is actually the rightful heir at this point.

[Ramsay]

Gendry is actually the rightful heir at this point.

Ahh! I was the only one who voted for Gendry in the other thread! It's coming home boys!

[Niamh.]

Gendry is actually the rightful heir at this point.

Ahh! I was the only one who voted for Gendry in the other thread! It's coming home boys!

Jon is I thought, since the Targaryens took it back from the Baratheons

[The Slim Reaper]

Jon is I thought, since the Targaryens took it back from the Baratheons

Well yeah, but before last episode it was Gendry. There are only 2 Targaryens left in the world and no way do they both live past the finale. No way Jon sits on the throne - he'd rather pet Ghost before he becomes King, and we all know that's not going to happen.

After the accidental burning to death of hundreds of thousands of innocents, then probably leaving a Targaryen on the throne wouldn't be the right thing to do.

Wouldn't be surprised to see them give the power back to the kingdoms, which would probably please everyone.

[Niamh.]

Well yeah, but before last episode it was Gendry. There are only 2 Targaryens left in the world and no way do they both live past the finale. No way Jon sits on the throne - he'd rather pet Ghost before he becomes King, and we all know that's not going to happen.

After the accidental burning to death of hundreds of thousands of innocents, then probably leaving a Targaryen on the throne wouldn't be the right thing to do.

Wouldn't be surprised to see them give the power back to the kingdoms, which would probably please everyone.

Is there even any head of houses left in the kingdoms bar Sansa and Gendry? Oh actually Tryion is now head of Casterly Rock isn't he? :think:

That might be good, a council of all kingdoms, we'd have

Sansa
Tyrion
Gendry
Jon Arryn
Yara

and two more? maybe the kid who was supposed to marry Cerseis daughter?

[Vicky.]

Huge huge spoiler. Have read leaks in my annoyance.

So, annoyed by how s8 has been so far..I read a couple of spoilers. Seems, the bookies were right, Bran is going to be on the throne :suspect: So clearly the reason the odds were so ridiculous was because cast/crew were putting on large bets. Odds closed now that the leaks are out properly

And of course, Tyrion dies :bored: Was obviously coming, but the dragon pit trial sounds, again, a crap way to go.

Happy with Sansa ruling the North, but was obviously going to be that way.

Had read a sort of leak that said Jon kills Dany and takes the black. But...what the **** is the nightwatch for now? Theres no wall, and no whitewalkers so no need for it to exist at all :suspect: Bad ending for him, but killing Dany, well I always thought one would kill the other.

So sounds like I will be raging again next week too

[The Slim Reaper]

Is there even any head of houses left in the kingdoms bar Sansa and Gendry? Oh actually Tryion is now head of Casterly Rock isn't he? :think:

That might be good, a council of all kingdoms, we'd have

Sansa
Tyrion
Gendry
Jon Arryn
Yara

and two more? maybe the kid who was supposed to marry Cerseis daughter?

They have mentioned there was a new prince in Dorne, think it was ep 4.

[Mokka]

Ahh! I was the only one who voted for Gendry in the other thread! It's coming home boys!

I've said Gendry and Arya from the start

[user104658]

Is there even any head of houses left in the kingdoms bar Sansa and Gendry? Oh actually Tryion is now head of Casterly Rock isn't he? :think:

That might be good, a council of all kingdoms, we'd have

Sansa
Tyrion
Gendry
Jon Arryn
Yara

and two more? maybe the kid who was supposed to marry Cerseis daughter?

You'd assume the "new Prince" in Dorne, and there only being six kingdoms with the Dragonstone part forgotten about / merged into the other southern kingdoms due to Dany's actions.

[reece(:]

Is there even any head of houses left in the kingdoms bar Sansa and Gendry? Oh actually Tryion is now head of Casterly Rock isn't he? :think:

That might be good, a council of all kingdoms, we'd have

Sansa
Tyrion
Gendry
Jon Arryn
Yara

and two more? maybe the kid who was supposed to marry Cerseis daughter?

Robin Arryn :fan: Jon Arryn died before Episode 1

[Niamh.]

Robin Arryn :fan: Jon Arryn died before Episode 1

oh woops, and Robert Arryn in the books :p

[Vicky.]

https://uk.ign.com/articles/2019/04/15/george-r-r-martin-on-game-of-thrones-bookshow-ending-differences

GRRM says show would need another 5 seasons to be faithful to the books..

If only. Would much have preferred more talking, less action and the story actually told properly, things left to develp at a sensible pace rather than turning Dany into a bipolar psycho overnight :joker:

[Niamh.]

https://uk.ign.com/articles/2019/04/15/george-r-r-martin-on-game-of-thrones-bookshow-ending-differences

GRRM says show would need another 5 seasons to be faithful to the books..

If only. Would much have preferred more talking, less action and the story actually told properly, things left to develp at a sensible pace rather than turning Dany into a bipolar psycho overnight :joker:

Have you read the first comment after that article? ffs.....it's now feminists fault that Season 8 was bad


Its all about the women now and been that way since the books stopped being really used. Feminist were super hyper cause it wasn't going their way and told women to stop watching. Of course they did what their feminist masters said to do, from social media.

Now they got control and women control everything in a world of men. I guess that looks normal to the feminist that ruin everything they touch. Empowered by fiction, the feminist way of life. Boring though and extremely predictable.

[user104658]

https://uk.ign.com/articles/2019/04/15/george-r-r-martin-on-game-of-thrones-bookshow-ending-differences

GRRM says show would need another 5 seasons to be faithful to the books..

If only. Would much have preferred more talking, less action and the story actually told properly, things left to develp at a sensible pace rather than turning Dany into a bipolar psycho overnight :joker:

At least, I'd have thought... the pace has upped dramatically since season 4. I was watching a season 1 episode yesterday and I swear half of the run time of the episode was taken up by TWO face to face conversations... and they didn't even drag... it had my attention the entire time. These days they'd have killed two supporting characters and 10,000 redshirts in that time.

Plus the passing of time is much more realistic; it takes them 3 episodes to travel from Winterfell to King's Landing when Ned Stark and Robert Baratheon etc are travelling there, and there are indications that the journey took weeks (e.g.Joffrey is bitten by Nymeria on the journey, and by ep 3 when Cersei is changing his dressing in KL it's almost healed and he's worrying about the scar). How long did it take Arya and The Hound to ride to KL?? An hour and a half??

[Vicky.]

Have you read the first comment after that article? ffs.....it's now feminists fault that Season 8 was bad


Ahaha hadn't read the comments. Everything bad in the world is the fault of those ****ing feminists. Bitches! :fist:

[Niamh.]

Ahaha hadn't read the comments. Everything bad in the world is the fault of those ****ing feminists. Bitches! :fist:

I mean what he's saying doesn't even make any sense, Dany was planning on getting to Westros from Book 1, Cersei was power mad from Book 1 and Arya was well into her assassin training in the books aswell so I don't know why he thinks the show made all that happen?

[The Slim Reaper]

Finally someone brave enough to step up and hold the feminazi's accountable. Bravo that man.

[Niamh.]

Finally someone brave enough to step up and hold the feminazi's accountable. Bravo that man.

are you saying he's telling the..........................Truth? :o

[bots]

i bet Cersie was delighted with her investment in the gold company. They must have lasted at least 5 seconds

[The Slim Reaper]

i bet Cersie was delighted with her investment in the gold company. They must have lasted at least 5 seconds

It happens to everyone, stop having a go at me. Ohhh, yeah the golden company were trash.

[user104658]

Ahaha hadn't read the comments. Everything bad in the world is the fault of those ****ing feminists. Bitches! :fist:Honestly it's practically the opposite, S8 has been a nightmare for literally every strong female character except Arya!

Sansa has been mostly OK character wise but the "It's OK Hound, I'm actually glad I was raped and abused, it builds character" moment was so badly misjudged :umm2:.

Dany, Cersei and Brienne? All wrecked.

Dany seemed like a powerful woman but no she's just a nutter.

Cersei seemed clever and strong but nah she was just faking it and was scared and out of her depth all along.

Brienne got knighted and then was IMMEDIATELY screwed over by Jaime and left weeping as he rode away.

Feminist? :facepalm:

[Niamh.]

Honestly it's practically the opposite, S8 has been a nightmare for literally every strong female character except Arya!

Sansa has been mostly OK character wise but the "It's OK Hound, I'm actually glad I was raped and abused, it builds character" moment was so badly misjudged :umm2:.

Dany, Cersei and Brienne? All wrecked.

Dany seemed like a powerful woman but no she's just a nutter.

Cersei seemed clever and strong but nah she was just faking it and was scared and out of her depth all along.

Brienne got knighted and then was IMMEDIATELY screwed over by Jaime and left weeping as he rode away.

Feminist? :facepalm:

Yep that's true. Infact the thing that pushed Dany over the edge it seems was Jon rejecting her advances, so classic "hell hath no fury" ****

[Vicky.]

Yep that's true. Infact the thing that pushed Dany over the edge it seems was Jon rejecting her advances, so classic "hell hath no fury" ****

Haha yeah that pissed me off a lot. I mean, the other bad stuff that happened to her might have been a trigger for some degree of a breakdown (still not what happened though, nothing would be an acceptable trigger for that tbh!) but it was made out that it was because Jon rejected her.

Woman desperate for sex with her family member is turned down so goes on murderous rampage. Much feminism!

[Tom4784]

The problem is that the writing tried to tell us that she's mad in previous seasons while doing nothing to actually show us that she was slipping. She's at times rash and brutal against her enemies but she was never one for hurting innocents. She was never shown to be anything other than impetuous at times. It was always characters telling us that she was supposed to be nutty and that's not how you do twists like this one.

It just feels like this whole 'twist' is just a late game way of justifying Jon's ascension to the throne in a way that wasn't meant to annoy fans since we'd lose sympathy and love for Dany but the writing is so **** that no one really buys her heel turn.

[Tom4784]

The story ended at the Battle of Winterfell for me.

Yep that's true. Infact the thing that pushed Dany over the edge it seems was Jon rejecting her advances, so classic "hell hath no fury" ****

Yeah, the female characters have all been tossed aside despite the fact that many of them have carried this series from the start. The disrespect towards the likes of Lena Headey and Emillia Clarke is completely unacceptable. I don't think Emillia is a great actress outside of GOT but she did a wonderful job with the character and now all those years of hardwork have been rendered moot by one badly written twist.

[Niamh.]

The story ended at the Battle of Winterfell for me.



Yeah, the female characters have all been tossed aside despite the fact that many of them have carried this series from the start. The disrespect towards the likes of Lena Headey and Emillia Clarke is completely unacceptable. I don't think Emillia is a great actress outside of GOT but she did a wonderful job with the character and now all those years of hardwork have been rendered moot by one badly written twist.

I'm just waiting for them to ruin Arya next week when she settles down and gets married to Gendry and becomes a proper lady :oh:

How they ruined Brienne aswell pissed me off no end

[bots]

The absolutely worst actor of the lot of them is Jon Snow .... he is completely amateurish, and yet he remains one of the main characters. Emilia, and Lena have been outstanding and an honorable mention to Maisie. When you go back to the first series and see how young she was, she has done an amazing job

[Babayaro.]

I just saw a tweet saying that The Mountain killing Qyburn was a bit like Frankenstein (monster killing creator) or something. Idk how accurate this is as I haven't read/watched frankenstein but yeah it seems like a pretty decent analogy

[Scarlett.]

The way I see things playing out is, whoever stays alive to claim the throne will end the Monarchy, and Westeros will slowly move out of the Feudal era that it has been trapped in since Aegon the Conqueror showed up

[Brother Leon]

I wonder if this is how GRRM had planned it for the book? :think: He could have made her progression into madness more believable I think, it was all too fast in the show, same with Jaimes turn back to the darkside

I would say this is almost certainly GRRM’s end game,It just would have been executed far better.

My prediction for the Book is that: it looks like Aegon(who isn’t even on the show funnily enough) would take the Iron Throne from the Lannisters first and be generally loved by the people. He would become the Targaryen prince that freed the people and everything Dany was hoping to be, but was too slow. So Dany would end up Burning a City that doesn’t want her and killing her own Nephew and rightful heir in order to become The Queen and the Usurper, Kin Slayer etc everything she has hated and wanted to crush.

[Niamh.]

I would say this is almost certainly GRRM’s end game,It just would have been executed far better.

My prediction for the Book is that: it looks like Aegon(who isn’t even on the show funnily enough) would take the Iron Throne from the Lannisters first and be generally loved by the people. He would become the Targaryen prince that freed the people and everything Dany was hoping to be, but was too slow. So Dany would end up Burning a City that doesn’t want her and killing her own Nephew and rightful heir in order to become The Queen and the Usurper, Kin Slayer etc everything she has hated and wanted to crush.

See already that's waaay more hard hitting and much more believable. Maybe you should finish the books for him Leon :laugh:

[Vicky.]

I would say this is almost certainly GRRM’s end game,It just would have been executed far better.

My prediction for the Book is that: it looks like Aegon(who isn’t even on the show funnily enough) would take the Iron Throne from the Lannisters first and be generally loved by the people. He would become the Targaryen prince that freed the people and everything Dany was hoping to be, but was too slow. So Dany would end up Burning a City that doesn’t want her and killing her own Nephew and rightful heir in order to become The Queen and the Usurper, Kin Slayer etc everything she has hated and wanted to crush.

IDK why thats spoilered :suspect:

but in answer to it (so niamh knows its safe to click :laugh: )

That sounds about right. Of course that would make so much more sense. It has never ever made sense to me why they merged Jon with Aegon anyway..such an odd decision

[bots]

qyBPzUe3hNI

[MTVN]

I wonder if Dany knew about Tyrion freeing Jaime and thought he had contrived to get the bells ringing and save Cersei and that's what made her finally snap - the fact another adviser (her most important one) had betrayed her made her decide to go against all the advice she had been taking. Pretty much everyone she formed any emotional connection with has either betrayed her or died and so torching the whole city is the only way to stop that happening again. At this point she's completely desensitised to violence and anyone else's pain

I was mainly disappointed with just how easy it was, not once was she ever under threat or have any moments of danger. Surely someone like Cersei has a back up plan if the weapons get torched.

[Tom4784]

I wonder if Dany knew about Tyrion freeing Jaime and thought he had contrived to get the bells ringing and save Cersei and that's what made her finally snap - the fact another adviser (her most important one) had betrayed her made her decide to go against all the advice she had been taking. Pretty much everyone she formed any emotional connection with has either betrayed her or died and so torching the whole city is the only way to stop that happening again. At this point she's completely desensitised to violence and anyone else's pain

I was mainly disappointed with just how easy it was, not once was she ever under threat or have any moments of danger. Surely someone like Cersei has a back up plan if the weapons get torched.

Dany somehow brought the Dothraki back to life and the fact that she lost so many resources over the course of Season 7 and the battle of Winterfell was ultimately meaningless. It was just terrible writing and the fact they had Cersei do nothing was insulting. This is a woman who will go to extremes few other people would just to survive and, like so many other characters, the writers decided to make her dumb in order to save themselves a bit of bother when it comes to her defeat.

[MTVN]

Yeah I agree, to turn her into purely a spectator with no influence over anything was poor

Who was actually supposed to have rang the bells, just some random Lannisters?

[Brother Leon]

IDK why thats spoilered :suspect:

but in answer to it (so niamh knows its safe to click :laugh: )

That sounds about right. Of course that would make so much more sense. It has never ever made sense to me why they merged Jon with Aegon anyway..such an odd decision

I always try to spoiler book stuff. Especially now as I imagine more people than ever may start reading them :laugh:

But yeah. The show really missed out on Aegon and even Arriane tbh. Aegon especially would have tied in Dorne, the Stormlands and The Reach really well with his conquest. I think they saw how amazing Lena Headey is though and decided to have her on the throne and alive for as long as possible, without risking having to bring in a new actor. Makes sense, but the show has suffered as a result.

[MTVN]

The stupidest Lannister :think:

https://i.imgur.com/8Lmq1Ov_d.jpg?maxwidth=640&shape=thumb&fidelity=medium

[The Slim Reaper]

They've butchered Jaime.

The guy who sold his honour to protect the citizens of KL from being burned by the mad king, then turns around in the last episode and said he never really cared for them, when discussing it with Tyrion.

[Scarlett.]

They've butchered Jaime.

The guy who sold his honour to protect the citizens of KL from being burned by the mad king, then turns around in the last episode and said he never really cared for them, when discussing it with Tyrion.

Just because he said it, doesn't mean that its true. There's not much Jaime could have done to save King's Landing either way.

[user104658]

Dany somehow brought the Dothraki back to life and the fact that she lost so many resources over the course of Season 7 and the battle of Winterfell was ultimately meaningless. It was just terrible writing and the fact they had Cersei do nothing was insulting. This is a woman who will go to extremes few other people would just to survive and, like so many other characters, the writers decided to make her dumb in order to save themselves a bit of bother when it comes to her defeat.

To be fair, she has hundreds of thousands (or more? millions?) of Dothraki under her Khalasar, but only brought a fraction of them over to Westeros. I also don't think she even brought them all North to Winterfell... there are clearly far fewer riders in the initial charge against the dead than there were in the attack on the Highgarden caravan :think:.

Where the poor writing comes in is that A) None of this was made explicitly clear and B) Holding back some of her forces for the upcoming war, whilst in hindsight the right choice, is another dick move :umm2:.

Then again considering the recent "fast travel upgrades" in GoT, she might just have popped back across the ocean and collected some more Dothraki from the Khalasar :hehe:.

[user104658]

Also... say what you will about S8 but... this is easily in competition for the best piece of TV soundtrack in history, surely...

k1frgt0D_f4

From 4.40 is spectacular :worry:

[The Slim Reaper]

Just because he said it, doesn't mean that its true. There's not much Jaime could have done to save King's Landing either way.

You've missed the point; this is his final farewell with Tyrion and they both know it, especially as Tyrion is committing treason to release him whilst already being on his final warning. There is no need for JL to start BS'ing, especially when TL is baring his soul about how much JL meant to him growing up. It just doesn't make sense to share your assumption. It's not even about JL being able to save KL, the fact that he says he doesn't care is the big issue, when we saw how he acted in the bath with Brienne when talking about it.

[Scarlett.]

You've missed the point; this is his final farewell with Tyrion. They both know it, especially as Tyrion is committing treason to release him whilst already being on his final warning. There is no need for JL to start BS'ing, especially when TL is baring his soul about how much JL meant to him growing up. It just doesn't make sense to share your assumption. It's not even about JL being able to save KL, the fact that he says he doesn't care is the big issue, when we saw how he acted in the bath with Brienne when talking about it.

To be fair on Jaime, he saved the city and what did they do for him in return, the looked down on him, called him the Kingslayer, took every opportunity they could. So when it came to a choice of escaping with Cersei and starting a new life, or saving the city again, of course he is going to choose Cersei, he's always put her above everything else. He was a redeemed in many ways, but his abusive relationship with Cersei was his main flaw. People don't get redemption arcs in real life, Jaime's story was supposed to reflect that.

I don't think Jaime didn't care about the city at all, it's just it didn't feel important to him any longer, and to be fair on him, he had no idea of the slaughter that was about to be commited, no one did.

[MTVN]

To be fair on Jaime, he saved the city and what did they do for him in return, the looked down on him, called him the Kingslayer, took every opportunity they could. So when it came to a choice of escaping with Cersei and starting a new life, or saving the city again, of course he is going to choose Cersei, he's always put her above everything else. He was a redeemed in many ways, but his abusive relationship with Cersei was his main flaw. People don't get redemption arcs in real life, Jaime's story was supposed to reflect that.

I don't think Jaime didn't care about the city at all, it's just it didn't feel important to him any longer, and to be fair on him, he had no idea of the slaughter that was about to be commited, no one did.

I do get that but what I struggle with is how Cersei had literally paid someone to kill him only a short time ago.. that's an awfully big thing for him to just forgive and sacrifice everything to save her. Would have been better if Bron was only supposed to kill Tyrion

[Niamh.]

I do get that but what I struggle with is how Cersei had literally paid someone to kill him only a short time ago.. that's an awfully big thing for him to just forgive and sacrifice everything to save her. Would have been better if Bron was only supposed to kill Tyrion

Exactly.

The whole thing was weird and didn't fit at all with his turn around towards Cersei since literally Season 2, almost every interaction him and Cersei have had since Catlyn freed him to save Arya and Sansa was hostile

[The Slim Reaper]

To be fair on Jaime, he saved the city and what did they do for him in return, the looked down on him, called him the Kingslayer, took every opportunity they could. So when it came to a choice of escaping with Cersei and starting a new life, or saving the city again, of course he is going to choose Cersei, he's always put her above everything else. He was a redeemed in many ways, but his abusive relationship with Cersei was his main flaw. People don't get redemption arcs in real life, Jaime's story was supposed to reflect that.

I don't think Jaime didn't care about the city at all, it's just it didn't feel important to him any longer, and to be fair on him, he had no idea of the slaughter that was about to be commited, no one did.

Again, that is irrelevant. It's not about whether he made an attempt to save the people, or was aware of what was about to happen, it's the fact he risked it all to save the people when he was at his most arrogant and at the height of his powers, as described in the bath scene, but now he just dismisses them and doesn't care.

Of course he only wanted to get to Cersei, but his attitude in the Tyrion scene bears no resemblance to the person he was at his worst, nevermind at his best. There's no way that can be seen as coherent storytelling.

[reece(:]

p/BxdaFElgdJb

[Niamh.]

Again, that is irrelevant. It's not about whether he made an attempt to save the people, or was aware of what was about to happen, it's the fact he risked it all to save the people when he was at his most arrogant and at the height of his powers, as described in the bath scene, but now he just dismisses them and doesn't care.

Of course he only wanted to get to Cersei, but his attitude in the Tyrion scene bears no resemblance to the person he was at his worst, nevermind at his best. There's no way that can be seen as coherent storytelling.

Yep, his attitude change was worse than Danys actually. It was definitely a "shock factor" thing but that doesn't work when it makes no sense and makes the character progression he made the last few years completely pointless

[The Slim Reaper]

p/BxdaFElgdJb

Not bad for looking out of a window.

[The Slim Reaper]

Yep, his attitude change was worse than Danys actually. It was definitely a "shock factor" thing but that doesn't work when it makes no sense and makes the character progression he made the last few years completely pointless

It's just a shame the way they've rushed these last 2 seasons. I'd have no problem with Jamie turning back to season 1 Jamie, just show us how and why he gets there.

Not only that, but to leave Brienne's last major scene as crying over a dude also cheapens her story too.

[Niamh.]

It's just a shame the way they've rushed these last 2 seasons. I'd have no problem with Jamie turning back to season 1 Jamie, just show us how and why he gets there.

Not only that, but to leave Brienne's last major scene as crying over a dude also cheapens her story too.

Absolutely.

[arista]

p/BxdaFElgdJb


Yes HBO
showing Worldwide
SkyAtlanticHD for us.

A Great Actress.

[Smithy]

http://media.tumblr.com/cfb892495d9ece49bdedfd314eb32ae3/tumblr_inline_mhnoqfBTEL1qz4rgp.gif

Me these last two weeks reading some of the stupid posts in here and not being able to say anything

I’m honestly so so so disappointed with how this show has turned out, like, I cannot fault the visuals the score or the acting (Emilia this season in particular has been INCREDIBLE) but the writing is just diabolical. These past two episodes in particular have just thrown out years of character development, lore and common sense out of the window, it just beggars belief and I cant understand how anyone can be happy with where the show is at this point.

Episode 4 was just.. dumb, there’s no other words... you have Brienne being reduced to some crying wench over Jamie Lannister. JAMIE deciding to back to Cersei despite the fact he’s JUST had a conversation with Bronn where he tells him he’s been hired to kill him, undoes 6 years of character development of him becoming a decent human being. Sansa being the daughter of “the most honorable man in Westeros” managing to keep a secret that her dad did for 18 years for all of ten minutes, still trying to sabotage Daenerys after she sacrificed half her damn armies for her, acting like a spoilt BRAT. Arya saying we’re family to Jon in one scene and then saying she’ll never return to the North again in another, which is it bitch?! Jon saying he can’t lie he has to be honorable when he managed to lie constantly when he was beyond the wall with wildlings in earlier seasons, apparently his honor is only important when it’s relevant for the story? Daenerys ENTIRE army NOT noticing Eurons fleet because they “FORGOT ABOUT IT” despite the fact they had talked about it in HER PREVIOUS SCENE. Rhaegal dying?! When that dragon is the smartest bitch in the whole of the seven kingdoms, got his ass out of there when the night king was throwing spears and during the long night, no WAY would he have just gone down like that. Not to MENTION the fact that in the books it literally says only ONCE has ever taken a dragon down with a scorpion the 500 years that they were in Westeros, and that was because they got a shot to the eye. Like...

http://i65.tinypic.com/73nh36.png

And captain ****ing Pugwash does it with ease?! It’s just insulting to the viewers and the book readers, ESPECIALLY to then have Drogon turn around and become a weapon of mass destruction when they need him to be one during the battle in ep 5 where nobody can land a single hit? AND THEN ****ing Cersei having her main enemy at her gates and not firing on her? Or her dragon which is within range, or her brother who she had just hired somebody to kill, like??? HELLO??? MAKE IT MAKE SENSE!!! What I think would have been better would have been to have Missandei hung from the front of Kings Landing for her Danys army (Grey Worm) to see, in a taunting manner, when they arrived for the battle, would have at least fueled grey worms reluctance to finish the battle when her death would have been so fresh.

Anyway OBVIOUSLY it ALL comes down to Daenerys arc in the show and despite people saying its been hinted at!! Mad Queen!! It just.. it hasn’t :joker: the creators of the show themselves have said countless times (especially in respect of the times people say she’s hinted at being mad) that she isn’t

http://i68.tinypic.com/wlzmee.jpg

I know I wouldn’t even be annoyed at her being “mad” had it been well written, but to go from risking her life for people she doesn’t know or who don’t like her to burning innocent civilians OVER BELLS just makes NO sense. The fact we don’t even see her face AFTER she decides to burn the city honestly only adds to that, the creators had no idea what they’re doing, would she be laughing maniacally (no, that’s not her) would she be crying (no because she’d stop) would she look angry? (Well why not just attack cersei?). Even GRIEF would be more understandable, if Rhaegal had survived until this episode and was then killed (I think Dezzy said that) it would have been justified (if the civilians had been involved in wheeling out some kind of mobile scorpion AFTER the bells had rung) but it just wasn’t and the whole well Targaryens are either side of the coin blah blah blah, her father was mad, but he literally heard voices in his head, he thought that if he bathed in wildfire he would turn into a dragon that’s not Dany in the slightest :umm2:

People defending the writing or Dany going mad are just.. wrong there’s nothing more too it. Fleshed out and well written over two or three season it could have been excellent, but it wasn’t, and that’s reflected in the critical ratings, the last two episodes are two of the three worst rated episodes of the season and I haven’t see a single article praising it for being well thought out or written.

For the finale I guess we all know Daenerys is going to die, there’s no chance she’ll live, I’m guessing either Arya or Jon will kill her, possibly Dany kills Arya so Jon kills her, or Dany kills Jon so Arya kills her and then Sansa takes the throne. Either way it’s been an appalling ending to one of the greatest tv shows ever made :bawling:

[Niamh.]

Can't argue with any of those points really Smithy

[Smithy]

:flutter:

[reece(:]

Preach it louder for the chicks at the back!

https://i.imgur.com/CnHsOhn.gif

[Niamh.]

I just hope GRRM finishes the books so we can get a proper ending - not likely I know

[Smithy]

I just hope GRRM finishes the books so we can get a proper ending - not likely I know

In 2011 he had 400 pages because he pushed some chapters from DWD to WOW and 8 years later it’s still not finished... :skull:

I think/Hope WoW will come next year but I highly doubt he’ll finish ADoS :(

[Brother Leon]

I fully agree on the writing this season. Although, Dany going mad is not a bad decision, hell it will most likely happen in the books too. It’s just been executed so poorly. Even if it has been hinted at, just 2 episodes ago, she was fighting the undead and was a hero. It’s so rushed.

Honestly, the show should have stretched longer and showed her mental decline without Jorah . GRRM said the show needs about 10 season to be done justice and HBO were happy to do so. D&D wanted it done now though and it’s a real shame.

[DouglasS]

Dany was always going mad get over it. Yes it was rushed, it’s not just Dany going mad that’s been rushed it’s everyones story arcs.

[Smithy]

I fully agree on the writing this season. Although, Dany going mad is not a bad decision, hell it will most likely happen in the books too. It’s just been executed so poorly. Even if it has been hinted at, just 2 episodes ago, she was fighting the undead and was a hero. It’s so rushed.

Honestly, the show should have stretched longer and showed her mental decline without Jorah . GRRM said the show needs about 10 season to be done justice and HBO were happy to do so. D&D wanted it done now though and it’s a real shame.

It probably will, but at least it’ll be well written and fleshed our unlike what happened in the show, which wasn’t even madness it was a reaction from grief :laugh:

D&D should have dropped out and let someone else take over, they’ve completely ****ed the show over just because they started getting big money offers from other studios :bored:

[Daniel.]

Dany was always going mad get over it. Yes it was rushed, it’s not just Dany going mad that’s been rushed it’s everyones story arcs.

.

[Epic.]

Dany was always going mad get over it. Yes it was rushed, it’s not just Dany going mad that’s been rushed it’s everyones story arcs.

So because everyone is rushed asf that somehow excuses it?

[reece(:]

So because everyone is rushed asf that somehow excuses it?

Makes it much much worse

https://i.imgur.com/pOLKuKF.gif